Probably a stupid question...

[dcaton]

I'm replacing my pump and am going to take this opportunity to fix the shoddy plumbing work done by the last few people who worked on the pool.

I have a single skimmer and a main drain plumbed into the skimmer, with one of those flying saucer floats in the bottom. To vacuum the pool I have a plate that sits on top of the skimmer basket. While I'm vacuuming, the skimmer can't do its job and it's a minor pain to set it all up. It also precludes me from using an automated cleaner that uses suction.

If I was having the pool replastered I'd look into having a suction port added, but I'm not about to go drilling a hole in the side of my pool. Which brings me to the stupid question: is it feasible to have a suction port above the water line? I could add a valve and some sort of port to the pump inlet pipe. It would make attaching the vacuum hose a lot more convenient, and I might even be able to get my wife to vacuum the pool if all she needed to do was attach the hose and turn a valve.

I have a feeling though that the vacuum created by the pump and/or the downward pressure on the water in the submerged part of the hose would be insufficient and the pump would cavitate. Or is such an arrangement actually workable?

 

[JJ_Tex]

That seems like a lot of effort to add a suction port. Have you considered a robot? All it needs is an electrical outlet.

 

[Texas Splash]

Robot - that would be my suggestion as well. Leave the pool & plumbing alone and clean independently. Now I can't confirm one of your questions, but trying to develop an above-ground suction line seems questionable only because the slightest leak and air will get in there. Even when I'm cleaning with my vacuum hose in the water, my pump level drops from increased loss of suction. That's why I have my doubts above the waterline. If you have the time and parts, you could experiment I suppose.

 

[dcaton]

That seems like a lot of effort to add a suction port. Have you considered a robot? All it needs is an electrical outlet.

The effort would be trivial. As I said, I'm installing a new pump and cleaning up the plumbing anyhow.

 

[Jimrahbe]

D,

You mean like this one???

092.JPG

• Jimrahbe
• Apr 4, 2017

I used this before I pulled my head out of ... a dark place, and found out how well robots worked.. I did exactly what you are suggesting..

You can see where I can turn the Jandy valve before the pump to suck water from the pool or the "nub" where the vacuum hose would go, or really a combination of both, so that the pump would never run out of water.

It is still there, but has not been used in at least 6 or 7 years..

Oh! and yes, I know they are DWV pipes but I don't care and apparently they don't either as they work just fine...

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[ajw22]

A suction vacuum pool cleaner is the worst type of cleaner to have. I would not recommend anyone this century install one.

A pressure side cleaner with a booster pump is superior but inefficient compared to a robot cleaner.

In your situation a robot cleaner should be a no brainer.

 

[dcaton]

Robot - that would be my suggestion as well. Leave the pool & plumbing alone and clean independently. Now I can't confirm one of your questions, but trying to develop an above-ground suction line seems questionable only because the slightest leak and air will get in there. Even when I'm cleaning with my vacuum hose in the water, my pump level drops from increased loss of suction. That's why I have my doubts above the waterline. If you have the time and parts, you could experiment I suppose.

I'd put a valve behind the suction port; I wouldn't rely on the suction port itself to be air tight. I was just wondering if anyone had done something like this. The pump is drawing water above the water line, so does it really make a difference if the water is being drawn through a pipe or hose? I really don't want to experiment once I install the new pump, but I also don't want to waste time experimenting with the existing pump if there's some fundamental reason why it can't work, or it's just a bad idea.

 

[tim5055]

As others have said, yes it will work.

As almost all of us, including me say - buy a robot and forget the idea.

Sustion side and pressure side cleaners are yesterdays technology. Buy a robot.

 

[dcaton]

D,

You mean like this one???

092.JPG

• Jimrahbe
• Apr 4, 2017

I used this before I pulled my head out of ... a dark place, and found out how well robots worked.. I did exactly what you are suggesting..

You can see where I can turn the Jandy valve before the pump to suck water from the pool or the "nub" where the vacuum hose would go, or really a combination of both, so that the pump would never run out of water.

It is still there, but has not been used in at least 6 or 7 years..

Oh! and yes, I know they are DWV pipes but I don't care and apparently they don't either as they work just fine...

Thanks,

Jim R.

Yes, that's exactly what I was thinking, except that I was thinking about using a suction port rather than permanently attaching the hose (which I assume you did).

I have no doubt that robots work just fine and eventually I'll get one, it's just not in the budget right now. Too many other necessary repairs take precedence over a pool robot at the moment. A $40 Jandy valve and a few pvc fittings is doable though.

So... did it work or was it problematic?

The DWV pipes probably aren't likely to burst given the relatively low pressure, and the sweep 90's probably present less resistance. I don't think they make sweep 90's in schedule 40.

 

[dcaton]

As others have said, yes it will work.

As almost all of us, including me say - buy a robot and forget the idea.

Sustion side and pressure side cleaners are yesterdays technology. Buy a robot.

Tim, it's not a question of whether robots work, it's just not in the budget right now. Neither was a new pool pump but I don't have any choice about that. Adding another $40 valve isn't going to break the bank, and I thought it might make vacuuming the pool a bit more convenient until the time comes when I can buy a good robot.

 

[Jimrahbe]

I was thinking about using a suction port rather than permanently attaching the hose (which I assume you did).

D,

The hose was not permanently attached.. You just remove the white cap on the end and plug the hose it...

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[dcaton]

D,

The hose was not permanently attached.. You just remove the white cap on the end and plug the hose it...

Thanks,

Jim R.

Ok. I understand you don't need it anymore, but before you got a robot, did it work as you expected, or were there problems? Thanks.
Don

 

[Arizonarob]

Oh! and yes, I know they are DWV pipes but I don't care and apparently they don't either as they work just fine...

You tell em Jim!

Don, what Jim showed you in the picture will work fine as long as you keep the hose filled with water.
If it were ME, I would run the PVC to the pool edge and down into the water about 6”, so that way you could just submerge the hose and hook it up.

 

[dcaton]

If it were ME, I would run the PVC to the pool edge and down into the water about 6”, so that way you could just submerge the hose and hook it up.

Thought about that, but it would be a tripping hazard, and not look all that great. The place where I plan on putting the hose connection is only about 5' from the pool edge, so I should be able to hook it up without getting too much air in the hose.

It's minimal cost to set it up, so I'm going to give it a shot a see how well it works. Eventually we're going to get a robot, so I'm just looking to make things a little more convenient until then (and maybe I can get my wife to vacuum the pool if all she has to do is turn a valve ? ).

 

[Jimrahbe]

D,

I was only using it to run a manual vacuum and for that it worked fine.. Most of the time it was in the configuration you can see in the pic. When I wanted to vacuum, I would connect the hose and vacuum head..

The "genius" of this design is that I never had to worry about trying to fill the hose with water. At the time I had a single speed pump. I would start the pump with the Jandy valve set to all skimmer.. Then, with the vac hose connected, I would slowly open the Jandy valve.. This would allow the vac hose to fill with water. I could then adjust the suction so that the vac hose and skimmer would both work together.. If I tried to run all vac hose, the pump could not suck enough water through the hose and it would run out of water.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Eventually we're going to get a robot, so I'm just looking to make things a little more convenient until then (and maybe I can get my wife to vacuum the pool if all she has to do is turn a valve

D,

If you can get your wife to vacuum the pool, just once.... she will buy you a robot...

Jim R.

 

[Rancho Cost-a-Lotta]

Have you thought about a robot

Just kidding

The biggest challenge will be establishing an air-tight connection on the pool side of the plumbing. I found out for myself that vacuum hoses are not designed to be airtight.

Let us know how it works out.

 

[dcaton]

D,

I was only using it to run a manual vacuum and for that it worked fine.. Most of the time it was in the configuration you can see in the pic. When I wanted to vacuum, I would connect the hose and vacuum head..

The "genius" of this design is that I never had to worry about trying to fill the hose with water. At the time I had a single speed pump. I would start the pump with the Jandy valve set to all skimmer.. Then, with the vac hose connected, I would slowly open the Jandy valve.. This would allow the vac hose to fill with water. I could then adjust the suction so that the vac hose and skimmer would both work together.. If I tried to run all vac hose, the pump could not suck enough water through the hose and it would run out of water.

Thanks,

Jim R.

What type of fitting did you use to connect the vacuum hose? I bought this from Amazon, thinking vacuum inputs were a standard size, but the opening is too small. I had intended to screw this into a 1 1/2" female threaded adapter. The thread size is correct, but Hayward must use a smaller hose size for their cleaners. I also bought a barb type fitting from Lowes, but the barb is just a bit too big for the hose. Thanks.

Hayward W400BWHP White Free Rotation Vacuum Lock Safety Wall Fitting

 

[Rancho Cost-a-Lotta]

Mine uses something like this Amazon.com: Hayward V094P Automatic Pool Cleaner Regulator Valve for All Hayward Suction Cleaners: Garden & Outdoor.

You could probably find an adapter cone without a regulator. Not sure what your plan is, but it won't be airtight.

 

[dcaton]

Mine uses something like this Amazon.com: Hayward V094P Automatic Pool Cleaner Regulator Valve for All Hayward Suction Cleaners: Garden & Outdoor.

You could probably find an adapter cone without a regulator. Not sure what your plan is, but it won't be airtight.

I found this: https://www.lowes.com/pd/Aqua-EZ-Hose-Adapter/3151503 this morning at Lowes. Looks like it ought to work and it was only $1.09.

I don't expect it to be airtight, just tight enough that whatever (hopefully minimal) air does get by isn't enough to prevent the pump from pulling water through the hose. Some o-ring lubricant on the fitting might help too. It's an experiment, basically.