Back after several years! Need help IDing a few valves.

[censored]

Hey all, been a few years since I had a pool and was an active TFP member, but with a new move, I am back in the deep end! But this pool is significantly older than my last.

There are two valves that I need help IDing. I believe they are for main drain and skimmer. If I turn the closest one shut, I get suction at the skimmer. If I open it all the way, the skimmer is off. The other valve appears to be broken, it can open all the way but will never close. I can hear the bearing inside the shutoff freely moving.

At any rate, I am getting terrible pressure, 5 psi at the DE filter. I am sure the pump is the main culprit being 3/4 hp single speed for a 25000 pool. I am already in the process of upgrading the pump to a 2.75 variable speed. Just trying to figure out what this other valve is before I get too deep in things.

Any thoughts?

 

[PoolStored]

I believe they are for main drain and skimmer.

Yep...

You may be able to rebuild the valve that is not working. You can remove and inspect the gate and parts.

 

[proavia]

It may be best to dig down around those 2 pipes, do away with the gate valves and use a single 3-way Jandy valve in their place. You could even reroute the plumbing to provide a more direct line to the pump.

 

[PoolStored]

It may be best to dig down around those 2 pipes, do away with the gate valves and use a single 3-way Jandy valve in their place. You could even reroute the plumbing to provide a more direct line to the pump.

It even looks like it might be very easy, as they have used a strap and bolt pipe coupling seen here:

The Plumber's Choice 1 -1/2 in. Heavy-Duty Stainless Steel No Hub Shielded Pipe Coupling with Clamps NHCS1 - The Home Depot

Heavy-Duty no-hub Pipe Couplings can be used to assemble no-hub pipe and fittings manufactured per ASTM A 888. The couplings consist of a gasket made of an elastomeric com-pound enclosed in a corrugated

www.homedepot.com

 

[censored]

Hey guys thanks for the suggestions. I think I will try to repair the valve. If not, get someone to take those couplers off and run something new.

I was looking more and I noticed this under the skimmer inlet. Separate hook up for a sweep or maybe a pressure side sweep?

 

[censored]

Well found the issue with the valve, it's stripped. Going to see.if I can find one locally, but I have to imagine the gate is stripped as well. I can't get the main housing for the valve off. I assume it is soldered on since they are copper. I did notice when I was trying to wrench on it that the pipes did lift at that coupling. So is it safe to assume I can remove these separate valves at the coupling and replace them with PVC and a 3 way?

 

[JoyfulNoise]

Hey guys thanks for the suggestions. I think I will try to repair the valve. If not, get someone to take those couplers off and run something new.

I was looking more and I noticed this under the skimmer inlet. Separate hook up for a sweep or maybe a pressure side sweep?

View attachment 474796

It’s an equalizer port for the skimmer. If the skimmer gets blocked for some reason, all the flow will come from the equalizer port to avoid losing prime.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

That’s a pretty old pool if it has copper pipes. 1970’s construction? You’ll want to be particularly careful if the pool does have copper pipes and maintain a well balanced pH and TA. Low pH can corrode copper pretty quickly so you’ll want to avoid having any acidic chemicals (stabilized chlorine or muriatic acid) running through the plumbing. So no tab feeders, no acid pumps, etc. I would also avoid using an SWG since you have no idea if the copper plumbing is properly bonded or not.

 

[censored]

House was built in 57 and the pool sometime after, so 70s is probably right. It is old. It's in good shape, but who knows what it going on beneath the surface with the plumbing. I think I am going to try to replace that piping that is above ground with a 3 way and see how that gets me by. We already have a new pump coming.

 

[censored]

Well the couplings slid off, so I am best just to replace all this with PVC and a jandy valve right?

 

[wireform]

What materials are those two pipes

 

[censored]

I believe they are Iron pipes.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

I believe they are Iron pipes.

I was going to say that those look strangely similar to some cast iron pipes I’ve worked on before. The internal layer of corroded iron oxide is a dead give away. Copper doesn’t look like that.

Wow. So the pool was built with cast iron plumbing?!? That would put its construction in the 60’s or early 70’s. Cast iron was used a lot back in those days as it was a much cheaper alternative to copper. PVC didn’t come into accepted use until the early 1980’s and even then most old plumbers refused to work with “junk plastic pipes dang-nabbit!”

Yeeesh. You’ve got a mess on your hands. Those pipes are going to leak at some point. They are pretty much at the end of their service life. I suggest you start saving up now because if you plan to be in this home for a while, a pool remodel will entail digging up the old plumbing a redoing the pool with PVC. Even in the best case scenario, replumbing with PVC is risky because anytime you fool around with the shell, you risk creating a leak. It’s a delicate job that needs someone with expertise and understanding to do right. In other words … lots of $$$$$

Do NOT put an SWG in that pool. Ever. You will accelerate the corrosion of the cast iron immensely. I would also suggest you keep tight control on the TDS/EC of the water. If it starts to go above 2000ppm or more, you need to drain. Not sure why the previous plumber used copper fittings and valves on cast iron pipes?? You never want those metals in contact as the cast iron will corrode from the galvanic couple. Get everything on that exposed side of the equipment pad to be PVC.

 

[censored]

I was going to say that those look strangely similar to some cast iron pipes I’ve worked on before. The internal layer of corroded iron oxide is a dead give away. Copper doesn’t look like that.

Wow. So the pool was built with cast iron plumbing?!? That would put its construction in the 60’s or early 70’s. Caste iron was used a lot back in those days as it was a much cheaper alternative to copper. PVC didn’t come into accepted use until the early 1980’s and even then most old plumbers refused to work with “junk plastic pipes dang-nabbit!”

Yeeesh. You’ve got a mess on your hands. Those pipes are going to leak at some point. They are pretty much at the end of their service life. I suggest you start saving up now because if you plan to be in this home for a while, a pool remodel will entail digging up the old plumbing a redoing the pool with PVC. Even in the best case scenario, replumbing with PVC is risky because anytime you fool around with the shell, you risk creating a leak. It’s a delicate job that needs someone with expertise and understanding to do right. In other words … lots of $$$$$

Do NOT put an SWG in that pool. Ever. You will accelerate the corrosion of the cast iron immensely. I would also suggest you keep tight control on the TDS/EC of the water. If it starts to go above 2000ppm or more, you need to drain. Not sure why the previous plumber used copper fittings and valves on cast iron pipes?? You never want those metals in contact as the cast iron will corrode from the galvanic couple. Get everything on that exposed side of the equipment pad to be PVC.

Thanks Matt, I am local to you. Who would you recommend? I have a call into Patio Pools and Spas to request an appointment.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

Thanks Matt, I am local to you. Who would you recommend? I have a call into Patio Pools and Spas to request an appointment.

See if Azarte Design Group can help. They built a pool in my HOA years ago and did very decent work. They also have done a lot of pools in my local area. You could also try Cimarron Circle Construction as they do pools as well but I have no idea what their work is like. My neighbor had a pool built by Patio years ago when we had our pool built (my PB is no longer in business). I felt that they got way less than we did for basically the same price and Patio does very cookie-cutter type work - they build the pool they know how to build, not the pool that you want. And their service is ridiculously overpriced relative to other pool service companies in this area. I would put Patio on the bottom of your list. You can also contact Presidential Pools as well for a quote.

Remodels and upgrades are a different beast than original pool builds so don't be surprised if companies balk at your job. There's tons of liability issues whenever you touch an old pool and many companies would prefer to just rip out whatever is there and start new.