Make hollow throat in concrete pool with Arcorplan 2000 lining ?

[ViennaTom]

Hello Poolies !

I think it might be a good idea to have a hollow throat (hope it is the right expression) at the base plate. I was thinking about 10cm (4") diameter made of "hollow throat concrete" and plastered together with the wands.
This shall reduce dirt in the corners, ease cleaning and maybe even doing the lining will be easier then (I will try to DIY) ?

Any suggestions welcome !

 

[kimkats]

a hollow throat

at the base plate.

See if you can use different terms to explain what you mean..........................base plate=?

plastered together with the wands.

Not sure what this means as well.

 

[ViennaTom]

Sorry i meant chamfered or filleted edges on the inner side of the pool where the wands stand on the base.
With plastering i mean finishing the raw concrete walls - maybe it is called roughcast ?

Sorry for not knowing the right terms !

 

[kimkats]

Looking at your signature I see you building a pool DIY. You are planning on having concrete as the walls and bottom then putting Arcorplan 2000 on top of the concrete. (I looked up the Arcorplan 200 and that stuff is neat!)

So your question is "Would it be helpful to have a slight curve instead of a 90 degree angle where the wall meets the floor" correct?

I think it could be nice to have a curve for the very reasons you state-cleaning and such. BUT you will have to make a jig of some sort to make sure the curve is VERY consistent for the Arcorplan.

Are you planning on doing the Arcorplan on your own? It looks like they have some very special equipment to do it. If you are planning on hiring it out then I would ask the installers what THIER thoughts are.

Do you have the design on paper yet? I would love to see it!

 

[ViennaTom]

Yes it is DIY but I had two helpers when filling the concrete for the base and the walls and will need more help when preparing the shell for the surrounding gutter. The water is collected by three 160mm pipes leading to the surge tank one comes from the middle of the right side (outside the picture), the others from inside the pump-room to the surge tank.
I have bought a regulated heating gun, a teflon roller and a copper roller and hope I manage to do it by myself - with help of course as the liner is quite heavy.
What will make the job a little easier is that I have only flat surfaces as the benches and steps will be bolted into the concrete after the liner is in place. To do this I have placed V2A-steel parts inside the concrete walls where the steps and benches will be screwed into. Three of them were misaligned and I will be fixed when it is warmer (see picture upper left).
Most complicated steps to come will be shelling the gutter as this has to become exactly horizontal +/- 2mm, only 4cm thick at the inner side and still firm. So I will place a metal-mesh inside and maybe also add glass fibres and epoxy to the concrete. On the upper inner side of the gutter I will have to fix the plastic coated metal strips - they usually use hammer-in dowels but I will place regular dowels into the shell so they are already inside the concrete and I need not stress the construction.
Sorry for my poor English - I hope all is understandable ;-)
Attached an actual picture not really inviting to swim



The access to the 'pump-house' and massage pump are a little outside as a cover is planned later and I want to have access even when closed. The cover is supposed to slide over the pumphouse and will itself be covered when opened.

 

[ViennaTom]

"drawing" of how I want to build the gutters around. At the ends of the gutters I use T-pieces (as in picture) and L-pieces at the corners and a T-piece in the middle on the other side.
The thin metal mesh shall stiffen the final 4cm concrete rand (together with resin additives) and the dowels are already in place to later screw the plastic plated alu profile as I don't dare to use hammer-in dowels.
I will drill through the alu profile when preparing the wooden shell so that the positions will exactly match the positions of the dowels.
The "constructions" seen in the picture basically holds the 1/2 plastic pipe in place when the concrete is filled. I plan to fill at the outside and inside at the same time (inside with 'better' concrete) so that the gutter is made of "one piece". At the outside the final level is not so important as tiles will be placed around the pool covering also the gutter. Every 2 meters ore so the tile will be removeable to access the gutter (don't know yet how I will accomplish that, maybe using screws ).

 

[ViennaTom]

"Would it be helpful to have a slight curve instead of a 90 degree angle where the wall meets the floor" correct?

Yes I was thinking this might ease cleaning both manually as well as by a pool robot. I will have a 2% gradient towards the outlet both the long and the narrow side to ease cleaning already but having round edges might also be a good idea and might event ease doing the lining in the corners.

 

[kimkats]

the benches and steps will be bolted into the concrete after the liner is in place.

Well that is different! What will they be made of? and why are you doing it that way? I would think it would be easier to just build them in.

Where will the equipment be?

I do worry about the walls being able to withstand the pressure from the water once the pool gets filled.

The curve (is called cove in above ground pools) cannot hurt anything and can only help in the areas you suggest.

 

[ViennaTom]

Well the steps and benches are supposed to look like on the picture below. Usually they are sold with metal pools where the steps are welded to the skin but I think my construction should also be fine. The parts in the concrete are 10mm thick so will be the counterpart on the steps with V2A frames and 2cm stones as steps each step will be screwed to the pool with 18mm screws. The two benches will look similar to the 3rd picture but the steps will be in the middle of the pool opposite to the massage with a wider platform in the middle and steps going down to the left and right. The platform is about 90x60cm so I use a third mounting some inches below it to have a diagonal bracing supporting it. This way the steps will look the way i like (free hanging) and the lining ease done easier as I do not have to cover the steps as in a standard design.
What equipment do you mean ? The pumps and chemistry will all be located in the 'pump-house' only the 4kW massage pump will have its separated small room and will get it's own VFD-controller and magnetic control switches underneath the tiles.
The walls of the pool are 25cm concrete walls with two 10mm irons running around in every row (height 25cm) and vertical irons every 50cm. This would be even strong enough for an overground pool i guess ;-)
And additionally (yet for another purpose) there are four 'outtriggers' on every side of the pool which will further strengthen the construction. These shall support the surrounding concrete platform around the pool and will later also support the pool cover which will be about 400 to 600kg in weight in 4 elements each about 2,5m long and ~5m wide. I want to use 3mm FSG glass rather than acyrilc material to be more durable and better looking but this won't be done this year.

 

[ViennaTom]

Just calculated the weight of the 1" tiles for the steps - 9kg for each step, 26kg for the platform, 21kg for each bench. The V2A frames where the tiles will be laid into will be made of 10mm flange side and 4mm V2A steel i guess but I will have them done as welding is not my main skill ;-)

 

[kimkats]

Talk to me about your "surge tank" as I don't understand it's purpose or what will go in it.

How will you drain the pump housing area of water? You do not want your pump to have any chance of sitting in water.

I love your idea for the benches and steps. One thing to worry about is making sure there is not chance of anyone becoming entrapped under them. Also think about the "points" of the edges. Sure don't want anyone to bump in to them and getting hurt. (Yeah I am a worry wort.)

Kim

 

[ViennaTom]

Hi Kim,
Well it is an overflow pool so when we jump into the pool or it is raining the water will be collected in the surge tank. I will run two independent pumps to circulate the water either from the base outlet or the surge tank depending on water levels and temperature. On hot days the water in the surge tank is supposed to be warmer (as it is coming from the surface) so it is better to circulate from there - opposite on cooler days it might be better to circulate from ground. In the pump house there is a sump from where the unwanted water will drain unforced to small creek (connection yet to be digged). I plan to measure the exact level and history in the tank to figure out if a raise is caused by rain (slow and continuous) or pool activity to change parameters of circulation which will be done by my DIY poolcontroller I hope ;-)
For the steps you are right, diving under them might be a little risky but that's life ;-) and the edges will be rounded as far as possible.
Tom

 

[kimkats]

Sure sounds like you have thought about things quite a bit! Well done!

What will the steps and bench be made of?

 

[ViennaTom]

Well still many things only exist in my imagination by now ;-)
I plan to make the steps with a thick flat flange about 300x60x8-10mm with an L shaped frame welded on it. Opposite to the drawing the frame will sit a little further down app. at the height of the screws so force will 'tear' at the screws (with less leverage). The metal will be V2A (maybe or not powder coated for optical reasons) and the tiles laid into the frame will be the same style as the pool surrounding tiles.
Guess that will look nice.

Edit: The nut inside the concrete is drawn incorrectly. It is encapsulated so water can't enter through the thread into the concrete !
The actual parts look like that: