Initial Pentair pump settings for our pool with spa, infinity edge, waterfall, and cleaner...and understanding labels in ScreenLogic app.

[ebot]

Oh, why's that? Does lavender syrup raise pH or something? It's cheaper than these reagents I can telll you that!
Poking around this forum I found a 2017 post from you, Dirk, where it appears YOU were the noob. Although I'm clearly worse, you were pretty bad back then LOL. Is all this helping struggling DIY pool owners on TFP just volunteer work for you???

GAME PLAN:
So, while we learn about/get estimates on hopefully adding a softener system at the auto-fill, my understanding is I should be trying to get pH and TA both down
Poolstored 10/24 reply said: "To lower TA, when you lower pH, lower it to 7.4. Then let it rise to 8.0. Repeat until TA is 60-80. Over time, with muriatic additions, TA will come down. When TA is 60-80, your pH should be fairly stable 7.8-8.0...stop lowering it to 7.4 and only lower to 7.8 when it gets to 8.0. Should be more stable".

	My latest levels	Pool school lowest acceptable (to work around high CH	Pool School ideal levels (plaster, SWG)	COMMENT
pH	7.5	7.2	pH 7.6-7.8	Plan to aim for 7.4
TA	90	50	TA 60-80	Plan to aim for 65-70
CH	825	250 (N/A for me!)	CH 350-550	CH is our problem area. But TFP does comment you can manage CH up to 1200 by tinkering with other CSI variables.
CYA	25	60	CYA 70-80	Learning how to raise CYA. Looks like if i could get it from 25 to 70, that alone gets CSI down about 0.1.
Temp (70-72 lately)	72	NA	NA	It should just get colder here, so maybe temp will get down ~10 degrees, which should get me down about -0.1 on CSI just with mother nature.
Salt	3340
CSI	0.14	-0.1 to -0.3 (Dirk)..best range to avoid CH damage in my case	-0.3 to 0.3	Did someone else comment -0.3 to -0.6 is best when dealing with high CH? Can't find it. Anyway Dirk's in CA and -0.1 to -0.3 seems to keep his SWG happy.

Anyway, to buy time to consider the softener vs refill with city tap, and meanwhile trying to keep the pool happy despite CH 825, if I could get pH to 7.2, TA 50, CYA 60, then CSI would be -0.54. Pretty much the lowest I could possibly get it...likely too low.
I'm thinking better goals would be pH 7.4, TA 70, CYA 60. That CSI would be -0.16.

So I'll keep at it with the MA trying to shimmy down both pH and TA over the next week or so.

CYA RABBIT HOLE:
NOTE: Since temp is likely to trend down I'm going to aim for just lowest acceptable here = 60
Raising CYA is a new one for me. I guess I'll go with granular anhydrous using the "sock on a stick" method...I noticed that one initially tripped you up back in the day, Dirk. Did that spot ever fade away? This economical way sounds good. The water in bucket method seems a little easier / less likely to screw-it-up method to me.
Does this product look ok? Seems like a decent deal and we're partial to Amazon because we finally got prime this year.
If so, it says 1lb raises CYA 10ppm per 10k gallons. I need to raise ours about 35ppm and the pool's 36k gallons, so i'd want to put about 12.6 lbs of this in there, right? (3.5x3.6=12.6)
I'll triple check that we're at 25 now, run all the pumps, put about 6.3 lbs in very slowly, keep pumps running like 48 hours, then recheck and see if it's rising as expcted...should be around 37 by then. If all's well, I'll add the other 6.3 lbs in the same way.
Sound good?

Oh, btw I realized that loop in the ceiling goes off our attic. I probably should've mentioned our house is 2 story and it seems the plumbing branches off somewhere near the master bedroom on the 2nd floor. More photos.

 

[Dirk]

Oh, why's that? Does lavender syrup raise pH or something? It's cheaper than these reagents I can telll you that!
Poking around this forum I found a 2017 post from you, Dirk, where it appears YOU were the noob. Although I'm clearly worse, you were pretty bad back then LOL. Is all this helping struggling DIY pool owners on TFP just volunteer work for you???

Yep! 2017 was when I found myself with a pool and no pool guy. So I searched, stumbled onto to TFP, and been here ever since. I had never had a pool before, and my OCD needed to know everything, and so I tortured my mentor pretty good (it's Marty, and he's helping you now)! And he's still helping me to this day.

Like all TFP staff, I am a volunteer. We all are. We found such great value here, from the knowledge we all gained, that tossing them a few bills didn't seem payment enough. So we stick around and pay it forward. Maybe you will, too.

Speaking of which, if you're finding you're getting good value from TFP, please consider joining as a supporter.

 

[Dirk]

So, while we learn about/get estimates on hopefully adding a softener system at the auto-fill, my understanding is I should be trying to get pH and TA both down
Poolstored 10/24 reply said: "To lower TA, when you lower pH, lower it to 7.4. Then let it rise to 8.0. Repeat until TA is 60-80. Over time, with muriatic additions, TA will come down. When TA is 60-80, your pH should be fairly stable 7.8-8.0...stop lowering it to 7.4 and only lower to 7.8 when it gets to 8.0. Should be more stable".

Excellent advice.

NOTE: Since temp is likely to trend down I'm going to aim for just lowest acceptable here = 60
Raising CYA is a new one for me. I guess I'll go with granular anhydrous using the "sock on a stick" method...I noticed that one initially tripped you up back in the day, Dirk. Did that spot ever fade away? This economical way sounds good. The water in bucket method seems a little easier / less likely to screw-it-up method to me.
Does this product look ok? Seems like a decent deal and we're partial to Amazon because we finally got prime this year.
If so, it says 1lb raises CYA 10ppm per 10k gallons. I need to raise ours about 35ppm and the pool's 36k gallons, so i'd want to put about 12.6 lbs of this in there, right? (3.5x3.6=12.6)

DO NOT USE LIQUID CYA! That product you linked looks good, it's 100%CYA, as long as it's granules.

I put mine in a sock and suspend the sock in the skimmer well (by trapping it with the lid), so that it doesn't lay on the bottom of the basket. I come back every 15-30 minutes and knead the sock until it's all dissolved. I continue to run the pump non-stop for at least three days. Many people use other methods, this is my preferred way, and I consider it to be the safest way. I'll never introduce CYA of any kind directly into the pool again, and no, the CYA stain never went away. If I can't get it all to dissolve, I'll just leave the sock suspended in the skimmer well for a day or two. I actually use a delicates laundry bag from Walmart, with a zipper, because I can see through it to observe the CYA. Something like this, with the finest mesh they have:

Robot or human?

But...

Does your pool get below 52°? You might consider not adding CYA until the Spring, because if your pool gets cold enough, the SWG will turn itself off, and you'll be running a "liquid chlorine" pool all winter, which has a lower CYA target level.

More importantly, if you're going to exchange water, don't add CYA until you do, because you'll just be dumping the CYA you just added!

Anyway, to buy time to consider the softener vs refill with city tap, and meanwhile trying to keep the pool happy despite CH 825, if I could get pH to 7.2, TA 50, CYA 60, then CSI would be -0.54. Pretty much the lowest I could possibly get it...likely too low.
I'm thinking better goals would be pH 7.4, TA 70, CYA 60. That CSI would be -0.16.

I like plan B, or a hybrid between A and B. Shoot for CSI of -0.3 to 0.0, and make your pH level to achieve that. If that means a pH of 7.2, that'll pop back up pretty quick, so you'll be adding muriatic a lot. And that will bring TA down without you having to do anything else. When the water gets cold, and the SWG stops, you'll find your pH stabilize a bit just from those conditions.

Don't obsess over TA. I did, and that's what I was driving Marty crazy with. He said leave it alone, and it'll come down on its own. I ignored that advice, battled TA with muriatic and sprayers to agitate the water, etc, etc. I finally had to give up, and leave it alone, and guess what... it came down on its own, just like Marty said it would.

Anyway Dirk's in CA and -0.1 to -0.3 seems to keep his SWG happy.

Yes, do that. Not below -0.3.

CH is our problem area. But TFP does comment you can manage CH up to 1200 by tinkering with other CSI variables.

You can, but like I said previously, I prefer to keep all levels as close to TFP midway points as much as possible.

Learning how to raise CYA. Looks like if i could get it from 25 to 70, that alone gets CSI down about 0.1.

As I said, you might consider waiting until the Spring, and for sure after you exchange water, before dealing with CYA. Personally, I would get the softener installed, then exchange water using soft water from the softener. It'll take several regeneration cycles. I'll walk you through how to do it if you want to try it. Then add the CYA after that.

I think that covers everything. Let me know if I missed one of your questions.

 

[Jimrahbe]

ebot,

Did you see my return PM (Conversation)???

Thanks,

Jim R.