Don’t know where to start for pool renovation in Phoenix Arizona.

clambert1273

Gold Supporter
Jun 13, 2013
751
Gilbert, AZ
Pool Size
12300
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
CircuPool Edge-40
I know that paper & folder, they blew right through on me & didn't listen to a thing we actually wanted. My preference were the ones who took their time with me and answered me lol then took a few days to give me an estimate putting all the data & measurements to use
 

Nikilyn

Bronze Supporter
Sep 3, 2018
779
Gilbert, AZ
Pool Size
17000
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Prado and sons came over. Said the price of pebble tec is same as pebble sheen. I plan to keep the tiles around the pool and spa which is lined with small tiles. Initially thought a blue surf would match the royal blue tiles but now not sure if I need to go with a lighter shade so the bottom would be clearly visible. The contrast of the row of tiles on the steps would be seen clearly.
I like the contrast in plaster and tile. I think it adds more interest.
I‘m surprised to hear they are the same price. I was always under the impression that sheen was more expensive.
 

NOVICE

Active member
Aug 23, 2011
26
Phoenix, AZ
I did discuss about the in floor system and he said he did not think there were any in take valves. Not sure if I am using the right term but the next guy who came mentioned that I did have two on right side and one on the left side. The next guy from ugly pools said he would charge extra to remove all the floor valves, would it be worthwhile to remove the two drains as well?
The quote has a 250 BTU heatpump, is this size appropriate if we are not concerned with heating the main pool, maybe just the spa.
Also was wondering about salt water pool in Arizona, or is it best to use chlorine tablets?
 

NOVICE

Active member
Aug 23, 2011
26
Phoenix, AZ
I know that paper & folder, they blew right through on me & didn't listen to a thing we actually wanted. My preference were the ones who took their time with me and answered me lol then took a few days to give me an estimate putting all the data & measurements to use
Agree. I read somewhere that they get most of the work subcontracted from the other guys. They do more of repair and resurfacing then dealing with equipments. What do you think of the 8900 quote for the pebble sheen he quoted. Which color have you selected?
 

clambert1273

Gold Supporter
Jun 13, 2013
751
Gilbert, AZ
Pool Size
12300
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
CircuPool Edge-40
Agree. I read somewhere that they get most of the work subcontracted from the other guys. They do more of repair and resurfacing then dealing with equipments. What do you think of the 8900 quote for the pebble sheen he quoted. Which color have you selected?

Mine is baja mini pebble sky blue cobolt so I don't know about any others but I went with a diff contractor too73C0A795-72C8-43F8-B11D-7B29FF4DA268.jpeg
 

Dirk

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Nov 12, 2017
8,624
Central California
Pool Size
12300
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
I did discuss about the in floor system and he said he did not think there were any in take valves. Not sure if I am using the right term but the next guy who came mentioned that I did have two on right side and one on the left side. The next guy from ugly pools said he would charge extra to remove all the floor valves,
This is odd. I would think it would be more time and trouble to preserve, protect, work around, and then re-establish an in-floor system, plus its intakes, then just cutting it all out and sealing it up. Like, a lot more. I would question this. Ask him exactly what has to be done if he leaves it all, or if he takes it all out. This could be legit, but it could be a money grab.

@jimmythegreek, can you weigh in about this?

would it be worthwhile to remove the two drains as well?
I would. (I did.). Never needed them. Still don't. Happy that they're gone.

The quote has a 250 BTU heatpump, is this size appropriate if we are not concerned with heating the main pool, maybe just the spa.
Also was wondering about salt water pool in Arizona, or is it best to use chlorine tablets?
It is never best to use chlorine tabs. That is an unsustainable method of sanitization. You eventually get a build up of CYA acid and then must drain some or most of the pool and start over. Most of us here at TFP highly recommended a salt water pool and SWG system.

Regarding your quotes. If you are collecting more than one, be sure they specify whether they are doing a full chip-out of not. You want a full chip out, especially when replacing old plaster. This removes all the old plaster down to the gunite shell, onto which you'll get a better adhesion of the new finish, and no problems resulting from old, leftover plaster. If they don't specify full chip out (in writing), assume you're not getting one. It's not a small expense, and you want to know if that line-item is included so you're comparing apples-to-apples.
 

NOVICE

Active member
Aug 23, 2011
26
Phoenix, AZ
This is odd. I would think it would be more time and trouble to preserve, protect, work around, and then re-establish an in-floor system, plus its intakes, then just cutting it all out and sealing it up. Like, a lot more. I would question this. Ask him exactly what has to be done if he leaves it all, or if he takes it all out. This could be legit, but it could be a money grab.

@jimmythegreek, can you weigh in about this?


I would. (I did.). Never needed them. Still don't. Happy that they're gone.


It is never best to use chlorine tabs. That is an unsustainable method of sanitization. You eventually get a build up of CYA acid and then must drain some or most of the pool and start over. Most of us here at TFP highly recommended a salt water pool and SWG system.

Regarding your quotes. If you are collecting more than one, be sure they specify whether they are doing a full chip-out of not. You want a full chip out, especially when replacing old plaster. This removes all the old plaster down to the gunite shell, onto which you'll get a better adhesion of the new finish, and no problems resulting from old, leftover plaster. If they don't specify full chip out (in writing), assume you're not getting one. It's not a small expense, and you want to know if that line-item is included so you're comparing apples-to-apples.
 

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NOVICE

Active member
Aug 23, 2011
26
Phoenix, AZ
Dirk I was just looking at your list of equipment. Is this an appropriate list I should more or less need.
How far should the indoor control panel be?
What size heater do you think I need?
Is solar panel recommended? What is a actuator and speed stir?
What type of SWG system do you recommend?
I have one white light in the pool. What type is recommended.
Thank you
 

Dirk

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Nov 12, 2017
8,624
Central California
Pool Size
12300
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Can you fill in your location in your profile? Some of the answers to your questions are climate/location dependent.

Dirk I was just looking at your list of equipment. Is this an appropriate list I should more or less need.
Climate/location dependent.
How far should the indoor control panel be?
I'm sorry, you'll need to clarify. Far? Far from what?
What size heater do you think I need?
I don't use my gas heater. Never have. So I don't know much about them. Others here can advise.
Is solar panel recommended?
Climate/location dependent.
What is a actuator and speed stir?
An actuator is a motorized device that mounts on to a valve. It allows an automation controller to turn the valve on and off. I use two, to turn my solar heater on and off. And to turn my vacuum on and off. Other uses include tuning on and off water features, or controlling the flow of water through your pool and spa.

A SpeedStir is a device used for testing your pool water. You set a small vial of pool water on it, throw in a magnetic stirrer, and the stirrer spins and mixes the water while you apply reagents into your sample to determine the level of various chemicals. HIGHTLY recommenced you buy one when you order your pool test kit (also highly recommended). You'll know why everyone loves their SpeedStir the minute you use it.
What type of SWG system do you recommend?
If you think you'll be interested in automating your pool, then your controller, your main filter pump and your SWG should all be of the same brand. Pentair is a fine brand for all of those things. If you're not interested in automation, then a CircuPool SWG is a fine choice.
I have one white light in the pool. What type is recommended.
Do you like white? Stick with that. Want changing colors and light shows, then there are lots of choices. But LED lights don't last very long. Like SWGs, some work best when they match the brand of the controller. I like the colors. Not so much for the colors themselves, but because different colors light a pool better or worse than others. So I use colors to set the mood and the amount of light: red is dark, so I like swimming in that when it's just me or a few in the pool. Blues and greens are brighter, so they're better for keeping an eye on lots of swimmers. Changing colors are fun for the kids. The more subtle light shows are nice for ambient light while you're sitting by the pool.

There are lots of styles of lights. They fit into a light niche. Be sure the light and niche you get are universal. So that you can later change them out, maybe to a different type. Steer away from proprietary systems that lock you into on brand and style of replacement.

It's best you get a handle on what you want to be able to do with your pool, how you want it to work, any water features, and whether you want to automate any of that, or any of the various maintenance chores (cleaning, dosing chemicals, etc). Then you can determine the components and brands and models that best fulfill that wish list. So build the wish list first, then post it, and we can give you more meaningful answers.
 
Last edited:

NOVICE

Active member
Aug 23, 2011
26
Phoenix, AZ
Can you fill in your location in your profile? Some of the answers to your questions are climate/location dependent.


Climate/location dependent.

I'm sorry, you'll need to clarify. Far? Far from what?

I don't use my gas heater. Never have. So I don't know much about them. Others here can advise.

Climate/location dependent.

An actuator is a motorized device that mounts on to a valve. It allows an automation controller to turn the valve on and off. I use two, to turn my solar heater on and off. And to turn my vacuum on and off. Other uses include tuning on and off water features, or controlling the flow of water through your pool and spa.

A SpeedStir is a device used for testing your pool water. You set a small vial of pool water on it, throw in a magnetic stirrer, and the stirrer spins and mixes the water while you apply reagents into your sample to determine the level of various chemicals. HIGHTLY recommenced you buy one when you order your pool test kit (also highly recommended). You'll know why everyone loves their SpeedStir the minute you use it.

If you think you'll be interested in automating your pool, then your controller, your main filter pump and your SWG should all be of the same brand. Pentair is a fine brand for all of those things. If you're not interested in automation, then a CircuPool SWG is a fine choice.

Do you like white? Stick with that. Want changing colors and light shows, then there are lots of choices. But LED lights don't last very long. Like SWGs, some work best when they match the brand of the controller. I like the colors. Not so much for the colors themselves, but because different colors light a pool better or worse than others. So I use colors to set the mood and the amount of light: red is dark, so I like swimming in that when it's just me or a few in the pool. Blues and greens are brighter, so they're better for keeping an eye on lots of swimmers. Changing colors are fun for the kids. The more subtle light shows are nice for ambient light while you're sitting by the pool.

There are lots of styles of lights. They fit into a light niche. Be sure the light and niche you get are universal. So that you can later change them out, maybe to a different type. Steer away from proprietary systems that lock you into on brand and style of replacement.

It's best you get a handle on what you want to be able to do with your pool, how you want it to work, any water features, and whether you want to automate any of that, or any of the various maintenance chores (cleaning, dosing chemicals, etc). Then you can determine the components and brands and models that best fulfill that wish list. So build the wish list first, then post it, and we can give you more meaningful answers.
I do have on my profile and in the question posed. I am from Phoenix Arizona.
Would a solar panel help. I do have flat roof over my patio. Do you use the solar panel. I would be using the heater only for the spa.
I was wondering if the indoor panel needs to be close to the pool equipment or is it connected wireless.I am still learning a lot from this forum. I do need to automate as much as possible.Would love to know approximate cost to full automate.
Yes I would light the different colored lights. Which would you recommend? Thxs for the tip to go the universal type
 

Dirk

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Nov 12, 2017
8,624
Central California
Pool Size
12300
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
@mknauss, will someone in Phoenix get good ROI from solar panels? Are they needed, or does the sun do the trick all by itself down your way?

Yes, I use my panels everyday during swim season. They help raise the water temp about 5-10°. I could do better if I covered my pool at night, as we get cool nights. But I don't want to hassle with a cover.

I've heard somewhere down south that pools actually get too hot. Solar panels can be used to cool a pool! You run them at night. I've never needed to, so I've never tried that. But it's something to be aware of.

I have Pentair gear, with full automation, and ScreenLogic (SL). I would not want a pool without automation. I have many ways to control it:
- Controls on the unit itself,
- from any desktop computer (SL),
- using the SL app on my iPads or iPhone (SL),
- and my Indoor Control Panel.

My Indoor Control Panel is hard-wired to my controller. I ran the wire through the attic. It does not need to be close to the controller. Mine is probably 30'-40' away. I'm sure it would work fine much farther away. Pentair also sells a wireless version. I don't know what the range is for that model. It would depend on how many walls in between and all the usual stuff that interferes with wireless. It is not WiFi. I don't like to mess with wireless or Wifi, so I hard-wire everything that I can.

Many folks would get by just fine without a wall controller, and just use their phones. I don't carry my phone while home, as I still use land lines! I know, I know. So the Indoor Control Panel is much more convenient for me, rather than finding my phone, loading an app and finding the right screen and buttons. The Indoor Control Panel allows me to check on my pool whenever I walk by it, and control up to four functions with the quick push of a button. It's right next to my HVAC thermostat and home automation system. They're all in the one spot I walk by most often.

It's the one on the top. I've since painted all my picture frames to match, so they all blend in together fairly well.

control central.jpg

I can't currently recommend a colored LED light. Others here might be able to help with that. I'm on my second Pentair 5G light in three years. I believe this second one is starting to fail, too. It's a common issue. They just don't hold up well. And they're very expensive. I have a plan to rebuild it when it fails, but that is a DIY electronics project that I'm guessing you wouldn't be interested in.

As I mentioned, you would first settle on a brand for your automation, and then we can help you find compatible lights.
 

NOVICE

Active member
Aug 23, 2011
26
Phoenix, AZ
Dirk, I was thinking about using the solar panels in winter to heat the spa. It is sunny year round here in Phoenix. We have a buried Propane gas tank and it depletes the tank very fast to heat the pool in winter.
 

mknauss

Mod Squad
TFP Expert
Bronze Supporter
May 3, 2014
36,428
Laughlin, NV
Pool Size
6000
Surface
Fiberglass
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Solar panels will not heat a spa. That is a quick heat up. They are used in the desert to be able to warm the pool in the spring and fall. I use a bubble cover and just a little gas heater time to warm our pool in April, early May, and again in later September and October. Solar panels are not worth it to us.
 

Dirk

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Nov 12, 2017
8,624
Central California
Pool Size
12300
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Yah, Marty's right. Solar panels heat the pool a little bit, and it takes hours to get the water to move 5 or 10 degrees. It would be faster in a spa, of course, but still would be too inconvenient for the way most people use a spa...
 
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NOVICE

Active member
Aug 23, 2011
26
Phoenix, AZ
Solar panels will not heat a spa. That is a quick heat up. They are used in the desert to be able to warm the pool in the spring and fall. I use a bubble cover and just a little gas heater time to warm our pool in April, early May, and again in later September and October. Solar panels are not worth it to us.
Thank you for clarifying
 
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Dirk

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Nov 12, 2017
8,624
Central California
Pool Size
12300
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
For home automation, I use a protocol called Insteon, and its associated hardware (switches and outlets, etc). It works in step with a software component that runs on my Macintosh computers and iPhone and iPads. (That's an old iPad on the wall in the picture that I mounted in a frame.) It offers virtually unlimited programming of the hardware and how it all works together, to a geek's content. I settled on all that software and hardware long before home automation took off in popularity the way it did. Now you have all sorts of protocols and systems available. I don't know much about any of those, as I've only focused on the system I have. Others here use some of those other systems. Maybe they can offer ideas about which one is best.

If you settle on Insteon, I'm your guy.

You might want to start a separate thread about it, with a title that would grab the attention of the other home automaters. Though there must be tons of HA forums out there, that would likely be a better source of information than our meager pool forum. I don't frequent any, sorry, not much help...
 

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