Having a pool built and need advice

[voidpointer]

Few things I want to throw in here, somewhat as a general update but also to get some feedback on some concerns I'm nervous about.

Right now I have my own punch list of items I'm trying to get my PB to address prior to plaster. I told him I'm not dropping him another penny until 100% of my list is done. I'm trying to use the rest of the money I owe him as leverage to get what I need. Otherwise, I feel like after plaster I will probably never see the guy again. He's been the worst kind of shady car salesman you can imagine. Over sell and under deliver.

Two concerns worry me right now.

1. Irrigation rezone and repair. I was expecting him to hire an actual irrigation company, but instead he's using the same crew that seems to be a "jack of all trades". They did the grading, trash cleanup, building fence, moving trees, etc stuff that needed to be done around the yard. PB owner is telling me he also does irrigation. So far they've done good work, but I just don't know if I should push harder for a different company for the irrigation.
2. This is a big one. We're supposed to have a slide installed. For months now, the slide has already been ordered and sitting in my back yard. PB owner's superintendents keep quitting his company and I guess someone ordered, what I believe, is the wrong shape slide. Look at the attached pictures to see what I mean. The footers for the slide were poured in the spot that was believed to be where it was going to sit (even though the last superintendent that quit didn't even put it together when he outlined where the footers are to go). The slide doesn't appear to curve as much as its supposed to based on the pool design spec. I'm still waiting to hear back from the PB owner on what he wants to do, but he's already given me the impression he doesn't want the slide back and I'm worried he'll try to force me to take it rather than him eating the cost.

This is what the slide looks like right now, if I were to have it installed:

Here is how it's rendered on the "plans":

Notice how the curve isn't sharp enough? The real issue is that the slide's entry point is right next to the retaining wall and there's no way to walk around the slide. The footer is positioned quite a ways closer to the pool:

Note that they already screwed up the plumbing for the slide. This particular slide has a hole at the base (where the steps are) that the piping goes up into. So they'll already have to pull up some pavers and cut through the footer to re-run the plumbing (that white pipe sticking up is not in the right place).

I hope it's not just me... I'm expecting it to look like the image below (random slide I found on google image search).

Any words of wisdom on this? Especially if it will help find the right slide or ultimately resolve the issue of the slide not fitting the shape of my current decking. I doubt that reshaping the decking is a more cost-effective solution, but I'm open to that too I guess.

 

[ajw22]

Irrigation work is not complex. If they did good work so far you should just do some quality control review over what they do.

I would insist on them exchanging the slide you have for the more curvy one assuming it is available and the curvy one fits into the base anchors they put in.

 

[voidpointer]

My pool is almost at plaster phase and I am spending time reading a ton of stuff to try to educate and prepare myself for pool start up. I want to be able to maintain pool chemicals myself. I'm starting from scratch. I have zero experience with pools and I have no idea what any of these chemicals are.

Here's some pages I've been reading:

• TFPC for Beginners
• Salt - Further Reading
• Swimming Pool Test Kits Compared
• ABC's of Pool Water Chemistry

My pool will have a SWG. Even after reading most of the content in the links above, I'm not sure of a few things:

• What test kit is best to get? There's a few that are recommended, but it's hard for me to make a choice. I don't feel equipped to choose the right one for me. I'd be happy to have someone pick for me. Plus, some of these articles seem a bit old, so I'm not sure if wisdom has changed.
• I'm in the process of emailing my PB in response to what I'm learning as I read. For example, I want to make sure the salt is the right type (solar salt) and that the purity is 99.4% or greater. Right now, I have no idea what they're going to dump in there. My PB really sucks Rear and I don't feel like I can trust them with anything.
• Another thing I'm asking them is how long they wait to do start up after applying plaster. The article I read says 30 days but that seems like a lot. I was hoping to swim sometime in July but if I follow that advice it's going to be august. I'm not sure how long the PB's plaster company recommends waiting.
• How do you use the test kits? They look like they have a million different pieces. Maybe this doesn't matter too much until I figure out which one I'm ordering?
• One of the articles says "The most reliable salt test is the Taylor K-1766 Salt Test. The Speedstir Magnetic Stirrer makes the drop counting testing easier and more precise.". The link to the speedstir is broken, I'm not sure what that is supposed to be. So I guess this means I need a salt test kit as well as the normal test kit like TF-100?

I'm hoping all of this is as simple as: Figure out what test kit(s) I'm getting and learn how to use them. Take measurements and enter them into the PoolMath app. It tells me what I need to do, and I do those things. Pool is happy?

 

[Newdude]

What test kit is best to get?

The TF-100 is about half the price of the K2006C and TF-pro. The TF-100 and TF-Pro have enough supply to get through at least a year of regular testing, probably 2. The K2006C has more of some of the tests but they aren't the ones you'll need frequently so they'll likely go to waste. The TF-Pro and K2006C have really nice cases and are a tie. But the TF-pro includes a $44 stirring device so you aren't mixing by hand all the time.

All 3 kits need a k1766 kit added on the side for $30. The TF-pro*salt comes with the K-1766 kit for $20 more, saving you $10.

The TF-pro salt is the hands down winner IMO for anyone going SWG.

Another great add is the XL kit for any TF kits. It gives you more supply of the FC and CYA tests, which is great for newbs and those with swamps, as both will be testing alot more often and run out of the regular supply with any of the 4 kits. Once you get over the learning curve, or the swamp (2 weeks either way), any kit without the XL is plenty to get by.

 

[duraleigh]

Welcome to the forum

All of the members here started at exactly your level when learning about pools. It is overwhelming but you will be surprised at how quickly you will pick this up if you are eager to learn.

I can start you with this advice.......you seem eager to do your own testing (That exactly how we feel, too.) So I would suggest you purchase the TF-Pro from TFTestkits. The Taylor K-2006C is also a good kit but doesn't have the new SmartStir. Folks are enamored with the Smartstir,

YOu are reading some good articles So add to that read.......... "Pool Care Basics" up in Pool School. It covers a wide variety of topics and can be considered our "primer"

YOu will find this a very helpful place to learn. I can detect your willingness and can promise we will all help out.

 

[voidpointer]

Thank you! So if I go with the TF-Pro salt kit, I should only check the XL option? What about the Salt Test Strips option?

 

[Newdude]

* also, about the testing, it seems like rocket science so let it go until you have a kit. We will have you read the simplest of directions, one line at a time. *fill vial with 10ml of pool water* that simple. And the vial has markings so you know which one is 10ml. Then you add 5 drops of this bottle, or one drop of that bottle. It's all spelled out, line by line and stupid easy when you only read one step at a time.

You tell us the results and we tell you what to enter in poolmath, which does all the calculations for you, and tells you that you need to add 1/2 gallon of bleach, or 5 lbs of baking soda, or whatevs. We will hold your hand and walk you through both the testing and pool math when the time comes.

If we go too deep into it now it will only confuse you further. Rest assured, we got you. We've been here for 15+ years with over 300k members now because both we and the system does wonders.

 

[Newdude]

Thank you! So if I go with the TF-Pro salt kit, I should only check the XL

Salt strips aren't needed for now. Maybe you will feel like you'd like them at refill time, once you've long been a pro at your pool.

The Ph meter is a fun toy for the techie people, but also not needed.

The sample sizes dunks into the vial to only leave 10ml or 25ml left for easy filling, but it's stupid easy to fill a vial to 10ml, so. plus you have to do it over plate if indoors as the pushed out water makes a mess.

You don't need the borates strips either.

A TF-Pro-salt with the XL option will have you all set and we'll do the rest.

 

[voidpointer]

Thanks. I really appreciate how nice and supportive everyone is. I hope you won't have to hold my hand too much. I do like to try to put in my best effort where I can... but I'm sure like most things I'm just over thinking this.

I ordered my test kit and will let you guys know when pool startup has happened. My pool company is the worst so I'm going to try to ignore most of their advice and just learn what I need to do here.

I'm doubtful my PB will wait 30 days after plaster to start up. If they don't, what should be the absolute bare minimum wait time?

 

[Newdude]

I hope you won't have to hold my hand too much. I do like to try to put in my best effort where I can...

It's alot to take in at first. And we were all there and remember how bad it sucked. You're willingness to try is 90% of the battle.

I'm doubtful my PB will wait 30 days after plaster to start up. If they don't, what should be the absolute bare minimum wait time?

This gets tricky as it's usually the PBs responsibility for the first 30 days for warranty purposes. In a perfect world, they maintain it for the first month and it doesn't get too out of hand. Then they add salt on day 30 and hand you the keys.

Some folks have balanced things in between PB visits and when the PB showed up again, they told the PB 'somebody else from your crew must have come yesterday and balanced this all because it looks good to me' (wink wink). We'll see how it goes and go from there.

 

[Jimrahbe]

VP,

If I can do it, you can do it. I am more of an equipment guy, and I can't even spell Khemistry..

Almost everything I have learned about pools has been right here at TFP. We will be glad to ride shotgun, while you come up to speed.

When your Pool builder gives you his version of Pool School, pay close attention when he is talking about how all your equipment works. Just nod and smile when he starts talking about chemistry issues and let everything he says, go in one ear and out the other.

You can do it!

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[SecoSteve]

Thanks. I really appreciate how nice and supportive everyone is. I hope you won't have to hold my hand too much. I do like to try to put in my best effort where I can... but I'm sure like most things I'm just over thinking this.

I ordered my test kit and will let you guys know when pool startup has happened. My pool company is the worst so I'm going to try to ignore most of their advice and just learn what I need to do here.

I'm doubtful my PB will wait 30 days after plaster to start up. If they don't, what should be the absolute bare minimum wait time?

We had our plaster pool done last season and I felt just as lost as you. The members here are the best. They ask nothing in return, except won't give advice without the proper test kit(that you bought). Salt should not be put in for at least 30 days. You'll probably be told to keep your chlorine level around 1ppm for 30 days until the plaster cures. You'll have to brush 2-3 times a day to get the plaster dust into the drain.

You'll want to "follow" the PB instructions, as they are the ones giving the warranty. I would post here what they want you to do and see if the experts agree, before adding anything.

 

[voidpointer]

This gets tricky as it's usually the PBs responsibility for the first 30 days for warranty purposes. In a perfect world, they maintain it for the first month and it doesn't get too out of hand. Then they add salt on day 30 and hand you the keys.

Some folks have balanced things in between PB visits and when the PB showed up again, they told the PB 'somebody else from your crew must have come yesterday and balanced this all because it looks good to me' (wink wink). We'll see how it goes and go from there.

Ah ok, I misunderstood then. I thought 30 days from plaster meant that the pool sits empty for that amount of time. So they do fill it with water after the plaster cures and it just sits with no salt in it for 30 days? So the pool will be usable?

Assuming they do take care of the pool the first 30 days, I'm not sure how they maintain it properly without adding the salt. But I guess the idea here is that I don't have to care until they dump the salt in.

 

[TampaKathy]

You or the PB will maintain the pool with liquid chlorine for the first month...or tabs. You can use the pool during the first month. I think my PB said to wait a week but I'm pretty sure some people jump in the minute it's done filling up! I love the smart stir thing and the sample sizer thingamagig. The instructions are very helpful....should be a laminiated card that comes with your test kit.

 

[TampaKathy]

After the plaster, they might do an acid wash that day or next (I can't remember exactly what you are getting done)...and then they will turn the hose on and stick it in the pool...and then you will have to monitor it...don't turn the water off until 1/2 way up the tile. And if you have a water meter, you'll want to make note of the gallons at the start and end so you know better how many gallons your pool is and not just your PB's best guess

 

[ajw22]

• What test kit is best to get?

Order the TF-Pro Salt with SmartStir

It has everything you need including the salt test and smartstirrer.

• I'm in the process of emailing my PB in response to what I'm learning as I read. For example, I want to make sure the salt is the right type (solar salt) and that the purity is 99.4% or greater. Right now, I have no idea what they're going to dump in there. My PB really sucks Rear and I don't feel like I can trust them with anything.

Your PB will add the right salt. You just don't want Clorox salt ever. Otherwise don't stress over it.

• Another thing I'm asking them is how long they wait to do start up after applying plaster. The article I read says 30 days but that seems like a lot. I was hoping to swim sometime in July but if I follow that advice it's going to be august. I'm not sure how long the PB's plaster company recommends waiting.

No salt in the pool for 30 days and you cannot use your SWG until you have salt.

You chlorinate your pool with liquid chlorine during that time.

You can swim in your new pool the day after it is filled. Unless the PB is doing some type of acid startup. You need to find out from the PB what he will do and what he expects you to do.

Start-up New Plaster

The first few months are the most criticle for a newly plastered pool. We're here to share best practices to ensure the plaster will last for many years.

www.troublefreepool.com

When Should Salt be Added? In our industry, there seems to be some consensus to wait 30 days before adding salt to new plaster pools, yet some say it is okay to add salt within a couple of days of filling the pool. Who is right? This thread describes why it appears that the recommendation to wait 30 days before adding any salt is appropriate for most plaster pools, including quartz and pebble pools.

Why no heater use for first 30 days? With new plaster there is a lot of plaster dust in the water and the pH is usually very high. When you heat water the potential for scale formation in the heater increases significantly. The actual timeframe for waiting to use the heater has no real merit. As long as the plaster dust is under control and the pH is in range there is no reason not to use it. Your risk of rushing to use the heater is scale clogging up the heater coil.

Why no wheeled cleaner for first 30 days? Plaster is sufficiently hard once the pool is full of water. Pool cleaners can be installed and utilized after about two days if there is no plaster dust forming. The reason that tracks develop is usually from plaster dust being "packed down" by the pool cleaner wheels and then not removed by brushing. So it can look like an "indention" (and discolored) but it is not an indention. Brushing afterwards can help prevent the plaster dust from sticking on the plaster.

• How do you use the test kits? They look like they have a million different pieces. Maybe this doesn't matter too much until I figure out which one I'm ordering?

There are YouTube videos to help you as well as all the help here.

If you can cook you can run pool water tests.

• One of the articles says "The most reliable salt test is the Taylor K-1766 Salt Test. The Speedstir Magnetic Stirrer makes the drop counting testing easier and more precise.". The link to the speedstir is broken, I'm not sure what that is supposed to be. So I guess this means I need a salt test kit as well as the normal test kit like TF-100?

Get the kit above and it gets it all for you.

Take measurements and enter them into the PoolMath app. It tells me what I need to do, and I do those things.

Don't become a slave to the robot. PoolMath gives you every general guidelines.

Best thing is to start a thread on your water chemistry once your pool is filled and we will help you with both the testing process and interpreting PoolMath.

 

[Steve-D]

Ah ok, I misunderstood then. I thought 30 days from plaster meant that the pool sits empty for that amount of time. So they do fill it with water after the plaster cures and it just sits with no salt in it for 30 days? So the pool will be usable?

Assuming they do take care of the pool the first 30 days, I'm not sure how they maintain it properly without adding the salt. But I guess the idea here is that I don't have to care until they dump the salt in.

Water needs to be added just after the plastering is done...ideally same day (we just went though this in May). Even if it is written in the specifications try to get a good # for pool volume when it is filled...you will need that when it comes time to tweak your water chemistry balance going forward.

The PB will probably add most of the basic chemicals early on but since you have a SWG that may not include Chlorine or Stabilizer...that will probably be up to you if you want to use the pool for those first 30 days. Check out the "Start up New Plaster" article to get an idea of what will need to be done...depending on your contract with the PB some of that daily maintenance may fall on you. Ask them for a timetable of what they will do and what they will expect you to do for that first 30 days so there are no surprises. Again, check your contract...you may have already paid for a full "white glove" installation where you don't have to lift a finger until the 30 days have passed.

Good luck and try not to feel overwhelmed...it really does get easier as you go along and you have everyone here to help you along.

 

[voidpointer]

After the plaster, they might do an acid wash that day or next (I can't remember exactly what you are getting done)...and then they will turn the hose on and stick it in the pool...and then you will have to monitor it...don't turn the water off until 1/2 way up the tile. And if you have a water meter, you'll want to make note of the gallons at the start and end so you know better how many gallons your pool is and not just your PB's best guess

In my particular pool, they have a Y splitter at my hose bib and an underground PVC running from one end of that to the pool. I know it fills up the pool but I wonder if it automatically turns off when the pool is full enough. I don't know enough about it yet. Maybe it's just a dumb pipe.

 

[voidpointer]

Been pushing on my PB about the slide but we are at about 3-4 weeks away from realizing it doesn't fit and my PB is insisting it's the right slide, even though he admits fault in the way his supers managed everything about it.

On the phone he just tells me about how hard it is to get his suppliers to take the slide back, how they changed management and says they won't take a slide back that's out of the box.

It's really frustrating. I feel like he's BSing me.

 

[ajw22]

Been pushing on my PB about the slide but we are at about 3-4 weeks away from realizing it doesn't fit and my PB is insisting it's the right slide, even though he admits fault in the way his supers managed everything about it.

On the phone he just tells me about how hard it is to get his suppliers to take the slide back, how they changed management and says they won't take a slide back that's out of the box.

It's really frustrating. I feel like he's BSing me.

Depends if you want to stick the problem on your Pool Builder and tell him “It is not my problem, it is yours. Either your supplier eats it, or you eat it, but not me.”