Phosphates....

[Sunnydaze]

To start off, I know the TFP method relies on maintaining FC according to the CYA/FC chart to prevent algae which makes phosphates mostly irrelevant. However, I read a comment from Richard Falk on the below article where he says TFP doesn't promote phosphate removal due to simplicity of message over saving of chlorine but phosphate removal is still a valid approach for added insurance.

Bob Lowry: A Practical Take on the “Great CYA Debate”

Water chemistry expert Bob Lowry shares his response to our “Great CYA Debate” panel held at the PSP Expo in New Orleans.

aquamagazine.com

Say you were going on vacation and you couldn't guarantee your FC would stay above the minimum the entire time, would it be helpful to remove phosphates (assuming they're high) for extra layer of security against algae? Or simply keeping phosphates low to help in case your FC got below the minimum for a day or 2? Are there any cons to using phosphate removers if you didn't mind spending the money?

 

[mguzzy]

Well those are loaded questions. Yes removing phosphates will make pool management easier since you are removing a limiting nutrient. And you will have more leeway on the FC drifting down as a result. So its a false sense of security, you still need to keep your FC in range. Don't think that by removing what the algae eats that you can get away with less or no chlorine. Chlorine also disinfects bacteria growth as well. that is a different critter.

I see you are using liquid chlorine for a sanitizer. There is anecdotal evidence that high phosphates will affect the performance of SWG cells. But we haven't seen any controlled studies to confirm it.. just manufacture guidelines that say so.. but that isn't proof.

There are many users that will control phosphates, for whatever reason you can manage your pool how you want. I happen to be one of them. I get a lot of winter run off from a garden area that forms the backdrop of my pool. I find things are easier to control if I do a phosphate treatment as a part of my spring start up. BUT phosphate removers will create a gunky precipitate that will clog your filters that you will need to clean off. If you don't the phosphates will flush back into your pool water and you will be left with clogged unusable filters. I use an older second set of filters for that. and then I swap them for my newer ones that I will use for the regular season. Good luck.

 

[Leebo]

Are there any cons to using phosphate removers if you didn't mind spending the money?

Absolutely there can be, depending on the conditions. One of the largest is cloudy water for a day or two. Take a look at the following article on TFP with some more info,

Phosphate Removers - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com

 

[Sunnydaze]

Absolutely there can be, depending on the conditions. One of the largest is cloudy water for a day or two. Take a look at the following article on TFP with some more info,

Phosphate Removers - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com

Thank you. The link answers everything I wanted to know.

 

[Halszy]

Well those are loaded questions. Yes removing phosphates will make pool management easier since you are removing a limiting nutrient. And you will have more leeway on the FC drifting down as a result. So its a false sense of security, you still need to keep your FC in range. Don't think that by removing what the algae eats that you can get away with less or no chlorine. Chlorine also disinfects bacteria growth as well. that is a different critter.

I see you are using liquid chlorine for a sanitizer. There is anecdotal evidence that high phosphates will affect the performance of SWG cells. But we haven't seen any controlled studies to confirm it.. just manufacture guidelines that say so.. but that isn't proof.

There are many users that will control phosphates, for whatever reason you can manage your pool how you want. I happen to be one of them. I get a lot of winter run off from a garden area that forms the backdrop of my pool. I find things are easier to control if I do a phosphate treatment as a part of my spring start up. BUT phosphate removers will create a gunky precipitate that will clog your filters that you will need to clean off. If you don't the phosphates will flush back into your pool water and you will be left with clogged unusable filters. I use an older second set of filters for that. and then I swap them for my newer ones that I will use for the regular season. Good luck.

The two pool stores near me both tell me my cloudy pool is a result of very high Phosphates because of the early spring and crazy high pollens this year. Every morning the pool surface was covered with yellow pollens as was patio furniture, etc. We opened the pool in mid April because it was very warm but that means the heavy pollens have been adding up in the pool for two months. I have completed 3 rounds of Phosphate killers (called PHOS out 3000 by Regal) which gathers pollen phosphates & sinks them to the bottom (like fluffy clouds) which then gets vacuumed out on waste. It is improving water clarity but they tell me readings are still very high & needs another double dose at $35 per bottle. Any advice? Halszy

 

[mknauss]

Read the articles linked earlier in the thread. Use a quality remover if you are going to do it.

 

[mguzzy]

Howdy Halsey and welcome to the forum.
[The mods may very well spin this off into its own thread.. they like to keep everyone in their own thread]

So you didn't tell us what the pool store told your phosphate levels were... and even if they did we wouldn't believe them. Pool stores are notorious for getting it wrong. There are other reasons your pool is cloudy and phosphates are a common scapegoat. You could be in the beginning of an algae bloom and that is often the result of low Chlorine. Can you post up your test results so we can see what your pools chemistry is? But it will have to be YOUR results from a reliable testkit. Its how we do things here... so here's some stuff to read. Post your readings when you get your own test kit (if you don't have one) and we will go from there. If you still want to do a phosphate removal I'll tell you which product(s) you should use. PhosOut is not very effective.

ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry
FC/CYA Levels
Test Kits Compared
Recommended Levels

 

[Katodude]

So first dont depend on pool store testing for ANYTHING, and especially for phosphates. The phosphate test requires timing the reagents. So when the pool store tested for phosphates did you see any of them use a stop watch?

If you want to jump into the phosphate pool (pun intended). Get a phosphate test kit (they are pretty cheap). Test precisely, and then determine if you need treatment. If so buy commercial grade Phosphate removers. Other people have listed the products to use.