BIG MESS, CYA and Chlorine levels are way off.

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B

BaliPool

0
Oct 13, 2018
5
Bali, Indonesia
Hello everyone, first of all thank you in advance for wanting to help me and for giving advice.

My pool is a big mess. I have 20.000 Gallon / 75.000 Liter infinity pool located in Bali, Indonesia (Meaning everyday 10 hours full 92F/33° sun exposure).

About two months ago my pool turned green and it stayed green. Eventually we changed the sand in the sand filter. The problem still did not dissapear, we added many chlorine but our well water contains many iron/metals so the pool turned completely brown. After we FLOC'ed the pool and the day after the pool has never been as clear and blue as that day before. A couple days later and the pool turned green again, we again added chlorine, pool turned brown again and after we FLOC'ed again. Rinse repeat we did this 3 times. It was time to buy a real legitimate testkit. I have bought the Lovibond Scuba II.

Starting on the 9th of October my pool started to turn a little green again. Everyday I do scrubbing, add chlorine and in the morning I backwash. This time the pool is not turning brown, so supposibly there is no reaction from the iron, possible because all of it is already taken out because of the previous FLOCing.

The 11th of October I received my kit. (ph-CIF(free chlorine)-CIT(total chlorine)-CyA(Cyanuricacid)-TA(Total alkalinity)

11-Oktober 13:00 pH:7.5 CIF:1.1 CIT:1.6 CYA:66 TA:25
I did a lot of research on my own and noticed I had to up my chlorine levels because my CYA is too high. I also directly removed any chlorine pucks/tablets containing CYA. My TA is also low so I bought Bakins Soda.
I added: 25oz/750ml HCL Muratic Acid. 3.3lbs/1.5kg Baking Soda. and 12oz/350gr Granular chlorine.

12-Oktober 10:00 pH:7.3 CIF:2 CIT:2.6 CYA:84 TA:61
My pH dropped to 7.3 which I was happy about. I noticed that after the 12oz/350gr Granular chlorine, my pool CIF only went up by 1.5, making it 2. This is still too low. I read that my CIF must be at least 7.5% of my total CYA value. The big shock was that my CYA has increased from 66 to 84. I called the pool shop to ask whether the granulated chlorine contains CYA. They told me it did not, luckily I have this new test kit so I tested it myself and the granulated chlorine actually DOES contain CYA. At this moment I have throw all the old chlorine out of the windows and purchased liquid chlorine which contains no CYA, I also tested it whether it contains no CYA. My TA went up from 25-61, this is fine but I am aiming to get to 100. I have been told that one could only add a maximum of 3.3lbs/1.5kg Baking Soda to raise the TA every 4 days.

12-Oktober 18:00 CIF:2.9
I have added 34oz/1Liter liquid chlorine to up the chlorine level. (Yes I know I should add around 1.3Gallon/5Liter Liquid chlorine to get to around 8PPM, but I am very worried about my pool turning brown again by adding too much chlorine too fast so I am adding little by little.

12-Oktober 22:00 CIF:3.3
I have added 50oz/1.5liter liquid chlorine because 3.3 is still too low. Hopefully tomorrow when I wake up the pool will be somewhere around 5 PPM CIF

13-Oktober 08:30 pH:7.4 CIF:2.9 CIT:3.6 CYA:123 TA:53
I am completely lost. Last night I added 50oz/1.5liter liquid chlorine while the CIF was 3.3 PPM, now when I did the test the Chlorine went down to 2.9, how is this even possible??? What makes me even more angry is that my CYA went up from 84 to 123!!! How is this possible? My liquid chlorine contains no CYA, so how can this level be rising??? I decided to do a good 5 minute backwash and rinse and added well water for about 2 hours to top up the pool. At this moment I am not putting anything in the pool and I was thinking that I first will ask for advice on this forum.

13-Oktober 15:00 pH:7.7 CIF:1.9 CIT:2.4 CYA:105 TA:72
Seven hours later and these are my values. pH went crazy from 7.4 to 7.7 so I am thinking of adding 34oz/1Liter HCL Muriatic Acid before dark. My Total Chlorine CIT and my Free Chlorine CIF also went down. I am thinking of adding a lot of liquid chlorine tonight but I am afraid it going to up my CYA levels even more. My pool is still lightly green, luckily I can still see the bottom 6feet/1.85meter but barerly.

At this moment I have no idea what to do and I desperately need your help. Any advice would be highly appreciated.

Thanks in advance!!!
 
It is already 21:00 where I am located so I decided to take matters into my own hands for another day until i get some advice.

I have just added:
34oz/1liter HCL Muratic Acid to lower down the pH.
26oz/750gr to raise the TA
68oz(0.5gallon)/2liter liquid chlorine to up my chlorine ppm.

EDIT:
Its 23:00 and I couldnt resist to test the free chlorine level real quick. Turns out it is 2.1 so only 0.2 ppm higher after adding the liquid chlorine than the reading from 15:00 this afternoon. Therefore I just added again 68oz(0.5gallon)/2liter liquid chlorine.

Lets see what happens tomorrow.
 
BP, your situation is much like many others who are new to TFP. As you have already seen, everything you do revolves around accurate water testing. Without accurate, reliable numbers, it's just a guessing game. That is why here at TFP we recommend using either a TF-100 (link below) or Taylor K-2006C test kit. Those are proven to be reliable. I suspect some of your frustrations may be the testing products you have available. In your area, not sure what you can order online, but I would consider a TF-100 or Taylor K-2006C.

It's critical to get an accurate CYA right now. If you haven't added any stabilizer or pool store bags of shock products with dichlor or trichlor, that CYA number should not increase. If it does, it's that testing method. Once you confirm the CYA, make sure to follow our [FC/CYA][/FC/CYA]. That is key. You have the right idea about keeping the pH on the lower end right now. Continue that as well.

We almost never recommend using floc. It simply makes a mess of things and can really mess-up your filter (sand) if it gets in there. Algae is best removed by following our SLAM Process guidance. But again, the proper test kit is key to performing a SLAM.

Make sure to read/save those Vital Links below in my signature, and also see our ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry. All of those links together will help you.
 
Hello Texas Splash,

I really appreciate your input and response to my post.

As I have just purchased my Lovibond Scuba II test machine together with testing kits for well over 150$ I will unfortunately not be in the position to purchase another test kit. It will also be a hassle to get it here in Bali anyway. However, I do get what you are saying and I just need to up my chlorine levels and get my SLAM on. I will get back to you guys once its done or if I have another question.

14-Oktober 09:30 pH:7.8 CIF:3.3 CIT:3.8 CYA:94 TA:75
I have added 40oz/1.5liter HCL Muratic Acid to get that pH down again.
 
Hi BaliPool! Welcome to TFP. Sorry to hear about the troubles you're having with your pool.

What is the highest level of FC your gear is capable of testing? And what type of test are you doing to obtain your CYA level? I can understand your reluctance to buy more test gear, but without some way to test FC and CYA accurately, to high levels, you're not going to be able to use the methods taught here to clear your pool of algae. That's the bad news. The good news is, depending on what you already have, you might only have to buy one or two individual tests kits to solve that problem: one that can perform a FAS-DPD test, and a good CYA tester. Though those are not cheap when purchased alone.

You'll have to decide at some point, which is worse: spending more for the correct test kit, one that we can help you with, or continuing to deal with your algae... Sorry I don't have any better ideas...
 
Oh my god, I wrote a super long reply. Now 2 hours later I am checking to see if anyone replied and I do not see my own reply. Let me quickly try to summarize it.

My test kit is a lovibond scuba 2 which I though was a very reliable top notch digital pool tester. I want to purchase the taylor k2006 the only problem is that it would take 3 weeks to arrive here.

My test kit only goes up to 6ppm FC, which is way too low. I also have a feeling the CYA measurements are not reliable. The pool shop sells Liquid Chlorine and on the receipt they write down Sodium. I suppose the liquid chlorine is sodium Hypochlorite. I asked how much %chlorine has it they told me it has 70%, but after googling it pretty much seems all sodium hypochlorite has 12%. They also assured me the liquid chlorine contains no CYA. Needless to say this Balinese pool shop is super sketchy.

I decided to SLAM shock my pool.

I added 10 liter liquid chlorine and my FC went from 1.2 to 4. I added another 10 liter and thats when i realised my test kit does not measure any chlorine higher than 6. So I guess my FC is somewhere around 8FC. I also measured my CYA 4 hours later and my reading went from 94 yesterday to 145 today. Now HOW is this possible? Either my testkit is unreliable or the liquid chlorine actually contains CYA. What do you think is more likely?

Right now I am slowly dosing a little more chlorine every few hours to maintain my measurement on 6+ (since thats my limit).
The pool is not clearing up at all though.

My pH also went from 7.4 before the 20liter chlorine to 8.2 after, but i read pH readings are not accurate during SLAM.

Right now I need to find a way to clear up the pool ASAP.

If you guys have any more advice please let me know.


14-Oktober 09:30 pH:8.2 CIF:6+ CIT:6+ CYA:145 TA:91
 
I think your issue is testing error, and I don't think there is any avoiding getting the proper test kit. Personally, I'd have no faith in a digital tester. Not one that would be affordable to me. The Taylor kit is an excellent solution, and torture tested by thousands of pool owners here at TFP. The sooner you order it, you sooner you'll get it. Do it today.

You can't perform a SLAM with your current setup. You HAVE to be able to measure the FC well above 6, and you HAVE to be able to measure your CYA accurately. Right now you can do neither. Sorry, there appears to be no quick or alternate solution.

And if your CYA is somewhere around where you think it is, you can't do a SLAM even with the right equipment. You'd have to replace some of your water first.

You also have to be sure of your chlorine source. There is no 70% liquid chlorine that I know of (I think that might be chemically impossible, as chlorine is actually a gas). You shouldn't be putting anything in your pool unless you know the actual ingredients. If your pool shop or chlorine jug cannot provide a trustworthy ingredient list, you have to find one that can.

Order the kit. Once it arrives, we can offer more help.
 
Correct. Liquid chlorine would not have any stabilizer, so I suspect the testing equipment you were using is inconsistent. So to prevent exhausting yourself of time and money, just remember you won't be able to effectively SLAM until you can accurately confirm the CYA then measure/maintain the FC at the required (higher) level as seen on the [FC/CYA][/FC/CYA]. Yes, it is correct that the pH will give a higher reading when the FC goes over 10.
 
I read your post and the replies. It seems to me you may have an issue with your pH and Alkalinity being too low and you could be leaching copper and heavy metals into your water. The green and brown may not be algae at all. Everyone on this forum has given you the same advice though.... Testing, testing, testing!!! It has to be accurate so you are making the right changes. You initially start with testing everything first (accurately) so you have a good baseline. Then make sure you have 5ppm of Chlorine to start with. Worry about shocking later, because once you shock with high chlorine levels, your pH reading won't be accurate. Then make sure your Alkalinity is within range for your pool setup. i.e. SWG or regular pool. Then adj. your pH. Read this forum and educate yourself. No one here can really walk you through it, there is so much to know. But this forum is a great place to start and you will be well on your way to becoming comfortable with water balancing in no time. A few tidbits to remember. High pH leads to scaling, period. It also makes your chlorine less active. A pH of 8.0 or above leaves only about 20% chlorine available to kill bacteria and contaminants. Too low of pH is corrosive, especially for copper coils in the heat exchangers etc. Alkalinity stabilizes your pH. Too high and it drives up your pH, too low and the pH becomes unstable and swings wildly up and down. Read the post on how to lower Alkalinity, it helps to explain the relationship between Alk and pH. Cyanuric Acid stabilizes your chlorine from the sun. But too high and too much of your chlorine gets "locked" up and it will take more chlorine to be effective. See the Cya/CL chart. However, in your climate I would say you can get by with higher Cyanuric acid. This is a matter of opinion however.
 

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Thanks to everyone for your replies I really appreciate it.

I have not yet been able to shock my pool because I have families with kids staying here using the pool so it has to be somewhat swimmable at least.

However, let me update on what happened. I decided to make the jets stronger, I thought they were not as strong as they used to be and when I got a technician to look at it he fixed a seal and now the difference is very noticeable. Before I did not see my water rotate at all, right now it almost looks like a whirlpool. Miraculousy the water clarity was much better the next day, and the next, and the next and right now it is super clear.

I would say my water is at 90% clarity, I have seen it more clear but this looks great again. My chlorine usage is still very high with over 5ppm drops daily, which indicates that algae are still present. Once raining/low season kicks in here in Bali I will completely scrub the balancing tank and high water pressure the tiles along the infinity edge of the pool which are full with algae and even black algae. I will still proceed with property SLAMMING my pool and doing the OCLT test once the whole pool is scrubbed.

So far I would like to thank you guys for your help, I feel like I have gained a bachelor is swimming pool science just lurking around here.

23-Oktober 21:00 pH:7.4 FC:6+ CYA:70 TA:91 (This reading is after adding 5L liquid chlorine which I do every evening, every 24 hours the free chlorine drops to 2-3ppm)

current.jpg
 
Sounds good.

For information -- it is perfectly safe to swim in the pool with FC at Shock Level based on your CYA. So with your CYA of 70 you could have a FC of 28 ppm and no one would notice the level.

Take care.
 
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