HELP! Builder's "startup" was a CYA dump!

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delrayser

0
Jul 16, 2018
52
Austin, Tx
We finished filling our new pool this morning, the PB was just out to do his "startup" procedure. He got the pump going, dumped a bunch of muriatic acid (maybe 2 gallons?) in front of a return, and then proceeded to empty an ENTIRE 9 lb tub of stabilizer into the skimmer! Before I could run outside and do anything, it had been sucked into the system. He told me "that's standard startup, nine pounds of stabilizer."

By my math, that much stabilizer is going to put my pool at about 80 ppm CYA once it all dissolves. Is there anything I can do at this point? Can I backwash my filter to get some of it out?
 
Re: HELP! Builder's "startup" was a CYA dump!

Backwash the filter. The majority of it will come out.

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If your pool is 13500 gallons, that is 60 ppm CYA. Not a bad number for Texas.

Get some liquid chlorine in it. Use the [FC/CYA][/FC/CYA]
 
If you act quickly back washing may remove some of the CYA that has not fully dissolved.

You are correct to keep a close eye on the "pool professionals". Carefully evaluate anything that goes into your pool.
 
Re: HELP! Builder's "startup" was a CYA dump!

mknauss said:
Backwash the filter. The majority of it will come out.

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If your pool is 13500 gallons, that is 60 ppm CYA. Not a bad number for Texas.

Get some liquid chlorine in it. Use the [FC/CYA][/FC/CYA]
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The PoolMath calculator shows that 9lbs (144 oz) of stabilizer should raise my 13.5k pool's CYA to 80? Or am I doing something wrong?
 
80ppm CYA is still manageable and, given your location, you’d probably want your CYA on the higher side anyway. Intense UV and heat will eat up chlorine and higher levels of CYA protects against that. If your pool is clean and clear, it will only use 2-4ppm/day of FC regardless of what your CYA levels are. Rain dilution and oxidation losses (yes, CYA does get oxidized slowly by UV & chlorine) will slowly lower the CYA.

There’s no need to drain the pool and/or argue with the PB about it. He holds the warranty card and if you mess with his startup procedure, then you own the liability.
 
JoyfulNoise said:
80ppm CYA is still manageable and, given your location, you’d probably want your CYA on the higher side anyway.
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Maybe I've been reading the forums too dutifully, I was targeting about 50 ppm CYA and you guys had put the fear of God into me about ever going higher than that. But if you think 80ppm isn't going to be the end of the world, I'll just let it go rather than fool with trying to figure out how to backwash on my first day.

JoyfulNoise said:
There’s no need to drain the pool and/or argue with the PB about it. He holds the warranty card and if you mess with his startup procedure, then you own the liability.
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Yeah that was my original thinking as well, but I found the startup procedures for my pebble manufacturer and they're very different than what he did. I thought the warranty on the pebble would be void if he didn't follow what they say to do. But I guess if I let him do it his way, then he'll be on the hook for it if anything goes wrong, even if the pebble company won't honor the warranty.

In any event, he says he won't be out to take care of the pool but once a week, so I'm going to have to be taking things into my own hands in between. I can't imagine a weekly visit is going to keep my FC at safe levels in the Texas summer sun.
 
delrayser said:
Maybe I've been reading the forums too dutifully, I was targeting about 50 ppm CYA and you guys had put the fear of God into me about ever going higher than that....
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Yeah, it’s not the end of the world. People that have problems with high CYA have those problems because they have been following bad advice for years and years. If you start off the right way, and understand what you’re doing, then there’s nothing to fear from using CYA. Honestly, far too much overwrought emotions surround it - it’s a chemical, it has it’s uses and it can be managed. I say leave the hysterics at the door, no need for it.


delrayser said:
Yeah that was my original thinking as well, but I found the startup procedures for my pebble manufacturer and they're very different than what he did. I thought the warranty on the pebble would be void if he didn't follow what they say to do. But I guess if I let him do it his way, then he'll be on the hook for it if anything goes wrong, even if the pebble company won't honor the warranty.

In any event, he says he won't be out to take care of the pool but once a week, so I'm going to have to be taking things into my own hands in between. I can't imagine a weekly visit is going to keep my FC at safe levels in the Texas summer sun.
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The PB owns the startup and any liability caused by him not following the manufacturers procedure. Most of the plaster material manufacturers warranty their materials, not the installation. The PB and/or plaster subcontractor used is the one that owns the warranty for the installation. SO if there was ever an issue, then it goes something like this -

Plaster manufacturer sends someone out to verify correct materials were used and that they are as expected. Plaster manufacturer tells PB that it’s the installers fault and that their warranty covers the fix. Plaster contractor comes out and inspects pool and thinks, “What nonsense excuse can I make up to weasel out of this??”....plasterer tells PB that he installed everything correctly so it’s not his fault. PB and plasterer decide to blame the pool owner citing “water chemistry imbalance”. Pool owner states that he/she has been following all recommended levels and using liquid chlorine as their sanitizer....PB says, “AH HA!!! Don’t you know bleach has “solids” in it that will wreck your pool?!?!?!?! You should have only been using the trichlor pucks I left you and following pool store advice!! Liquid chlorine is only for shocking!!!” OR homeowner says we installed an SWG to which the PB/Plasterer says, “AH HA!!!! Dang saltwater pools!!! Don’t you know salt water is corrosive!?!?!?! Look at the ocean!! Everything near the ocean rusts!!!!”. So, the order of blame is as follows -

First - Pool owner negligence
Second - PB started the pool wrong
Third - Plasterer did a substandard installation job
Fourth - Plaster manufacturer supplied bad materials

Rarely do warranty claims ever get beyond the first item....
 
Re: HELP! Builder's "startup" was a CYA dump!

delrayser said:
The PoolMath calculator shows that 9lbs (144 oz) of stabilizer should raise my 13.5k pool's CYA to 80? Or am I doing something wrong?
Click to expand...

You did it right! I went too fast!!

I agree with Matt, even 80 ppm is no big deal. You will lose some over the next couple months anyway. Just keep you FC in the target range.
 
Okay, you guys have successfully talked me down from the ledge! I'll leave everything as-is and do a test tonight to see where I stand. I've already got bleach for daily maintenance of my FC in between weekly visits from the PB (I assume he'll just throw some trichlor in the feeder, ugh).

How long do you think it will take for all that stabilizer -- which I'm sure is just hanging out in my filter at the moment -- to dissolve? Trying to figure out when I should do my first CYA test.
 
If your CYA is 80 or so, do not let the PB use trichlor. If they insist, take it out and let it dry. Put in a plastic bag to be used later (vacation, etc).

I would test the CYA in about a week. But assume the 80 ppm is in the pool for FC purposes.
 

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mknauss said:
If your CYA is 80 or so, do not let the PB use trichlor. If they insist, take it out and let it dry. Put in a plastic bag to be used later (vacation, etc).

I would test the CYA in about a week. But assume the 80 ppm is in the pool for FC purposes.
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Thanks! Good idea to just proceed on the assumption of 80 ppm. I think I'm just gonna let him throw the pucks in the skimmer and then remove once he leaves.

Will do a full battery of tests (minus CYA) tonight and post results. Thanks again!
 
Your 80 CYA is in there. PLEASE do not let anyone add anymore. Calculating the dosage is normally more accurate than the test. Like mknauss says, test it in about a few days or so and you should get 80 ppm.

Once more, DO NOT let anyone put in pucks, tabs, powder ANYTHING if possible.

Do you have your own test kit? (K-2006C or TF-100)
 
Winnie-the-Pool said:
Did he leave you a brush/broom as you expected? If not you need to get one, brushing starts tomorrow.
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Yep, we're all set. Right now the chore is keeping the kids from jumping in, the other thing the PB added was two gallons of muriatic acid. I assume to get the TA down from 175 to something closer to the 80 that is recommended for the pebble start-up. Of course, that cratered my pH so I've got the waterfall and air jets going full blast to try and aerate and get the pH back up to where I feel comfortable letting them in it.
 
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