Move the pump or move the return line? Replace in freezing weather?

[mrlovt]

It's time to replace the deteriorating and getting louder by the day single speed pump. It is currently plumbed with the return line tucked nearly against the pump housing. The Superflow VS that is replacing it is too wide for that arrangement by about 4 inches or so.






Two options I'm looking at are:

1. Shorten the long horizontal run that contains the chlorine generator. This would add a couple of 45s to the vertical.
2. 45 out from the skimmer & main drain valve. Doing this, I could simplify the series of 3 90s in the vertical run coming down into the pump, I could reduce it to 1 90.

Is there any advantage to either approach? Is there something else I should be considering?

Also, we have at least a week ahead with temps dropping into the teens at night. I hope the current pump lasts until the weather warms up, but if it goes out completely, what happens if I replace the pump and don't wait 24 hours before starting up the system? My concern is that the PVC glue won't have adequate time to set.

 

[HermanTX]

Have you considered coming horizontally out further from the filter (don't trun 90 deg down as it is now) and then route back to the existing return line? This would totally remove the plumbing next to the existing (and new) pump. By moving horizontally outward (at that 24-30 inch height) you can decide to put SWCG on that section or go back to ground level and put it there. heading back to the return line.

I only waited 1 hr after plumbing my new plumb before I started it but I was in warmer weather than your freezing temps. Others may have better suggestions.

 

[mrlovt]

Well, it just died. Looks like I'll be doing this sooner than later.

So moving horizontally out further from the filter sounds like my option #2 above. That would result in a 45 at the valve on the suction side. Is there any disadvantage to this?

I didn't think about putting the SWCG before the pump. Is there an advantage to that?

One more pic of the whole thing:

 

[HermanTX]

This picture provides a better view of your return pipes. The SWCG must be after the Filter (or Heater if you had that).

I interpreted your Option 2 was moving pipes on the suction side, but it is best to have a straight line to your pump suction inlet from the valve that controls suction for either skimmer or main drain.

I now have a better view of your pipes coming from the filter. See the attached. The GREEN piping is from the Multiport valve to the return going into the ground. I elevated it so it would not go by the pump. Not sure if there is room between the existing pipe and the filter on that same plane. The ORANGE is SWCG.

What is that pipe that goes from the valve prior to the Multiport valve. It looks like a leaf filter is used. Is it a cleaner line? That can probably be moved to make room for the SWCG return plumbing.

 

[mrlovt]

Oh, that works! I may have to dig to get a clean cut of the return line after the 90, but that's no problem. Yes, that's an unused cleaner line. I had it blown out, but it's filled up again.

Do you think that series of 90s between the pump and the multiport valve is a problem? (I mean, it's worked 30 years that way...)

Thank you - that's good info! SWCG after the filter. Straight line from suction valve to pump inlet. Move the cleaner line if it's in the way.

 

[HermanTX]

Here's another idea if you do not want that cleaner line. You can turn it into another return to your pool - at least it will be kept clean with chlorinated water. Just tee it into your line after the SWCG. You could even put a valve on it to turn it off and only open it occasionally to keep it clean I updated the picture and grayed out the old pipework.

Remember you have to have room for both your SWCG and flow switch. So you can adjust where that old cleaner line tees into the main return line. I gave you 2 options - you can either intersect the horizontal line (green) or intersect the vertical return line (purple). The red valve allows you to open or close the cleaner line. When open it is just another return to the pool - you only need 1 valve and I prefer the placement nearer the ground on the cleaner line or on the purple line if you go that option.

If you do that, then you can remove that valve and leaf filter at the top that feeds to the existing cleaner line. That will allow you to redo the plumbing from the pump outlet to the multiport valve and most likely be able to remove at least 1 90 deg and make it a cleaner set up.

I updated the picture. Sorry for my sloppy artistic work. You may be able to push the filter a little to the left once you disconnect the return and inlet lines to the multiport valve. That may give you some room to come straight up the outlet of the pump and then turn to go to the Multiport inlet.

Also suggest you use a set of unions on each side of the pump. Most pumps have threaded connections so the union will be threaded one side to go into the pump and a slip joint on other side to plumb PVC. The union would make it easy to remove the pump in the future or if you winterize and want to move the pump inside.

Suggest you dry fit it all before you glue to ensure of your measurements.

 

[1poolman1]

The flow switch can be installed anywhere after the filter. If you can, get a good "blue" PVC cement. They are a little more expensive but will set very quickly. If you use grey (I advise against that) you likely will have problems in the winter. I've seen fittings blow apart 3 days after a repair (done by others) in the winter.

 

[mrlovt]

Time will tell - I used the red all-purpose. In my haste I installed the T with the hayward flow switch upside down. Is that going to be a problem?

 

[1poolman1]

I've never seen a flow switch installed inverted, so can't tell you. If it causes a problem, the tee that it is installed into can be replaced with a
2x2x1/2 tee. Lowes carries them. If you just installed it facing the wrong direction, turn it 180 degrees. You may have to unthread it and add some Teflon tape to seal.

 

[mrlovt]

Quick update: the flow sensor works fine upside down. I will no doubt eventually change it because it will eventually leak, but right now it's fine.

The plumbing is holding pressure just fine. No leaks 3 days in. That was Oatey all-purpose (red can) glue and primer applied generously and per instructions, though in 20F-30F weather and similar temps every day afterwards. I let it set covered with a tarp several days before starting things up, just in case.

The pump: Oh my goodness! The difference between my old single speed and this VS is night and day. It is quieter by far, even at max speed. The other pump may have been bringing in air, because there were always air bubbles churning with the water in the filter basket. The new pump, at first I thought I must have lost prime, because I couldn't see any water in the filter basket, just some debris against one side. Nope! That was a tank full of clear water I was looking through, no bubbles! Absolutely fantastic.

Thank you all for your help. I'll post a pic when I get a dry day.

 

[newdude]

The difference between my old single speed and this VS is night and day

With the shutdowns, my realtor wasn't allowed to show my house when we were selling so I did the showings. I'd hang out back and give them space to look/talk and then they'd come out to the pool to go over any questions. We'd all be leaning on the pool fence chit chatting and I'd point out the returns flowing.

'Hear anything ? No ? Turn around cuz the pump is 10ft behind you. You have NO idea how much you'll like the quiet pump. Here's the real time digital readout pulling 120 Watts. Don't worry about the costs to run it because it's the same as two 60 watt light bulbs and you'll never notice it on the bill.'

The peace and quiet is worth every penny of the upgrade. The pay for itself thing is just icing on the cake.

 

[ajw22]

Quick update: the flow sensor works fine upside down. I will no doubt eventually change it because it will eventually leak, but right now it's fine.

The upside down flow switch may fail closed rather than open. That can be a safety hazard. While you have it upside down you should regularly turn off your pump and confirm that your flow switch turns off the SWG. If the flow switch fails closed you will not know it has failed otherwise.

 

[mrlovt]

Thanks, Allen - that's good to know. OK, I'll check it. I assumed it was an electronic sensor like a MAF in a car. Is it mechanical? Looks like I'll be changing out that fitting after all...

 

[ajw22]

Flow switches are mechanical. The flow presses a flexible reed against another piece that closes the circuit.

If the spring does not hold it open when the flow is off and gravity pulls it down it will fail open. You want gravity to hold it open, not closed.

 

[mrlovt]

Flow switches are mechanical. The flow presses a flexible reed against another piece that closes the circuit.

If the spring does not hold it open when the flow is off and gravity pulls it down it will fail open. You want gravity to hold it open, not closed.


View attachment 389849

Thanks, Allen - that's awesome. I'll cut it out and install it upright. It works fine now, but better safe than sorry.