Does a 23 year old Sta-Rite System 3 need replacing?

[Auburn02]

I'm relaying a message from a family friend who I don't want to see taken advantage of, but without going into the pool service business as a side job I can't run over there multiple times a week to take things into my own hands either.

Long story short her pool is 23 years old and she is adamant that the cartridges in her Sta-Rite System 3 filter have never been replaced, just cleaned annually in the spring and she has otherwise had minimal issues with the pool over the years. Until this year that is; she has been battling algae all summer, has had the cartridges cleaned out a couple of times, but the people she's hired to do it just keep telling her the system is old and needs to be replaced. One guy did offer to replace the cartridges and quoted her $1000 to do so. I was shocked to learn that these System 3 cartridges are in fact $450-$500 range even if I ordered them online. With that said, the latest guy she's talked to offered to either install them for her for a fee if she ordered them, but also quoted her for a new Hayward C3030 325sqft filter setup installed for somewhere around $2400-$2500.

I have a sand filter and I've only had my pool a few years, so I have no idea if filters (especially of the cartridge variety) have a lifespan and thus is it even worse the high price of the System 3 cartridges vs replacing the entire filter?

Furthermore, would anything about old/degraded cartridges even lead to this algae problem? I think that's my biggest worry, she will go through all of this to get new cartridges or a whole new filtration system only to find the algae problem remains. Maybe the algae has taken hold in the old broken down cartridges and no amount of water flow or cleaning them is killing it? Grasping at straws.

I do hope to get over there in the next day or so to do a full run of tests, but based on her description of the water now of course I expect the numbers won't be great. I may end up just having to help conduct a SLAM by going back and forth as often as possible to get the water clean, just need to make sure I'm educated as much as possible about how cartridges react to algae and age so I can help her come up with the best plan.

 

[HermanTX]

As you well know, filters do not cause algae, but the lack of chlorine allows algae to grow. So you really have an algae issue and possibly a filtration issue.
You can correct the algae issue with SLAM as you indicated, however there is a need to filter out the dead algae, so the filtration issue comes into play.

Cleaning the existing filters in a large trash can filled with some dish soap may help remove oils and other stuff on it. Then hose it down really good.
If you have the time, it would be good to open up the filter and see for yourself.

Maybe print this out and give to the friend to read.

Maintenance and Cleaning of Pool Filters

Maintaining your swimming pool filter system is important. Learn how to clean and maintain your pool filter at low cost & enjoy a Trouble Free Pool.

www.troublefreepool.com

Worst case is to purchase a new set of filters. This is assuming the housing is still in good condition.

 

[Auburn02]

Yep, agreed re: algae vs filtration. I'll get eyes on the pool and do a water test today, take inventory of her equipment pad so I can hopefully verify the SWCG is working and probably bring some bottles of liquid chlorine along.

Worst case is to purchase a new set of filters. This is assuming the housing is still in good condition.

With regard to this, what assessment would determine that the "housing is still in good condition?" Just no cracks, leaks, etc? The fact that these System 3 filter cartridges are allegedly 23 years old is astonishing to me, so spending ~$450 of her money on a new set isn't so alarming provided they'll last her a while, but I wouldn't want to make that call and it be the wrong one either. She's in her 80s, keeps telling me how they don't need to last too much longer.

 

[wireform]

What @HermanTX said ^^^^^^^
yes/no on the filters but I doubt 23 years can be good on any cartridge especially on bad chemistry.

 

[HermanTX]

Yep, agreed re: algae vs filtration. I'll get eyes on the pool and do a water test today, take inventory of her equipment pad so I can hopefully verify the SWCG is working and probably bring some bottles of liquid chlorine along.


With regard to this, what assessment would determine that the "housing is still in good condition?" Just no cracks, leaks, etc? The fact that these System 3 filter cartridges are allegedly 23 years old is astonishing to me, so spending ~$450 of her money on a new set isn't so alarming provided they'll last her a while, but I wouldn't want to make that call and it be the wrong one either. She's in her 80s, keeps telling me how they don't need to last too much longer.

The filter housing is resin so ensure there is no cracks both on inside and outside.
I totally understand the situation with regards to purchasing new filters. You just need to make an assessment and best judgement at the time.
Soaking them in dish soap with water for a couple of hours and then let them dry and replace.
Thanks for taking care of your family friend.

 

[1poolman1]

The filter housing is resin so ensure there is no cracks both on inside and outside.
I totally understand the situation with regards to purchasing new filters. You just need to make an assessment and best judgement at the time.
Soaking them in dish soap with water for a couple of hours and then let them dry and replace.
Thanks for taking care of your family friend.

Dishwasher detergent (Cascade, etc.) not dishwashing soap (Dawn, etc.). Unless you like a lot of foam in the pool.

 

[Auburn02]

Updates:

1. Test results:
FC: 0.5
CC: 0
pH: 7.7
TA: 50
CH: 350
CYA: 0
Salt: (forgot to bring my salt test with me, will test later when I go back to add more chlorine)

2. She has algae:






3. As seen in the test results, there is no chlorine in the pool. I think her salt cell (IC40) is done based on this test to determine "% expended." She thinks this cell is about 10 years old from when the pool was converted from chlorinator to SWCG:

4. I did flush out the filters, but would say she does need new ones as these are cracked. I think the housing is fine.




5. Plan of action. First, SLAM the pool using liquid chlorine and keep supplementing until equipment is up to snuff. Order and replace IC40 cell. Order replacement cartridges. Researching now to see if there are brands to avoid or spring for OEM, etc. Might wait to actually replace them until most of the algae is dead and gone and let the old worn out cartridges take the hit from all that dead/dying material.

 

[mknauss]

Reliable source for filters

Our Replacement Cartridges for Pentair®

All filter cartridges sold by Pool Guy Supply are high quality aftermarket replacements. All trademarks referenced are property of their respective owners and are only for comparison.

poolguysupply.com

 

[HermanTX]

Updates:

1. Test results:
FC: 0.5
CC: 0
pH: 7.7
TA: 50
CH: 350
CYA: 0
Salt: (forgot to bring my salt test with me, will test later when I go back to add more chlorine)

2. She has algae:
View attachment 519199

View attachment 519200

View attachment 519201

3. As seen in the test results, there is no chlorine in the pool. I think her salt cell (IC40) is done based on this test to determine "% expended." She thinks this cell is about 10 years old from when the pool was converted from chlorinator to SWCG:

4. I did flush out the filters, but would say she does need new ones as these are cracked. I think the housing is fine.

View attachment 519206
View attachment 519207

5. Plan of action. First, SLAM the pool using liquid chlorine and keep supplementing until equipment is up to snuff. Order and replace IC40 cell. Order replacement cartridges. Researching now to see if there are brands to avoid or spring for OEM, etc. Might wait to actually replace them until most of the algae is dead and gone and let the old worn out cartridges take the hit from all that dead/dying material.

Good plan.
If she did not like the idea of spending $450 on new cartridge it will tough sell on a new IC40. Ten year life is more than expected and lack of chlorine is the reason for algae. Although the IC makes it easy for her to ensure chlorine is always in the pool.

Clean the cartridges the best you can and use them until pool is clear then replace with new set.
It will take dedication to do the SLAM and maintain the chlorine at SLAM level throughout the day. It is great you are guideing her.

You should bring up the CYA to 30ppm so the chlorine can do it work to kill algae and not be burnt off by UV directly on the pool.

 

[1poolman1]

Updates:

1. Test results:
FC: 0.5
CC: 0
pH: 7.7
TA: 50
CH: 350
CYA: 0
Salt: (forgot to bring my salt test with me, will test later when I go back to add more chlorine)

2. She has algae:
View attachment 519199

View attachment 519200

View attachment 519201

3. As seen in the test results, there is no chlorine in the pool. I think her salt cell (IC40) is done based on this test to determine "% expended." She thinks this cell is about 10 years old from when the pool was converted from chlorinator to SWCG:

4. I did flush out the filters, but would say she does need new ones as these are cracked. I think the housing is fine.

View attachment 519206
View attachment 519207

5. Plan of action. First, SLAM the pool using liquid chlorine and keep supplementing until equipment is up to snuff. Order and replace IC40 cell. Order replacement cartridges. Researching now to see if there are brands to avoid or spring for OEM, etc. Might wait to actually replace them until most of the algae is dead and gone and let the old worn out cartridges take the hit from all that dead/dying material.

Kill the algae, but the pool will never clear with that crack in the cartridge.

 

[Auburn02]

Good plan.
If she did not like the idea of spending $450 on new cartridge it will tough sell on a new IC40. Ten year life is more than expected and lack of chlorine is the reason for algae. Although the IC makes it easy for her to ensure chlorine is always in the pool.

The good news is she didn’t balk at the price, she just wants to be sure she’s actually getting what she needs and not anything extra based on someone trying to take advantage of her. Which is what I’d classify as the guys telling her to throw the whole System 3 out, and the fact that not one of them made mention of the “inspect cell” light blinking and inquired about the fact that her IC40 cell is about 10 years old. So frustrating.

 

[wireform]

Get the cell replaced now so you can take advantage of it producing chlorine while at slam although it won't raise the slam level but it'll help keeping some chlorine going saving you some jugs.

 

[Auburn02]

Well, I'm invested now. She really only lives about 10-15 minutes away and I work from home about half the time, so I'm taking over until I get this thing cleaned up and stable.

Still trying to calculate the pool volume but I believe it to be somewhere in the 25-30,000 gallon range. I added 3 gallons of 10% chlorine Wednesday night and it was reading 0.5 again Thursday morning. Added another 3 gallons and a 1lb bag of dichlor she happened to have Thursday morning, it was *maybe* 1.0 Thursday around 5p.m.. This time I added 6 gallons of LC and told her to add 2 more before she went to bed, and I will go back over this morning. I should also have time today to check on it more frequently and add as needed, perhaps 3 or 4 times to adjust (maintain) the levels.

In the meantime I did rinse the filter cartridges again yesterday which were obviously dirty but nothing like I saw on Wednesday. The pressure gauge is frozen so I have one on order so I can monitor that, along with new cartridges and a shiny new IC40 salt cell.

She does have a Dolphin robot, not sure of model, but from what I can tell it only has the "screen" basket compared to mine with pleated filters so I'm not sure if hers will do a good enough job picking up dead algae or if I will need to bring over a vacuum hose. Or just bring over my robot for that matter.

 

[PoolStored]

You really want to follow this process. Print it out, read it three times and keep it with you. Link-->SLAM Process

 

[HermanTX]

Great work. it is hard to estimate pool volume with chemical additions if the pool has algae. You just have to go with the best measurements you can. Have you tested CYA again? With a 25k pool you will need at least 10 gallons of LC to start the SLAM process. Each gallon is 4ppm.

 

[Auburn02]

You really want to follow this process. Print it out, read it three times and keep it with you. Link-->SLAM Process

Thanks. I'm very familiar with the process and is exactly what I'm doing, knowing it may take a little longer since it's not in my own backyard and thus I can't check/adjust as frequently as would be ideal.

 

[Auburn02]

Great work. it is hard to estimate pool volume with chemical additions if the pool has algae. You just have to go with the best measurements you can. Have you tested CYA again? With a 25k pool you will need at least 10 gallons of LC to start the SLAM process. Each gallon is 4ppm.

CYA is still 0, I have not added anything to raise it. With CYA >= 20 SLAM level is just 10ppm, hence the addition of 3 gallons at the start. 10 gallons would increase FC to 40.

 

[PoolStored]

Please print out, read three times and follow the SLAM process. Link-->SLAM Process

Per the process, you need to raise CYA to 30. This gives your FC additions sufficient protection; without it you will lose Chlorine too quickly to be effective against the Algae.

The 10 gallons comment was about what you need to have on hand, not a single addition.

 

[Auburn02]

The 10 gallons comment was about what you need to have on hand, not a single addition.

Oh, glad you clarified, sure sounded like the suggestion was to add 10 gallons to the pool. There are about 15 gallons still on hand so I shouldn't run out immediately, and stabilizer will be added today assuming I can find it; the shelf was bare at the closest store where I bought every bottle of chlorine they had.

 

[Auburn02]

Alright, 8 lbs of CYA sourced and added, if it's 25-30K gallons that will get me somewhere between 30 and 40.

The filter cartridges and IC40 were ordered from Polytec on Wednesday, not sure how quick they turn orders out but hopefully have them in a few days.