Getting ready to replace the pump...

[MHumphrey]

Hello,

I have a 13,500 gallon pool in central Florida. While we don't actually go swimming year-round, the pool is open all year, and thus the pump runs year-round.

I have the same pump that was here when I bought the house. It's very old, and very loud, and i'm assuming very in-efficient. In fact, the label is worn off, so I don't know the brand. I believe it is 1.5HP. I run it for about 7 hours per day during the day. The filter is relatively new, and is a Hayward Clear Plus C1200 series. For cleaning, I have "The Pool Cleaner" vacuum.

Anyway, because of the noise it makes, and the inefficiency, I've started shopping around for pumps. I'd like to know people's thoughts on the types, brands and models that would work for my situation. Also, i'm fairly handy (though not a licensed contractor, plumber or electrician). Is swapping out the pump something I could do on my own?

Thanks
-Matt

 

[duraleigh]

The trend is towards VS pumps, Matt. I am personally not a big fan simply because of the front money involved. Most systems with VS will not pay back the owner in a reasonable time. That said, they are amazingly versatile and owners swear by them.

2 speed pumps are quite different. Running on low, they save a significant amount of electricity (75%, I believe) and, because of their relative low cost, pay you back sometimes within the first year.

A 1.5 HP 2-speed would be my suggestion.

 

[MHumphrey]

Most systems with VS will not pay back the owner in a reasonable time.

So when the Hayward website calculator says I'm going to save $33 per month, is that bogus? At that rate, the Hayward VS on Amazon for $775 would pay for itself in about 2 years.

I definitely hear what you are saying - the VS pumps are significantly more expensive, and if the savings isn't there, i'm not sure why i would want one. I'd love to hear from someone who has one and what their experience is.

Thanks for your response!
-Matt

 

[borjis]

I was shopping for a 2-speed last year then discovered that some vs pumps are not much more, sometimes.

So you might be able to get a vs for not much more than a 2 speed.

The 2-speed was sold at Lockewell for $ 350 and the vs (V-Green 165) was $ 475 i think. (motors only, not whole pump units mind you)

Turns out my electric bill at the new house is cheap and a seal kit fixed my near new pump motor so I have the same single speed i had last year.

my 2 cents...

 

[xyz]

As Dave says, in a pure money game, the 2 speed wins. I like my VS, and would replace it if it broke. It is kind of like a pickup. You can get a base model with crank windows, and an FM radio. But get one with electric windows? You will never own crank windows again. Best bang for your buck, and if all you are ever going to do is keep things running, it is a great option. So why am I saying you will have to pry my VS out of my cold dead hands?

-optimal power setting for plain filtering
-I can crank up the RPM when the Spa calls for heat, making the heater more efficient.
-If/when I install solar, I can get a sweet spot compromise of flow rate, efficiency, and panel head pressure.
-I can hit a button on my iPhome and all of a sudden I get 3 HP of terrific suction for the bottom vacuum, or just to speed up the mix of MA I just added.
-it is super quiet at slow settings.
-my old pump was so inefficient and loud (like yours) that my payback was 9 months. Could it have been 6 months with a 2 speed yep, maybe better.

So so if you want the cool features, extra flexibility, and may add other features or upgrades, maybe the VS is for you.

If you are going to get your pump fixed and That's it? Two speed is definitely for you.

 

[gary300]

I went from a 2 HP pump running 4 hr/day to a VS pump running 1500 RPM 6 hr/day and have seen around $100 off of my electric bill each month since. I would do it again in a heartbeat.

 

[Jaimslaw]

I too am quite amazed at the reduction in my electric rates with my VS pump. I didn't think I would be hitting that $100 monthly savings mark in electricity; but this month, I got my bill down well below the $200 mark for the first time in 12 years.

Here in So Cal, rates are criminally high...so that accounts for a lot of the very attractive ROI on the $1500 spent on my VS (which is about 16 months). So in 8 more months, payoff occurs and the true savings begins.

You can get a dual speed pump and reap some terrific savings as well. FWIW, I didn't mind trading a little longer payoff period for the flexible rpms/wattage.

 

[GaryT58]

Every situation is different, as in terms of savings, based upon how you plan to run your pump and electric costs. So selecting a 2-speed or VS pump will vary.

In my case, I replaced my 1hp Pentair SuperFlo with the 1.5HP Pentair SuperFlow VS.

Here is link to thread (see 2nd post) that shows a great table that compares cost of ownership for various pumps. You can download the excel spreadsheet from the 3rd posting, with link next to "Pool Pump Tools*". You can edit this worksheet (must enable macros) to change the various things to your case, like electric power cost, run times, product cost, run speeds, ....

There are other spreadsheets included which can provide some great info.

I used the "Energy Cost" sheer to verify in my case that the 5-year cost of ownership of the Pentair SuperFlo VS was much better than a 2-speed pump for how I plan to run (low speed 24/7). Also, with the "Energy Cost" worksheet, you can select the pumps you want to compare by entering the "Pump Model" value for the column and it will fill in the data for the pump from the "PumpData" sheet (where you can get the Pump Model values. I edited sheet with my local power $, run times, rates, current pump costs, and compared the couple models I was looking at (couple VS, one 2-speed) and compared to my original pump. Very helpful in selecting my new pump.

As for power, the 2 speed SuperFlo (SF-N2-1A) uses 1276 W at 3450RPM, and 312W at 1725RPM, so you can see the major power savings. With the VS (342001), if you would use 130W at 1100 RPM, or 95W at 850RPM. So for me, these savings made sense for me to go with the VS.

There are some other advantages to a VS. For example, the Pentair SuperFlo VS you can program up to 3 time/speeds a day. So could come on initially at higher rpm to make sure skimmer pulls off surface debris, then go to lower speed for period to keep water flow (and meet SWG flow if you have one), then at maybe other speed for running vac. Can override these as well at any time. Also, has a "quick clean" button which will run a programmed speed to perform clean cycle, after which it returns to the programmed speed. I've used if I come out and we're going to swim soon and there are a lot of pine needles floating around - goes up to higher speed and sucks them out more quickly than when running at my lower rate. Some (not this one) have a freeze-protect mode, which will run pump when temperature gets near freezing - good for those that leave pool open all year.

Can't really lose with the upgrade to either. Just will say, that if you plan to ever go to a SWG, the VS may be a better choice, as there have been those that could not run their 2 speed at the lower speed when running the SWG because the flow rate was not sufficient. Would not have been an issue for me, but chose VS as I want to run longer (24/7 during peak season - use water jets at night to cool pool for example).

Finally, if you can figure out what the existing pump is, you can possibly select a pump which is "drop in" in terms of plumbing.

Edit - in terms of $$, in peak summer, I run my pump 24/7. With my new VS, this should save me about $80 or so a month (no hard #s yet, as I replaced towards end of summer and still tweaking RPMs.) I love the pump. Allows me to run at low rate during day to keep flow moving, and then if I need to clean surface quickly, I can hit quick-clean to boost speed up - was great when wind was blowing lots of pine needles down. I am very happy with purchase. A 2-speed would have worked as well. Even if I wasn't running 24/7 I would have gone that route as return-on-investment isn't everything- otherwise why own a pool?

 

[flipr]

MH, for me the issue of 2 spd vs VS was due to my solar. Low speed on the 2 spd Pentair WhisperFlo was too low to move water thru the solar heat system, so if we wanted solar heat we needed pump on high speed. The way the electrician wired system, on low speed I didn't have solar or SWG. Basically we had a 2 spd pump that never ran on low speed, so not much benefit for us.

I didn't see solar in your pool details, but its something to consider going forward. I replaced my 2 spd within a year of the pool being built. Didn't know about VS options when working with pool builder. As it turns out the VS2 pump also controls my Solartouch, so when solar turns on, the pump ramps up. I also like 4 hr clean cycle on VS pump, no messing with timers to run cleaner for set time. One-touch button and its done.

 

[borjis]

Another piece of good advice often recommended:

if you do end up buying a vs pump, add an inline surge suppressor.