Ability to Export Pool Math data?

Stoopalini

Gold Supporter
Jun 8, 2020
409
Central Texas
Is there a way to export the data, to something like CSV format, so it can be charted in excel?

Or, does the app or web site already provide charting, and I just missed it?

I think it would be extremely helpful to see trends in charts off different views .... FC loss compared to weather data over time, a time trend of pH, FC, CC, etc ....

I know I can manually input all the data into excel, but thought it would be a nice feature for the app or website to be able to export in a data friendly manner.
 

Holydoc

Gold Supporter
Jul 17, 2016
418
Navarre/FL
So I tried the export this morning, and it seems to only export the testing data. Is there a way to have it include the Add Chemicals data as well?
I second that request. It is getting towards the end of the swim season, and I want to calculate how much chemicals and such the pool cost me this year so that I can budget for next year. Having the "Added Chemicals" is a CSV file would definitely help me to do these calculations.
 

HermanTX

Gold Supporter
May 20, 2020
651
Katy TX
I second that request. It is getting towards the end of the swim season, and I want to calculate how much chemicals and such the pool cost me this year so that I can budget for next year. Having the "Added Chemicals" is a CSV file would definitely help me to do these calculations.
On the main menu - top left - go to Summary. You can customize the date range or select one of the fixed date buttons such as THIS YEAR. It will show how many tests per individual test and how much chemicals added regarding that test. Then as you scroll to bottom it shows all your expenses, maintenance. It does NOT show your notes such as adding water or doing something other than one of the preset dropdowns for maintenance.
I would suggest it be nice to have a maintenance item for Add Water (est. gallons or time).
 

Holydoc

Gold Supporter
Jul 17, 2016
418
Navarre/FL
Herman,

The summary is very nice. I do still wish I could save it as a CSV so that I could load in EXCEL to do trends and monthly without having to go through the manipulations in the app. I am also with you on adding notes as well. (see my notes so that you can see how I mark days where I add water or adjust the SWG which will affect my pool treatments)
 

Leebo

Admin
TFP Expert
LifeTime Supporter
Jul 21, 2011
9,994
Eastern Ohio
I’ve had a note for exporting chemicals and such on a list of things to keep in mind and we’ll bring it up again this Winter. One of the largest holdups we’ve ran into however is that each time we’ve been able to simply build the feature into the App thus removing the need we feel to Export. I suspect next year you’ll see roughly the same mindset as we prepare a new feature for tracking your timers, SWG settings, and so forth. ☺
 

Holydoc

Gold Supporter
Jul 17, 2016
418
Navarre/FL
I’ve had a note for exporting chemicals and such on a list of things to keep in mind and we’ll bring it up again this Winter. One of the largest holdups we’ve ran into however is that each time we’ve been able to simply build the feature into the App thus removing the need we feel to Export. I suspect next year you’ll see roughly the same mindset as we prepare a new feature for tracking your timers, SWG settings, and so forth. ☺
Problem is that with people like me who work as Analysts for a living, we love to evaluate everything and discover new trends. I take all my testing and evaluate at what temps I need to adjust my SWG and to what percentage. I can tell you how many of inches of water needs to be displaced in my pool by rain before I need to check my CYA and add the "Ducky of Pucks". These and many more statistics are all items, I do not expect the App to ever calculate because it means nothing to anyone else but me. However without the App exporting all the information I put in it, I am forced to hand jam it in myself for EXCEL.

It is true that everyone has a different mindset when developing products. Heck, I bet the bleach companies never thought that us TFP members would be looking at their chlorine content and not just the word BLEACH. In my case, I am looking at not only the results as presented in the App but also the cause. :)
 

JoyfulNoise

TFP Expert
Platinum Supporter
May 23, 2015
17,279
Tucson, AZ
At some point in time, it may be justifiable to split the App up into two versions - one simple (free or cheaply available) app for logging data and doing minimal tracking and calculations and then a second, more expensive app, for doing more advanced data storage and analytics. If too many features get added to an app, it can start to get bloated. There are different market segments here - people that just want something simple and people that want to be eggheads and do lots of data manipulation. Whenever we have to add a feature that requires a lot of calculations or data manipulations, it takes A LOT OF TIME to debug and beta test. That tends to have the effect of slowing down the roll-out of simpler features and UI/UX updates.

So rather than canning a feature like Export to CSV, perhaps it's time to start thinking about different offerings. If people want an app that can do complex data analytics, or include Alexa/Siri/Google AI support, then that might require that segment to pony up more dough ... sorry, time is money, there's only 24 hours in a day, and our App developer has a life beyond TFP....
 

Rattus Suffocatus

Silver Supporter
Jun 5, 2019
1,192
Corona de Tucson, AZ
The funny thing is that for "fun stuff" like the pool, I don't want to do my normal "egghead" routine, like I do for stuff I get paid for. I've been criticized for that in my beer brewing and coffee roasting groups, too, but "fun" is supposed to be "fun" and not "Work"...

For me I tend to forget to fill out the "add chemical" portion a lot anyway since it's almost always MA or Bleach (for the hot tub or in the winter), in mostly fixed amounts, anyway... I try not to add anything else. I suppose when I added salt and CYA I did log it because that's "special" for my pools.

I STILL would like the option of teaspoons and tablespoons for liquids for the 245 gallon detached hot tub (this one is easy, and I never remember the conversion... so I always have to Google it). It's annoying to add 0.3 fl.oz. of acid in the tub when I did a teaspoon and a half(-ish)....PLEASE?!?

What I think would be more useful to ask for an addition to the app is a place to keep track of what you actually buy for the pool, and then that can be sorted out. It might make more sense to have a list of bottles of chlorine and MA and price paid for that sort of analysis than keeping track of the number of ounces used in a year. I guess for budgeting it's all going to be close anyway, but you'd have a more accurate burn rate tracking the consumables that way.... That I'd probably actually do and use... I mean if you spend $75 a year on pink flamingo floaties, that should count too, right?

Google analytics for your pool?!? The world is going to end in a fiery virus induced death soon because of all of this stuff, I suppose... You'd have to offer an API for live sensor data then, wouldn't you? Of Course!
 

Stoopalini

Gold Supporter
Jun 8, 2020
409
Central Texas
I’ve had a note for exporting chemicals and such on a list of things to keep in mind and we’ll bring it up again this Winter. One of the largest holdups we’ve ran into however is that each time we’ve been able to simply build the feature into the App thus removing the need we feel to Export. I suspect next year you’ll see roughly the same mindset as we prepare a new feature for tracking your timers, SWG settings, and so forth. ☺
I must say, the app is really, really well done! So whatever you're doing to drive feature request priority, dev work, and test ... I wouldn't change a thing! :D

Whenever we have to add a feature that requires a lot of calculations or data manipulations, it takes A LOT OF TIME to debug and beta test. That tends to have the effect of slowing down the roll-out of simpler features and UI/UX updates.

So rather than canning a feature like Export to CSV, perhaps it's time to start thinking about different offerings. If people want an app that can do complex data analytics, or include Alexa/Siri/Google AI support, then that might require that segment to pony up more dough ... sorry, time is money, there's only 24 hours in a day, and our App developer has a life beyond TFP....
As a 23 year veteran in IT, I completely understand what you are saying here. Although the request being discussed here is simply raw data export, to include the "Chemicals Added" data, as well as the "Testing Results" data. This should be a fairly easy, straight forward, add to the existing export.

But to your point ... if you were to ask "why" someone wanted that data, and then attempt to incorporate the end use into the app (ie: predicting trends, tracking water replacement against chemical changes with respect to weather data, etc, etc ..) ... now you're talking involved analytics and analysis of the data, as well as a UI change to be able to display it.

I don't think you need two versions of the app though ... just simply provide the raw data to the geeks who want to dig deeper, as those users will have the skills to be able to do it themselves anyway :) The more simple users just won't ever export the data for this purpose. The more advanced users would most likely prefer to do it themselves anyway, since they'll always identify something they feel is missing within the app's analysis of the data.
 

Stoopalini

Gold Supporter
Jun 8, 2020
409
Central Texas
@Holydoc Have you looked at the backup file? It contains all the data, including the "Add Chemicals" and local weather data. It looks like it could be parsed fairly easily too. It may be just XML formatting, although I'm no expert in XML formats LOL

I renamed the extension to CSV, and opened it in Excel. With a smartly written Macro or VBS script, it could probably be formatted into a useful state.
 

Leebo

Admin
TFP Expert
LifeTime Supporter
Jul 21, 2011
9,994
Eastern Ohio
At some point in time, it may be justifiable to split the App up into two versions - one simple (free or cheaply available) app for logging data and doing minimal tracking and calculations and then a second, more expensive app, for doing more advanced data storage and analytics.
This sounds like work, you know I don’t like to do that! 😂

When it comes to suggestions for the App the one thing to note is I never look at something as wrong. I totally grasp the idea @Holydoc that you may wanna geek out at the data. That’s not right, that’s not wrong, that’s what you want. My task is to make sure what we’re building is something enough people want and that it helps enough people with their pools.

When looking at data I always tend to ask myself “what question am i answering?” My goal is to answer as many questions Pool owners have within the App. I don’t want you to need Excel, I’d prefer you to want to use PoolMath. 😂 Take for example this comment,
It is getting towards the end of the swim season, and I want to calculate how much chemicals and such the pool cost me this year so that I can budget for next year. Having the "Added Chemicals" is a CSV file would definitely help me to do these calculations.
I totally agree a ton of users have this mindset, so let’s build it. This quote was the exact train of thought behind the summary page.

All this said, let’s get to the meat and potatoes,
I greatly suspect we’ll be doing an update soon. By soon I mean in the next few months. I say this knowing the App is built by one guy and Input of ideas by a few others. Each of us are being weighed down by changes from Covid. I know that’s an excuse, but it’s a legit one. Once we do get back on track however I do see many of the suggestions here being minor items. The key however is if we’re able to fit them into a “schedule” or not. Next build we’re wanting to Accomplish two things,
1. Improve new member onboarding
2. Create an improved method for tracking timers, SWG settings, and various automation items.

Truth is on number 2 we’re close to being done. But we’ve been close for like 5 months now. 😂 Once we’re done with these two goals we’ll review suggestions and see what we can knock out. 👍
 

Rattus Suffocatus

Silver Supporter
Jun 5, 2019
1,192
Corona de Tucson, AZ
A raw data dump is certainly a way to do it. Then you don't have to assume what the users will use it for. If something comes out of it (from the raw data dump) that makes sense to make an app feature, then make it an app feature. If you put too much stuff into a GUI then the perception of the quality of the software actually goes down. It's crazy but controlled studies have shown that a GUI written well as a front end of something totally buggy gets better ratings from users and the perception is that it works better then a cluttered or awkward one that is bug free.

And no offense to Leebo, or anyone else working on this because I am primarily a Microsoft C# guy for a living myself.. the Xamarin interface is a bit convoluted to start off with. They have done a great job with the Pool Math interface, there are only one or two small things that are not intuitive IMHO to me and I'm weird. So for most people it probably would be intuitive! :)

I still want to see teaspoons or teaspoons and tablespoons added though for hot tubs. I'll keep asking until I get annoying... that won't screw up the GUI at all... :)
 
  • Like
Reactions: Leebo

JoyfulNoise

TFP Expert
Platinum Supporter
May 23, 2015
17,279
Tucson, AZ
Just remember that you’ll need the app to be cognizant of which continent you inhabit because a US tablespoon is a different volume than a British/Canadian tablespoon which is a different volume than an Australian tablespoon ...

Perhaps @Rattus Suffocatus needs to dose his tub in metric units 🤣
 
  • Haha
Reactions: Stoopalini