Installing sun sail post in concrete

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maile

maile

Member
Jun 25, 2024
12
Albuquerque
Pool Size
15250
Surface
Fiberglass
Hi there - I'm Maile and I'm new to TFP. After MUCH research, I have decided to finally install some sunsails over my pool so I don't have to swim in 99 degree water... I purchased a 10' pole with a 7.8" diameter base to be installed in the concrete around the pool. Does anyone know how far from the edge of the pool (and how far from the concrete joints) that this should be placed? We get some massive winds (which is why I decided to go the concrete route) and I REALLY don't want the wind pushing the pole over and taking out a chunk of my concrete holding my fiberglass pool in.... 😬😬😬
 
PoolGate said:
Yep. Around here that's the frost layer and building code. But that will also be under a lot of stress and needs to be deep. How deep were you thinking of putting it?
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well - the concrete is already there so I was going to mount the base - purchased this pole.
 

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Hmmm I'm not a structural engineer so I don't know the load that'll take in high winds. Instead of being deep it's on the surface and all the forces would be on the screws I guess. For radio antennas they have lots of guy wires. What does the manufacturer of the pole say?
 
It just says that's what the pole is for (hanging sun sails). I guess I assumed it would take the load but I didn't know how far back to set it from the pool edge(or concrete edge if I go on the other side). I've been researching this for weeks! 😩😩😩I thought I finally found a solution!
 
You need to contact the pole manufacture for specific anchor requirements.

You are correct to not place the pole too close to edge of concrete (or joint).

Does the pole manufacturer provide the anchor bolts? What are they? How thick is your concrete?

The failure mode is almost certainly at the base attachment, not the pole itself, despite the fact that the advertisement highlights the pole thickness as being stronger.

Is the pole provided by the sun sail company or are they separate companies?
 
.ben said:
You need to contact the pole manufacture for specific anchor requirements.

You are correct to not place the pole too close to edge of concrete (or joint).

Does the pole manufacturer provide the anchor bolts? What are they? How thick is your concrete?

The failure mode is almost certainly at the base attachment, not the pole itself, despite the fact that the advertisement highlights the pole thickness as being stronger.

Is the pole provided by the sun sail company or are they separate companies?
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They do provide expansion screws for mounting into the concrete, but I might get some heavier duty ones if they seem cheap. I used expansion screws when installing my gazebo into the same concrete and they seem to hold well.

The concrete is 4".

I had heard that about the failure point being the base - it's one of the reasons I chose this particular pole as it has the reinforced steel up each side of the base.

The pole is separate from the sails ( Iam initially installing two separate triangular sails - one side to the side of the house and the other side of both to this pole).

Do you know how far away from the edge of the concrete is safe? My prefence is to install it on the concrete closer to the pool because then I would only need to use the pole height of 6.6 feet (vs 10 feet if I use the concrete further away so people don't walk into the ties). Either way, it will be close to the edge of the concrete. I am hoping I can get away with 1 to 1.5 feet away?
 
I can get absolutely hellacious winds here. When I was looking at shade sail mounting poles, my plan was to bury it deep in the ground. There is no way I would trust 4" screws in concrete. That is just asking for trouble. I wasn't going to mount it in my pool deck.
 

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It's probably too late now, but I'd want to make the mount for the posts separate from any decking around the pool. It really needs to have its own footing with embedded attachment rods buried below the frost line or to whatever depth local building codes dictate.

That sail can catch a lot of wind, which is transferred down the poles to the base.
 
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I tried shade sails several years ago for the same reason - to try and keep water temps below 90°. Didn’t work for me. I had overlapping sails going from end to end of my pool and almost the full width. What I discovered was that due to the angle of the sun, the pool was rarely fully shaded and almost always less than 50%. Unless you get the sails very close to the surface of your pool, you may have the same issue.

Do you have a way to secure shade sails temporarily? Before investing in a permanent installation, I’d try testing first. Of course, if you are also wanting the shade sails for shading the decking or for aesthetic reasons, that’s a little different, but you may still want to test them out first. You can get relatively inexpensive sails online. I used parachute cord and turnbuckles to secure mine to trees that surround my pool. The challenge was constantly taking them down if it got too windy for fear of snapping a tree.

I ended up with a Glacier chiller, which works beautifully. My pool water is in the upper 70s in the morning and doesn’t get above 83° even with ambient temps over 100°. I would expect that it would work even better in your less humid environment. Probably about the same cost as a professionally installed sail shade solution. And I don’t have to worry about high winds, which would be a concern regardless of how they’re anchored. Just a thought.

Good luck with whatever you do! I can relate to having a pool and not wanting to get in it during the hottest part of the summer, which is kinda ironic.
 
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jark87 said:
I tried shade sails several years ago for the same reason - to try and keep water temps below 90°. Didn’t work for me. I had overlapping sails going from end to end of my pool and almost the full width. What I discovered was that due to the angle of the sun, the pool was rarely fully shaded and almost always less than 50%. Unless you get the sails very close to the surface of your pool, you may have the same issue.

Do you have a way to secure shade sails temporarily? Before investing in a permanent installation, I’d try testing first. Of course, if you are also wanting the shade sails for shading the decking or for aesthetic reasons, that’s a little different, but you may still want to test them out first. You can get relatively inexpensive sails online. I used parachute cord and turnbuckles to secure mine to trees that surround my pool. The challenge was constantly taking them down if it got too windy for fear of snapping a tree.

I ended up with a Glacier chiller, which works beautifully. My pool water is in the upper 70s in the morning and doesn’t get above 83° even with ambient temps over 100°. I would expect that it would work even better in your less humid environment. Probably about the same cost as a professionally installed sail shade solution. And I don’t have to worry about high winds, which would be a concern regardless of how they’re anchored. Just a thought.

Good luck with whatever you do! I can relate to having a pool and not wanting to get in it during the hottest part of the summer, which is kinda ironic.
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thank you - good idea!
 
ttroglio said:
It's probably too late now, but I'd want to make the mount for the posts separate from any decking around the pool. It really needs to have its own footing with embedded attachment rods buried below the frost line or to whatever depth local building codes dictate.

That sail can catch a lot of wind, which is transferred down the poles to the base.
Click to expand...
Thank you - I think this is the route I. will go. I was trying to take the easier route, but I dont want to risk cracking my pool deck.
 
PoolGate said:
I can get absolutely hellacious winds here. When I was looking at shade sail mounting poles, my plan was to bury it deep in the ground. There is no way I would trust 4" screws in concrete. That is just asking for trouble. I wasn't going to mount it in my pool deck.
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Thank you - we get hurricaine strength winds here too. I mounted a permanent gazebo structure into the concrete using the red dogs into the pool deck concrete, but it's much further away from the pool, and there are four posts to spread the torque over - I still get freaked out when we get massive storms, but it's held up well with no cracking. This is why I was thinking about mounting into the pool deck for the sails, but being so close to the pool, I am rethinking. I think I will purchase a rebar cage for this pole and dig down as suggested.
 
Cantilever Umbrella - not recommending this one in particular, but have had great success with these in the past. They're mobile and can be set up in different spots depending on time of year and time of day. My little one is now a sun goddess so we don't use anymore, but I had it set up to significantly shade the pool during the heat of a summer day and it worked well. I think mine was only a 10' umbrella, but they make them where they rotate and adjust depending on your needed. Mine even had solar LED lights that were nice while they worked :)
 
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jtpipkin said:
Cantilever Umbrella - not recommending this one in particular, but have had great success with these in the past. They're mobile and can be set up in different spots depending on time of year and time of day. My little one is now a sun goddess so we don't use anymore, but I had it set up to significantly shade the pool during the heat of a summer day and it worked well. I think mine was only a 10' umbrella, but they make them where they rotate and adjust depending on your needed. Mine even had solar LED lights that were nice while they worked :)
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Hi - thank you - we actually have a cantilever, but I'm wanting something a bit more semi-permanent to leave up so the pool is shaded even when I'm not out there to help keep water temp down. I do love my cantilever though!! It shades the table thats not under the gazebo :)
 
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hexabc said:
Another idea… Like sails on a boat, you could rig your shades in a similar way to allow for taking the shades down (before a storm) or putting them in flapping (in strong winds). I don’t know how difficult that would be…
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I will probably try to add in some sort of quick release for that reason. I will update on here once my project is finished.
 

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