New salt pool - Pool guy wrong? Or me?

[Jimrahbe]

I assume I will want to run the pump during the day instead so I can do the OCLT without pump running with the SWG producing.

E,

Just go into ScreenLogic and set the output % to zero... and let the pump run...

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[wireform]

I would say with no CYA and low FC there's got to be something brewing. My take is get 30 CYA in and do a slam which can be done and over in1-2 days. This way there's no surprises 2 weeks in after the algae festers.

 

[setsailsoon]

Thanks, sorry, the CC was .2, by pool water quality, do you mean testing the source water? I hadn't done that yet.

.2 on CC is great. Sorry for the vague question about water quality; I simply was asking how does your pool look? Crystal clear, slightly cloudy or discolored? Try the coin test if your not sure.

 

[setsailsoon]

72,

A couple questions for you:

• What's the model of your swg?
• What are your %power and run-time?

Reason I ask is that as mentioned above 2.5 ppm is pretty low especially if you start the evening at 2 ppm. Could be you do indeed have a brewing algae problem or an undersized cell (happens all the time with new pools) or a combination of both. I would definitely do an OCLT test as soon as you can and yes, do what Jim said to turn it off during the test.

Chris

 

[JJ_Tex]

Actually we also talk about ATT stadium being a tornado evacuation center for the unlikelihood of touchdowns there.

Hey now, those are fighting words. This is going to be the year, I just know it

 

[EDAM72]

.2 on CC is great. Sorry for the vague question about water quality; I simply was asking how does your pool look? Crystal clear, slightly cloudy or discolored? Try the coin test if your not sure.

The water looks pretty clear, I can see the vacuum cleaner port clearly at bottom of pool. However, I do think there is a slight algae growth, as running my hand across wall gives that 'dust' appearance in the water I have seen before with algae.

 

[setsailsoon]

The water looks pretty clear, I can see the vacuum cleaner port clearly at bottom of pool. However, I do think there is a slight algae growth, as running my hand across wall gives that 'dust' appearance in the water I have seen before with algae.

Good news is you know what to do from your years of TFP... for a salt pool you just us a different CYA chart. Everything else is about the same. Do use the sock for your CYA. Worked great for me just squeeze a couple time and it'll all be gone in a couple days.

Looks like you've got this Buddy!

Chris

 

[EDAM72]

72,

A couple questions for you:

• What's the model of your swg?
• What are your %power and run-time?

Reason I ask is that as mentioned above 2.5 ppm is pretty low especially if you start the evening at 2 ppm. Could be you do indeed have a brewing algae problem or an undersized cell (happens all the time with new pools) or a combination of both. I would definitely do an OCLT test as soon as you can and yes, do what Jim said to turn it off during the test.

Chris

I checked, its an IC40, running at 80%. They have current programing at - Pump comes on at 945pm in low speed, then at 10pm it jumps to high speed (i'll need to log in on PC when able to check the rpm settings), till 4am, then back to low speed till 7am.....
I dont know the pool gallons, I'll measure tomorrow to get an estimate of the size. I am guessing 10-12k gallons, could be less.

Also, I said water was clear, but can definitely see a ton of solids floating in the water I don't typically see in my old pool. So I'll do the CYA, FC and maybe some clarifier or flocculent to help the filter or to help the vacuum system out when it falls to floor. Sounds like I'll need to run pump a bit anyway just to help get rid of all that.

And last, I went and got water tested, pool store was actually pretty close to my original test, even though I was using them for the metals.
Copper came to .1
Iron 0

Thank for all the advice, I'll get this thing in shape!

 

[wireform]

So I'll do the CYA, FC and maybe some clarifier or flocculent to help the filter or to help the vacuum system out when it falls to floor

No, don't put any of that stuff in. Stay out of the pool store as they can't possibly help you.

 

[setsailsoon]

lso, I said water was clear, but can definitely see a ton of solids floating in the water I don't typically see in my old pool. So I'll do the CYA, FC and maybe some clarifier or flocculent to help the filter or to help the vacuum system out when it falls to floor. Sounds like I'll need to run pump a bit anyway just to help get rid of all that.

Clarifier and flocculent are chemicals we don't recommend. They will most likely plug your filters and require replacing the elements. I've used floc in commercial water plants many times. Residential pools are just not designed to work with floc.

Your swg should be adding 4.2 ppm if your pool is 12K. If it were me, I'd get rid of the pool service and implement TFP methods asap. The sooner you do this the sooner your pool will be looking great and be another easy salt pool. If you go this route just need to get back to basics of TFP. ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry. Check/clean filters if needed, scrub the pool, remove any debris, vacuum etc. and run an OCLT test.Overnight Chlorine Loss Test If it shows algae SLAM SLAM Process until you pass all 3 tests.

This is what I'd do but everybody has their own preferences. If you prefer to do something else that's fine and we'll be here to help as much as we can but you really won't get a real TFP pool until you fully implement TFP methods.

Chris

 

[EDAM72]

Clarifier and flocculent are chemicals we don't recommend. They will most likely plug your filters and require replacing the elements. I've used floc in commercial water plants many times. Residential pools are just not designed to work with floc.

Your swg should be adding 4.2 ppm if your pool is 12K. If it were me, I'd get rid of the pool service and implement TFP methods asap. The sooner you do this the sooner your pool will be looking great and be another easy salt pool. If you go this route just need to get back to basics of TFP. ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry. Check/clean filters if needed, scrub the pool, remove any debris, vacuum etc. and run an OCLT test.Overnight Chlorine Loss Test If it shows algae SLAM SLAM Process until you pass all 3 tests.

This is what I'd do but everybody has their own preferences. If you prefer to do something else that's fine and we'll be here to help as much as we can but you really won't get a real TFP pool until you fully implement TFP methods.

Chris

Thanks! No, I am definitely taking your recommendations. It worked for me for years with my chlorine pool. In fact my subscription for pool math just renewed and reminded me I want to donate some more for the help I get here!

Met with pool guy that was taking care of pool, and he seemed flabbergasted that there was no CYA (he tried to say its at least 50...as he dips a strip and shows none) . I have taken over the pool now myself and no one else will be touching it. He didn't even clean the baskets and stuff that last owner had paid him this week for. SMH.

Well, it is all mine now, so thanks for all the info, I'll be doing the FC and CYA today, clean it, then start OCLT and SLAM if needed (but I am guessing it will somewhat). He said pool is 13-15k so measuring to get a better estimate.

Last question here, he said it is due for a drain and refill. He said in AZ people just drain every 3-5 years. So, what is everyone's thought on that. If high TDS, etc, should I just start fresh? When I brush and the cleaner nozzles are active, you can see so many large particles floating in water, some look like calcium chunks. Or go ahead to continue and balance the pool.

 

[mknauss]

he said it is due for a drain and refill. He said in AZ people just drain every 3-5 years.

More often if they use trichlor and do not control their chemistry.

You reported a CH of 590. That is not that high and pretty manageable by tracking CSI.

Does this house have a whole house water softener? Using softened water for fill water will reduce the draining requirements to nil.

 

[EDAM72]

More often if they use trichlor and do not control their chemistry.

You reported a CH of 590. That is not that high and pretty manageable by tracking CSI.

Does this house have a whole house water softener? Using softened water for fill water will reduce the draining requirements to nil.

Thanks sir. Yes the house has a whole house water softener but someone said the hose bids may not be going through it. I'll be testing the salt level of the water to see if it goes through it.

 

[mknauss]

Test the CH of the fill water. Water softener does not add salt to the water.

 

[setsailsoon]

72,

Marty has been dealing with AZ water since the start of time... sorry Marty I couldn't help myself. I'll be following this closely since our next pool is going to have to deal with extremely hard Florida well water. So my life is going to take a turn toward the AZ desert even though I'm in one of the rainiest states there is.

Congrats in taking control of your salt pool. After your liquid chlorine TFP experience you're gonna be in hog heaven with a salt pool!

Chris

 

[EDAM72]

Test the CH of the fill water. Water softener does not add salt to the water.

The fill water doesn't go through softener it seems. But not as hard as the water I had in Santee CA.
Water through softener had a CH of 10 and salt 600,
Water through hose (and auto filler for pool) CH 150 and salt 200.

The house has a salt water softener. My last house had a whole house water filter and saltless water conditioner (filtersorb) to stop scale.

The pool water is hard to get an accurate reading for CH for me, as it seems to have a slow turn point in the color here.

I am reading up more on the salt generation of the IC40 as well. It states it

• Produces up to 1.40 pounds (635 g) of pure chlorine every 24 hours. I assume the is at 100% for 24hrs and there is math to do depending on your run time and the percent out put.

My test now is
FC 6
PH 8
TA 70
CH 590
CYA judging by cloudiness almost to 30 - been adding slowly so as not to go over
salt 3800
temp89
CSI .51

By this evening the FC should be around 5 and I'll run an OCLT. The salt cell has been set to 0 output.
CYA should be 30 by then too.

Thanks for checking in, it is slowly getting under control and having fun getting it there. Pool care for me is cathartic, relaxing to me.

 

[setsailsoon]

Produces up to 1.40 pounds (635 g) of pure chlorine every 24 hours. I assume the is at 100% for 24hrs and there is math to do depending on your run time and the percent out put.

Yep, correct. Easy way to do this is to use Pool Math under "effects of adding" from the menu button top left of the screen. No extra math needed. Just plug in the numbers, model of your swg (click the magnifying glass for a drop down list or enter the chlorine production per day manually), pool volume and it will calculate ppm FC added for a given % power and runtime.

 

[EDAM72]

Yep, correct. Easy way to do this is to use Pool Math under "effects of adding" from the menu button top left of the screen. No extra math needed. Just plug in the numbers, model of your swg (click the magnifying glass for a drop down list or enter the chlorine production per day manually), pool volume and it will calculate ppm FC added for a given % power and runtime.

Wow, thanks so much, my subscription to Pool math just got better, I had no idea it would do this. Makes it super easy!

 

[EDAM72]

OK, did OCLT, no loss. So right now going out to clean cartridge filters, then will try to look at cell and clean that as well after going to get the adaptor for the cell to clean it. It is showing low salt, though salt is fine. Running the diag on it shows no other issues.
Recent test
FC 5.5
CC .5 (last time I did the .2 test and is was .2, so guessing minimal, and guessing it is fighting what's in the filter that hasn't ben cleaned in at least 6 months)
PH 8
TA 70
CH 590
CYA 40
Salt 3800

Thanks for the help all. I'll post final readings after cleaning everything.

 

[ajw22]

What model SWG and cell do you have? I don't see it in your signature.

Only clean the cell with acid if there is visible white scale on the plates that cannot be cleaned off with strong blasts of water and scraping with a Popsicle stick. Acid cleaning removes rare earths from the plates and reduces the life of the cell everytime you do it.