Condo Complex HOA - Satisfying pool testing requirements

[NickB7]

I'm on the HOA board of a condo complex with 200+ units. We have an outdoor pool and an indoor hot tub. We're taking a closer look at water testing, and though our pool traffic is not what I would consider "high volume" (we're not the YMCA; I'm guessing we have a total of about three dozen visitors to our pool during the hottest days of summer), it looks like the Oregon Health Authority still holds to all of the testing requirements of a full-size commercial pool. That means we need to test:

HOURLY
Chlorine/Bromine

DAILY
pH
Turbidity

WEEKLY
Alkalinity
Copper
Silver
Calcium hardness

I have been told that the current mix of chemicals being used to treat the pool are as follows: Liquid Chlorine, Sodium Bicarbonate, Calcium Chlorine, Muriatic Acid, Chlorine Carboy, Algae Treatment, Spa Perfect, Clarifier, Phos out Plus. I expect that means that we would not have to test for Bromine, Copper, or Silver. But there is a whole separate schedule for the hot tub as well, with different intervals, and testing all of this would monopolize our HOA manager's time. Our contracted pool company does come to check our levels and dial everything in on a weekly basis, but again, that is not satisfying the testing criteria we are seeing.

Is there an automatic monitoring system that could meet our hourly and daily requirements? From looking around online, it seems that "turbidity" is a tough one. But I would love to hear from the experts.

 

[Newdude]

Hey Nick and Welcome !!!

I want you to meet out friend @JPMorgan. He bought a condo and took it upon himself to get involved with the pools management. Your municipalities probably have alot more in common then they don't, and he is many steps ahead of you in the process.

 

[cowboycasey]

Welcome to TFP

There are very few auto anything and none work very well at all.. they are expensive and as far as I know will not work for state requirements..

The other problem is what we recommend at TFP is not anywhere close to what is required for commercial pools and hot tubs.. You have to follow the state regulations and requirements..

You should have a person testing and adding chemicals daily to be in compliance.. By day 2 or 3 after the contracted pool company adds chemicals you are way out of tolerance and probably should not have people in the pool or hot tub.. actually the hot tub with 4 people in it for 30 to 60 minutes needs to be checked as the chlorine would probably be gone..

The one thing I think you can go to is a saltwater generator system for chlorine.. It will be much easier for the pool and hot tub to keep chlorine in them at all times and then you would just have to check hourly or daily depending on the requirements. One thing you will need to check is if you can have CYA (cyanuric acid) in the pool and hot tub..

 

[Toxophilite]

It appears you could satisfy the requirements for pH and FC with a device, though not reliable, but then also adopt a more time friendly testing schedule for your manager. Also, is appears non-stabilized chlorine is the most demanding of time per their requirements.

(d)​

Continuous reading devices shall satisfy requirements in subsections (3)(a), (b) and (c) of this rule if such devices record in pH units and ppm of free chlorine or bromine;

An uncle of mine became an apartment manager in Houston after he retired, actually a couple over the years, and his solution to managing them, the city, and insurance company was earth by the dump truck loads.

 

[setsailsoon]

I would look at your HOA liability insurance and make sure you are still covered.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

This is what we call a “thousand dollar question” … how many thousands of dollars is your HOA willing to spend to get into compliance?

Hourly FC monitoring is impractical and expensive. The other parameters can be met if you’re willing to pay someone to do the tasks. So, at the end of the day, you will need to implement a costly monitoring system that someone will have to be responsible for AND you will need to create a job position in your HOA, or add to the responsibilities of a current employee, that encompasses the other tasks …

There’s also the “backfill with soil” option.

 

[NickB7]

Hey Nick and Welcome !!!

I want you to meet out friend @JPMorgan. He bought a condo and took it upon himself to get involved with the pools management. Your municipalities probably have alot more in common then they don't, and he is many steps ahead of you in the process.

Thank you! I will look through his past messages and see what I can glean.

You should have a person testing and adding chemicals daily to be in compliance.. By day 2 or 3 after the contracted pool company adds chemicals you are way out of tolerance and probably should not have people in the pool or hot tub.. actually the hot tub with 4 people in it for 30 to 60 minutes needs to be checked as the chlorine would probably be gone..

The one thing I think you can go to is a saltwater generator system for chlorine.. It will be much easier for the pool and hot tub to keep chlorine in them at all times and then you would just have to check hourly or daily depending on the requirements. One thing you will need to check is if you can have CYA (cyanuric acid) in the pool and hot tub..

I had no idea that pool chemicals were that short-lived. I will do some reading on saltwater pools and CYA. Thanks!

An uncle of mine became an apartment manager in Houston after he retired, actually a couple over the years, and his solution to managing them, the city, and insurance company was earth by the dump truck loads.

This is what I keep hearing. It's probably worth doing a cost analysis. I believe we budget around $16,000 a year for pool upkeep and maintenance, but I'm sure the real costs are in the insurance.

I would look at your HOA liability insurance and make sure you are still covered.

As in, it would be conditional upon us maintaining the state-level standards?

This is what we call a “thousand dollar question” … how many thousands of dollars is your HOA willing to spend to get into compliance?

Hourly FC monitoring is impractical and expensive. The other parameters can be met if you’re willing to pay someone to do the tasks. So, at the end of the day, you will need to implement a costly monitoring system that someone will have to be responsible for AND you will need to create a job position in your HOA, or add to the responsibilities of a current employee, that encompasses the other tasks …

There’s also the “backfill with soil” option.

Oh gosh! We're not budgeted for it. Maybe we need to create a formal role for a volunteer "pool czar". Ideally someone who hangs out at the pool all summer and is a real stickler.

 

[setsailsoon]

Thank you! I will look through his past messages and see what I can glean.


I had no idea that pool chemicals were that short-lived. I will do some reading on saltwater pools and CYA. Thanks!


This is what I keep hearing. It's probably worth doing a cost analysis. I believe we budget around $16,000 a year for pool upkeep and maintenance, but I'm sure the real costs are in the insurance.


As in, it would be conditional upon us maintaining the state-level standards?


Oh gosh! We're not budgeted for it. Maybe we need to create a formal role for a volunteer "pool czar". Ideally someone who hangs out at the pool all summer and is a real stickler.

No, as in they may cancel your policy or there may be language in the policy that prevents you from doing this yourself. Or it may just require you can comply with the law in your jurisdiction. I would just check your policy and if you are not sure contact your agent. Better to know this going in than to be disappointed later. Also I would be sure you have a solid record of calibration testing if you're going to use automation.

Chris

 

[Toxophilite]

This is what I keep hearing. It's probably worth doing a cost analysis. I believe we budget around $16,000 a year for pool upkeep and maintenance, but I'm sure the real costs are in the insurance.

Whomever has been doing till now can probably give you a good idea on what it will take in materials, maintenance, and labor.

 

[ajw22]

Your outdoor pool should be stabilized with 30 ppm of CYA. That allows testing chlorine every 4 hours.

So the daily testing schedule is not that onerous. pH testing once a day and chlorine using a FAS/DPD test every four hours. The pH test takes less then 5 minutes and the chlorine test maybe 10 minutes.

What are the hours the pool and hot tub are open?

I am sure there are other condo’s in your area with pools and hot tubs. Have you surveyed how they meet their water testing requirements?

 

[JPMorgan]

Nick.... hopefully you were able to find and read some of my posts and the responses form TFP users and experts. I am in Illinois, so the requirements here are a bit different. We are required to test the pool two times per day and there are specifications re: what levels need to be maintained. We have an outdoor and an indoor pool, no hot tub (thank God!). Right now I am mostly familiar with the indoor pool, since I moved here in the fall and the outdoor pool was closed shortly after we came here. I do know, however, that when I tested the CYA level in the outdoor pool it was way out of wack and no one seemed to know anything about that. I have not seen an inspector come out here since we moved in. It appears those visits are rare, but I suspect if they had shown up when the CYA was over 200 (!!!), they would have been forced to close and drain the pool. The problem with CYA, of course, is using stabilized chlorine as a sanitizer, so liquid chlorine is the way to go if you can handle the manual application frequency. I will be encouraging my HOA to go that route this year, but not sure yet how that will play out. I will be the one adding the chlorine, so I will soon find out how onerous this becomes. Salt water generator is definitely the most convenient way to go, but I think conversion can be costly and involve state regulators approving any changes. If liquid chlorine becomes too onerous, then we will probably resort back to trichlor tabs... which will raise CYA over time.... and require the pool to be partially drained and re-filled several times throughout the summer. If the HOA balks at that, then I will step away. I'm not going to be a part of helping to manage the pool if they don't follow the requirements. (I think the limit for CYA in Illinois is 100.) We do have a pool company come out 3x per week during the summer season, so they keep an eye on things, as well... BUT..... then how did the CYA get to 200!

Finally, both pools have automatic feeders and controllers for pH, bromine (indoor pool), and chlorine (outdoor pool). The feeders/ controllers seem to work pretty well, at least for the indoor pool, to keep levels where they should be, but this does not replace testing. The controllers provide a reading, but you will still have test with whatever frequency the state regulations require. We are required to record the daily test results and maintain those records for 3 years. Re: turbidity.... the requirement here is just to note whether you can see the main drain at the bottom of the pool. That has never been an issue in our pools. Hope this helps somewhat.