Any plumbers?

[CJadamec]

Is more of a 30 rack kind of job. I also do heating work.

 

[HousePlumber]

Those webstone iso flanges are nice

@op that 2 x 1 1/2 bushing isn’t threaded but I’ll agree with the others how have said you’re probably going to find a partially clogged and you should add an automatic vent
I don’t mind seeing 2 separate traps and I don’t think that they are causing your problems.

 

[CJadamec]

The webstone flanges and valves are worth every penny. They save a lot of time and soldering.

 

[zea3]

That's impressive and I don't even know what I'm looking at!

 

[Dirk]

It's definitely the two traps. When one line is flushing, it can suck the water out of the other trap and possibly expose your sinks to sewer gas, which might be what you're smelling. Also, (hard to tell in your pic), the drain from the DW should lead to an air gap that is mounted above on the sink, on the non-disposal side, then back down to your disposal, not the other sink (which is where it looks to be now). This isn't a big deal, but if it runs to the disposal, then crud from the DW would get chewed up in the disposer, instead of possibly jamming up in the drain plumbing. If you can't run an air gap, you can just connect the DW drain line to the disposal, but it must loop way up in the cabinet, as high as possible, before it comes back down to connect to the DW.

If you've had water shooting every which way, you might have pumped waste water into your DW at one point, so that might have started something growing somewhere.

You can fix this yourself for about $20 if you can find a Lowes or HD. Get a single-trap setup for two sinks. They come with a special T that has a baffle in it that directs water from either sink down the drain, but blocks each sink drain from pushing water to the other. That doesn't seem to be what you have installed. And I believe they need to be vertical to work properly. So the pic in post #10 is what it should all look like. See how the DW drain loops higher than where it enters the disposer? That's correct(ish), though it should be a bit higher if possible, like jammed up behind the sink so it's touching the underside of the counter. Again, that's your second best option, connecting it to an air gap is the better way to do it.

Now if you have a stinky DW, or a drain clog, those are just making matters worse. You'll have to address those issues, too, but the drain plumbing is an easy fix. It all goes together hand tight and you can cut that stuff with a sharp knife or hacksaw (though be sure to de-burr the cuts). Your plumber went with DWV all glued together, and that's fine, but it's harder to work with, and, as you're about to find out, harder to take apart when you need to...

 

[CJadamec]

Thats a wall hung condensing gas furnace 96% efficient. The front cover is off so you can see all the electronic controls you can also see the gas valve and some of the burner/heat exchanger.

To the left the big gray tank is an indirect fired hot water heater. The furnace sends hot water to the tank to make all the hot water for the house.

To the right is the piping to connect to the hot water baseboard heating zones to heat the house. Along with valves and pumps and other equipment to keep things working smoothly.

Far right all the small red tubes are hot water pipes going to all the sinks and everything else that needs hot water.

The PVC pipe coming out of the top is supply air for the furnace and the exhaust vent for the furnace.

Under the furnace is all 1" copper pipes to send water heated by the furnace where it needs to go.

The one black iron pipe is the propane supply to the furnace.

 

[PoolGate]

It's definitely the two traps. When one line is flushing, it can suck the water out of the other trap and possibly expose your sinks to sewer gas, which might be what you're smelling. Also, (hard to tell in your pic), the drain from the DW should lead to an air gap that is mounted above on the sink, on the non-disposal side, then back down to your disposal, not the other sink (which is where it looks to be now). This isn't a big deal, but if it runs to the disposal, then crud from the DW would get chewed up in the disposer, instead of possibly jamming up in the drain plumbing. If you can't run an air gap, you can just connect the DW drain line to the disposal, but it must loop way up in the cabinet, as high as possible, before it comes back down to connect to the DW.

If you've had water shooting every which way, you might have pumped waste water into your DW at one point, so that might have started something growing somewhere.

You can fix this yourself for about $20 if you can find a Lowes or HD. Get a single-trap setup for two sinks. They come with a special T that has a baffle in it that directs water from either sink down the drain, but blocks each sink drain from pushing water to the other. That doesn't seem to be what you have installed. And I believe they need to be vertical to work properly. So the pic in post #10 is what it should all look like. See how the DW drain loops higher than where it enters the disposer? That's correct(ish), though it should be a bit higher if possible, like jammed up behind the sink so it's touching the underside of the counter. Again, that's your second best option, connecting it to an air gap is the better way to do it.

Now if you have a stinky DW, or a drain clog, those are just making matters worse. You'll have to address those issues, too, but the drain plumbing is an easy fix. It all goes together hand tight and you can cut that stuff with a sharp knife or hacksaw (though be sure to de-burr the cuts). Your plumber went with DWV all glued together, and that's fine, but it's harder to work with, and, as you're about to find out, harder to take apart when you need to...

Thanks and I was also told on another forum that I have an "S" trap which is not allowed. I am going to cut all the plumbing out and start from scratch adding in an undersink vent at the same time.

 

[cfherrman]

That sound like best, you may do the trick we have to do when the pool pad is tight by cutting inside a collar somewhere with a special tool so you can replum it

 

[PoolGate]

It looks like I have the room on the main pipe coming up from the floor to do it all over correctly.

 

[CJadamec]

You have enough pipe there to get a coupling in place to redo all the pipe. Just just cut right under the fitting.

If it's not easy to cut. Cut the fitting in half to remove all the plumbing then make your finish cut after you make yourself more room to work.

 

[Dirk]

An AAV (Air Admittance Valve)? Why do you think you need one? Does that meet local code? And if there really is no vent, is there no way to add a proper one?

 

[PoolGate]

An AAV (Air Admittance Valve)? Why do you think you need one? Does that meet local code? And if there really is no vent, is there no way to add a proper one?

I am certain there is a proper vent. I heard from multiple sources though that kitchen drains sometimes need more vent. If I am re-doing the plumbing I don't think it would hurt to add one. I would add one to my countertop but it is granite so would need to be core drilled. If I can just replumb this entire mess 99% of the issues would go away.

 

[Dirk]

I am certain there is a proper vent. I heard from multiple sources though that kitchen drains sometimes need more vent. If I am re-doing the plumbing I don't think it would hurt to add one. I would add one to my countertop but it is granite so would need to be core drilled. If I can just replumb this entire mess 99% of the issues would go away.

Roger. Ideally there would be a proper sanitary tee coming off the pipe, and the vent would be coming off of the top of that tee. The AAV should be above the flood level of the sink, but that might be more important if the AAV was hidden in the wall. I'm sure it will be fine. I would be tempted to dry fit the AAV and see if the sink worked without it, then leave it off if so. But, like you said, it'll likely be fine either way.

 

[cfherrman]

Aav being either $10 and you dry fitted it, all the money has been spent just glue it in.

All my sinks have them and they are not that high but apparently high enough. My house only has two 1 1.2 vents, one on each drain stack

 

[Dirk]

I didn't mean to save him money. I meant if he doesn't need it than why introduce it to the plumbing. It has some sort of moving part, yes? Gaskets, too, maybe? A spring? I've never used one, so just guessing. I just know I wouldn't want one under my sink if it didn't need to be there. The height of the AAV comes into play if there is a clog down stream of it and you don't notice it until the sink overflows. So where you put the AAV determines which spills over first: the AAV under the sink inside your cabinet, or over the sink to run down the front of your cabinet...

This from the internet, so you know it must be true:

Installation guidelines can vary depending on code, but in general AAVs serving a single fixture should be at least 4" above the center of the trap arm. When serving multiple fixtures, they should be a minimum of 6" above the flood level rim of the highest fixture, and should only vent fixtures that are on the same floor level. Because they rely upon gravity to close, AAVs must be installed in a vertical position.

From here:

https://www.plumbingsupply.com/how-and-why-air-admittance-valves-are-used.html

 

[CJadamec]

Installing an aav on your sink will probably be a good thing and it certainly won't hurt anything.

Most kitchen sinks don't have venting that would meet modern codes because of where they are located in the house.

As I said before aav's are installed on all new houses. They are also acceptable for use in the attic to replace roof penetrations for drain stack venting.

They need to be installed a minimum of 4" above the horizontal run of pipe they are connected to.

 

[Arizonarob]

Everyone here has some awesome suggestions, but the main problem is the line has a partial clog. If it worked fine in the past, and is not now, then all signs point that way.

 

[Pv2]

everyone here has some awesome suggestions, but the main problem is the line has a partial clog. If it worked fine in the past, and is not now, then all signs point that way.

this ^^^

 

[Dirk]

Everyone here has some awesome suggestions, but the main problem is the line has a partial clog. If it worked fine in the past, and is not now, then all signs point that way.

And I mentioned that the OP still has to track that down even after reconfiguring his plumbing. I suggested going to one trap because the way it is now, one could be sucking the water out of the other, and then sewer gas could conceivably be backing up into his living space. He says he notices it in the DW. It could be venting through either sink, maybe dissipating in the kitchen, but concentrating in the DW, which gets revealed when he opens the DW door. All conjecture, but I'm pretty sure that current plumbing is incorrect and is causing or can cause some of what he's describing. Why not fix it while he's got it apart to snake the line? It really is very easy and cheap to do.

 

[PoolGate]

Everyone here has some awesome suggestions, but the main problem is the line has a partial clog. If it worked fine in the past, and is not now, then all signs point that way.

It hasn't ever really worked correctly. We're just getting tired of it and finally are addressing it. The drain works about as well as it has ever worked. at best I would think there is grease buildup but nothing more than that. I had my septic line scoped out when I had the pool go in and it looked really clean almost new. The sink drain was not scoped but I cannot imagine it is too much worse.

I think the dishwasher (on counter) vents are designed as a siphon break, right? Not really as a vent so much.

In any case, I will definitely replumb this to have only 1 trap. I'll add the AAV vent just for good measure. I have used them before when I moved my laundry room so am familiar with their operation.