Family Member Dumped Algeacide instead of Shock in Pool

[reggiehammond]

If you don’t have a Speed Stir, it’s the best $20 you’ll spend on Amazon. Makes drop based testing 100% easier.

 

[mariane]

Thank you, that's exactly what I'm doing. Sometimes I'm just not sure if the extra drop made a change or not. I'm probably just overthinking it.

Yea, probably.
It's like when we first learn something new and we want to do it just right, afraid to mess things up.
It won't make that much difference, being off by 1 or 2 drops when testing for FC.
You'll get this and experience how easy it can be.

I don't want to beat a dead horse but keep an eye on your liner. Very low pH for long periods of time will wrinkle it.
Been there, done that, don't want anyone else to have it happen to them.

 

[Chevydue057]

Yea, probably.
It's like when we first learn something new and we want to do it just right, afraid to mess things up.
It won't make that much difference, being off by 1 or 2 drops when testing for FC.
You'll get this and experience how easy it can be.

I don't want to beat a dead horse but keep an eye on your liner. Very low pH for long periods of time will wrinkle it.
Been there, done that, don't want anyone else to have it happen to them.

Agreed, I'm just trying to be as accurate as I can, so I can get the actual help I need!

You know, my liner does has quite a few wrinkles, but my PH is never low. It's been high a few times, but never low!


After the hurricane rolled through, I had a lot of tree leaves and debris in the pool. We lost power for a while yesterday, so the pump didn't run more than a couple hours yesterday. I cleaned all the Crud out of the pool today, and checked the FC. Down to 16. CC of 1. I'm not overly concerned with that, as I'm assuming all the debris had some organic matter, and there were a ton, and I mean a ton of dead bugs in the pool this morning.

The pool probably gained 2.5 inches of water over the last 2 days. It rained most of today, but after vacuuming all the heavy Crud out, I backwashed the filter (I had to get some water out, it was overflowing out the skimmer) and figured after vacuuming out the storm Crud, it made sense. Pressure was at 18, so it was getting close. Got it back to 14/15psi and added a cup and a half of DE back to keep filtering out the finer stuff.

Anyway, with the below slam FC, I added a full gallon to 12.5% chlorinating liquid, pool math says that should have me back up to 23.

I will report back in the morning. I got a little black oily gunk in the skimmer basket this evening. It collects around the edge, and looks like gasoline floating in water. I used a solo cup to scoop it out, I took photo's and if it comes back I'll post pictures tomorrow.

Here's to hoping I'm still fighting the right battle against Algae!

 

[Chevydue057]

I can't believe it's been a week since I posted. Literally nothing has changed. I've been at a FC of minimum 20. Testing morning, afternoon(on weekends) and at dusk when sun is no longer on the pool.

Combined Chlorine has never been above .5. OCLT is .5Max. I have had a couple of days where I have lost 4ppm of FC due to hot long sunny days (I presume). And I still get small little spots of algae. I think it's algae anyway. It does poof in you brush it. but It vacuums up okay. I'm not using a vacuum head with bristles, just the 2 inch hose attached to a pipe(It sucks up better and has a lot more suction).

If I move the return jet angle., the area of the Algae changes. Is this typically the case?
I've been reading through the forums a lot and can't tell if this is normal or expected. I have brushed 2X a day minimum since the slam, sometimes three. I vacuum, then brush. Filter hasn't shut off except for 2 minutes every other day to clean out the skimmer basket.

I've even put skimmer socks on the skimmer basket to try and catch even more stuff. I add chlorine around the edge of the pool, and some I pour slowly in front of the return jet. Hoping i'll settle down where the algae does.

I'll take some photo's this afternoon, but at a FC of 20 for a week, shouldn't I be seeing results? Unless this isn't ALGAE. I think I mentioned above, its only a couple small circles. sometimes a little bit of a line, and it doesn't really ever get worse, it's either not there when I vacuum, or there's a certain amount. It never grows. And it almost seems like it only sprouts up when I run the filter. But I've cleaned the filter, there are no broken laterals, I did replace the spider gasket this year. And a couple of times, I have poured the chlorinating liquid directly into the skimmer basket (I know it's not great for the pump), just to get a high dose into the sand filter in case there's a small bloom happening in there. At one point, one of the Chlorinating pucks cant out of the floater and was in the skimmer basket until it was 95% dissolved. I have a ton of pucks, and when my CYA was low, it was a good use for them.

I'm beginning to think, this isn't working. Maybe it's not Algae. Is there anything else I can do? Do you guys wants photo's? Should I remove some from the pool, put it into a paper towel to see?

I'm seriously considering dumping a large amount of Shock into the pool to raise the FC to 40 to see if the Algae changes. At this point, what is 2 more gallons. Obviously I won't go in the pool for a few days, but what other choice do I have? Algae can't survive at a FC of 40, right? What about 50?

 

[Newdude]

Have you been verifying you reached target after adding ? Normally we advise to save the reagents because you’re testing/adding so often, but if you suspect something is off, that’s the first thing to check.

 

[Bperry]

If I move the return jet angle., the area of the Algae changes. Is this typically the case?

That sounds more like dirt than algae. Have you tried blocking off the return jet or turning off the pump to see if it still shows up? You may be getting dust sent past the filter.

 

[reggiehammond]

What is your CYA? I skimmed to see if you mentioned it. Please report and how are you testing? What kit?

Doubling FC is not a great idea; can damage equipment, liner, etc.

 

[Chevydue057]

Have you been verifying you reached target after adding ? Normally we advise to save the reagents because you’re testing/adding so often, but if you suspect something is off, that’s the first thing to check.

Yes, I typically add a couple more OZ than Pool Math recommends, and then I let the filter run for 30/45 minutes and check again.

That sounds more like dirt than algae. Have you tried blocking off the return jet or turning off the pump to see if it still shows up? You may be getting dust sent past the filter.

If I block the return jet, with the pump running will that burn out the pump? I have previously tried not running the pump for a couple of days and it doesn't come back. This is why I replaced the spider gasket, besides the handle was hard more difficult to move than it should have been. Unfortunately this didn't change anything. Although the handle is easier to turn when needed, still have the dirt/algae problem. I have added DE to the filter to try and help. I raised the PSI up 1 with DE, maybe I should go more?

What is your CYA? I skimmed to see if you mentioned it. Please report and how are you testing? What kit?

Doubling FC is not a great idea; can damage equipment, liner, etc.

CYA is 35, so I've been using 40 for the FC number. Okay. Thank you. I guess I won't double the FC. But how much higher should I go to see if it's algea?

I just don't know what else to do. It's either not algae, or it's mustard algae, but I've been up around the mustard algae level anyway....Sorry, didn't answer all questions, using the TF-100. I don't like the CYA test. It's between 30 and 40. So I go with 40.

 

[mariane]

Please put in your signature the make and model of your pool.
Is it hardsided? A doughboy? A Bestway? An Esther Williams?
Is it softsided? An Intex? A Coleman?
You get the idea.

You're right. You cannot block a return jet. How many return jets do you have? If you put a sock over the return jet does it collect anything?
Do you take the pool down at the end of the season? Do you leave it up and lower the water levels? This could solve itself for next year if you do.
Did you check the ladder/stairs? Does it have open pockets in it? Do you have weights holding them down? Did you check the weights to make sure there is no algae in them?
Detective work.

 

[Bperry]

Yes, I typically add a couple more OZ than Pool Math recommends, and then I let the filter run for 30/45 minutes and check again.

If I block the return jet, with the pump running will that burn out the pump? I have previously tried not running the pump for a couple of days and it doesn't come back. This is why I replaced the spider gasket, besides the handle was hard more difficult to move than it should have been. Unfortunately this didn't change anything. Although the handle is easier to turn when needed, still have the dirt/algae problem. I have added DE to the filter to try and help. I raised the PSI up 1 with DE, maybe I should go more?

CYA is 35, so I've been using 40 for the FC number. Okay. Thank you. I guess I won't double the FC. But how much higher should I go to see if it's algea?

I just don't know what else to do. It's either not algae, or it's mustard algae, but I've been up around the mustard algae level anyway....Sorry, didn't answer all questions, using the TF-100. I don't like the CYA test. It's between 30 and 40. So I go with 40.

If you have several return jets (I’ve got 5), blocking one won’t hurt anything so if the stuff stops appearing at that jet while it’s blocked, it points to something being shot out of the jet and settling on the floor rather than algae. You could also put a sock over it as mentioned and see if that collects anything. If you only have 1 or 2 jets then collecting it is better than blocking anything. And if the stuff doesn’t appear when the pump is off like you say then that points to dirt making it out of the filter as well.

 

[mariane]

If you have several return jets (I’ve got 5), blocking one won’t hurt anything so if the stuff stops appearing at that jet while it’s blocked, it points to something being shot out of the jet and settling on the floor rather than algae. You could also put a sock over it as mentioned and see if that collects anything. If you only have 1 or 2 jets then collecting it is better than blocking anything. And if the stuff doesn’t appear when the pump is off like you say then that points to dirt making it out of the filter as well.

OP has an above ground pool. Usually vinyl and usually only 1 return. Plugging it would cause a big problem.

 

[Chevydue057]

Please put in your signature the make and model of your pool.
Is it hardsided? A doughboy? A Bestway? An Esther Williams?
Is it softsided? An Intex? A Coleman?
You get the idea.

You're right. You cannot block a return jet. How many return jets do you have? If you put a sock over the return jet does it collect anything?
Do you take the pool down at the end of the season? Do you leave it up and lower the water levels? This could solve itself for next year if you do.
Did you check the ladder/stairs? Does it have open pockets in it? Do you have weights holding them down? Did you check the weights to make sure there is no algae in them?
Detective work.

Honestly, no one has ever asked me the Make/Model of the pool, only how big it is. We had heavy rains last night so I've been vacuuming all the leaves and debris out this afternoon. I see nothing anywhere with an actual name, The seat covers around the outside have a symbol, that I'm having trouble associating with a brand. They are "waves" The two top ones are identical and start at the middle of the emblem and go to the right. The bottom are the opposite, start at the middle and go out to the left. I'll try and upload a photo. The Part number on the logo is T396, and on the seat cover T3887, but I can't even get those to come up in a google search. I will keep looking, and even bring it over to the pool store to match up to another one. EDIT * I found the parts. They are for an Esther Williams Festival Pool*

I do raise and lower water levels during opening and closing. I had a similar problem last year, but the gunk would "poof" significantly more than now. It doesn't now. My FC levels are coming down as I've called it on the slam. Filter is running now after the storm, just to clean up the Crud. But I'll not run the filter maybe tomorrow and Saturday, and see if it returns. Previously its doesn't. Again, this is why I replaced the Spider Gasket. Last year it was pretty compelling to say it was bad, especially where I had water dripping out of the waste nipple when the pump was running.

I have taken all the sand out of the two weighted steps, and bleached the inside, and replaced with new sand. There was no signs of anything, but sand in them. I've moved the stairs and the mat. vacuumed and brushed everyday, even though there was nothing visible except a leaf or two.

The only other thing I can mention, is when I add DE to the skimmer basket, the color of the crud changes. It gets significantly lighter.

I have taken the sand out, and inspected (even with a magnifying glass) The Laterals and the pipe in the filter for cracks, nothing. I've gently twisted the laterals to check them, and nothing to suggest they are broken.

I will admit, I've never had a pool before. And the automatic vacuum will pick up 98% of it if I run it. I try not to leave it in the pool all the time. This year I haven't used it, because the control box needs replacement, the female plug is worn, and I need to drill the rivets out of the box and replace the socket. So I do see if more often this year.


I am very much trying to do the detective work to solve this problem. I am just out of ideas.

 

[mariane]

Thanks for your reply. I know the detective work is hard. And you have checked all kinds of things. Many times algae is in the sand that weighs down the ladder/stairs but you checked it and nothing there. With all this said, Question - no lights or other equipment in the pool? The auto vacuum - no algae?

As a previous poster wrote: is the stuff on the bottom near the return opening? What color is it?
Did you put a sock over the opening and see if anything is collected in it?

EDIT * I found the parts. They are for an Esther Williams Festival Pool*

I am very much trying to do the detective work to solve this problem. I am just out of ideas.

Knowing the pool is hard-sided and you remove some water to winterize helps a lot.
Looks like your filter is 18" with 150# sand. 1hp pump. Pool size ~14,700 gallons. AGP vinyl liner. Skimmer and 1 return. If you put this in your signature, it gives people instant information about your pool and equipment. (I had to search the internet to get this info)

The spider gasket - does it fit tightly in the grooves? Are you always turning the multiport handle in only one direction? (changing directions when turning the multiport handle could cause the spider gasket to become unseated which could allow sand to shoot back into the pool.) Some people glue their spider gasket in place.
In my experience, when sand shot back into the pool, it was obvious it was sand.

 

[Orion7319]

I get a lot of dirt and leaves in my pool and occasionally algae. Mustard algae will grow on the sides of the pool and not just the bottom. Leaves can break down very quickly and look like what mustard algae is said to look like and goes “poof” when you touch it. So does dirt. I have a ton of trees and have a hard time keeping stuff out. I also get a lot of dirt in the pool when I cut the grass. If you can’t run your robot, that’s a problem. The dirt always accumulates in the groves on my stairs from my returns.

 

[Chevydue057]

Thanks for your reply. I know the detective work is hard. And you have checked all kinds of things. Many times algae is in the sand that weighs down the ladder/stairs but you checked it and nothing there. With all this said, Question - no lights or other equipment in the pool? The auto vacuum - no algae?

As a previous poster wrote: is the stuff on the bottom near the return opening? What color is it?
Did you put a sock over the opening and see if anything is collected in it?

Knowing the pool is hard-sided and you remove some water to winterize helps a lot.
Looks like your filter is 18" with 150# sand. 1hp pump. Pool size ~14,700 gallons. AGP vinyl liner. Skimmer and 1 return. If you put this in your signature, it gives people instant information about your pool and equipment. (I had to search the internet to get this info)

The spider gasket - does it fit tightly in the grooves? Are you always turning the multiport handle in only one direction? (changing directions when turning the multiport handle could cause the spider gasket to become unseated which could allow sand to shoot back into the pool.) Some people glue their spider gasket in place.
In my experience, when sand shot back into the pool, it was obvious it was sand.

There are no lights or other equipment to remove. I've even removed the protective mat that the stairs sit on. I leave the vacuum line, vac plate, and the pole in the water so it is in there while the chlorine and pump circulate. Just in case.

Okay, I'll change my signature, you're right, the size and weight is probably more helpful than model numbers. Thanks!

The spider gasket did fit tightly. I don't typically only move the handle in a singe direction, actually I probably try and change it up each time. I don't believe it is sand, certainly not sand from the filter. It's the wrong color.

I will say, I added probably 20oz more of DE today to the filter, just to see if it would help. Pressure is up 19 psi, which is right about where I would backwash, but it's still got a good flow coming out the jet. It is a little less pressure than a clean filter at 15/16 psi, but it's been running about 7 hours now, and I haven't seen the junk come back yet. FC is only at about 12. I checked at about 1:00pm. Now, the water is colder, with all the rain we got, and lower temps the last few days, the water temp is down to 67/68*. Not sure if the temperature has any effect.

I'm not going to add any Chlorine tonight, but I'm going to let the filter continue to run, and I'll check in the morning, and check the FC too.

I get a lot of dirt and leaves in my pool and occasionally algae. Mustard algae will grow on the sides of the pool and not just the bottom. Leaves can break down very quickly and look like what mustard algae is said to look like and goes “poof” when you touch it. So does dirt. I have a ton of trees and have a hard time keeping stuff out. I also get a lot of dirt in the pool when I cut the grass. If you can’t run your robot, that’s a problem. The dirt always accumulates in the groves on my stairs from my returns.

Interesting. I did not know that about the leaves. Thanks. The robot will run, it's just temperamental. It's either set the robot up, let it go, check it, possibly fiddle with it, get it really going, or just spend the 15 minutes with the vacuum and the vac plate and run it through the filter. so thats what I've been doing.

 

[mariane]

A slightly dirty filter actually cleans better than a clean one. That's essentially what you're doing when you add the DE. So don't backwash until the psi increases 25 percent above the clean pressure.

Have you ever deep cleaned your sand? There is a video on how to do it in this forum. It uses a lot of water but is good to do at closing which will be happening soon. It can wait till then.

 

[mariane]

I can't remember have you ever in past years used floc or clarifier? That can gum up the sand and decrease the effectiveness of the filter.

 

[Chevydue057]

A slightly dirty filter actually cleans better than a clean one. That's essentially what you're doing when you add the DE. So don't backwash until the psi increases 25 percent above the clean pressure.

Have you ever deep cleaned your sand? There is a video on how to do it in this forum. It uses a lot of water but is good to do at closing which will be happening soon. It can wait till then.

This is exactly what I was thinking.


I'm right at the point where I would normally think "It's about time to backwash". But the spots were back to being small. I have deep cleaned the sand. When I opened the pool this year. The sand was new last year, but I figured it was easier to do before I put it all together and set it up.

I can't remember have you ever in past years used floc or clarifier? That can gum up the sand and decrease the effectiveness of the filter.

Not this sand. I did use clarifier 2 summers ago before I knew about TFP. It didn't do anything, but I was afraid it made channels in the sand and replaced the sand.



For my update. It's been 4 days and I haven't run the filter at all. My FC is at 5. The dirt at the bottom has not changed since I shut the pump off this weekend. I plan to take photo's this afternoon after work of what's there, I'll remove them from the pool, and turn the filter on, and I'm 99% positive in 4 hours there will be a ton of whatever it is, on the bottom. The bizarre thing is I've used Skimmer basket covers and I've stuffed the cotton from a pillow in the skimmer basket to try and catch stuff, and it catches a lot of small particles, but it seems to only have a small effect on the accumulation on the bottom of the pool.

 

[Bperry]

This is exactly what I was thinking.


I'm right at the point where I would normally think "It's about time to backwash". But the spots were back to being small. I have deep cleaned the sand. When I opened the pool this year. The sand was new last year, but I figured it was easier to do before I put it all together and set it up.


Not this sand. I did use clarifier 2 summers ago before I knew about TFP. It didn't do anything, but I was afraid it made channels in the sand and replaced the sand.



For my update. It's been 4 days and I haven't run the filter at all. My FC is at 5. The dirt at the bottom has not changed since I shut the pump off this weekend. I plan to take photo's this afternoon after work of what's there, I'll remove them from the pool, and turn the filter on, and I'm 99% positive in 4 hours there will be a ton of whatever it is, on the bottom. The bizarre thing is I've used Skimmer basket covers and I've stuffed the cotton from a pillow in the skimmer basket to try and catch stuff, and it catches a lot of small particles, but it seems to only have a small effect on the accumulation on the bottom of the pool.

If that does result in stuff on the floor, then your filter is letting junk get through it.

 

[mariane]

I can't remember: did you try putting a sock over the return opening to see if anything from the filter blows into the pool thru the return and gets caught in the sock?

Everything you describe about this stuff points to algae.