when FC goes up, so does pH?

Liquid chlorine is pH neutral.

Your fill water I suspect is relatively high in TA, CH, and has a pH above 7.5. So adding that to your pool raises your pH. Also any aeration, such as swimming, will raise our pH.

Take care.

I add on average about 12 oz of acid a week during the summer time. In a 6000 gallon pool.
 
Technically when you do add bleach that is raising the pH. However when that chlorine is consumed it lowers the pH. So effectively it is pH neutral. If you measure your pH before your bleach additions then you would not likely notice any rise due to the bleach. Generally that's only going to be noticeable when you want to add a lot of bleach and raise the FC much much higher than normal.
 
The following is a 30-day chart of my pool's call for Muriatic acid. The values are oz by volume. I don't always add acid when it calls for. You can see the dates and the amounts. My fill water is pH 7.8 and my ongoing pH goal is 7.5. Until today it had been about 10 days or more since I last added acid.

muriaticacid.jpg

Hope you can see the chart well enough to be useful.

-Mickey
 
Jason - I believe your 7.5 vs 7.8 question was directed at me. 7.8 was my initial goal but I couldn't get TA to stabilize. So my idea was simply to experiment by lowering pH, not expecting it would necessarily help but found it worked well with TA 60-70. I'd like to get back to 7.8 but haven't taken the time for further experimentation to find the "complimentary" TA. At 7.5 and 60-70 I don't really add acid or baking soda very often despite the direction of Poolmath (my pH goal is 7.5 and my TA goal is 80 though I haven't been TA 80 in a long, long time). I really should change my Poolmath goals if I'm not going to dose as directed since it's then throwing off the charts on my web site.
 
There is no reason to have a TA goal. The hope is the TA finds a happy value where the pH is stable somewhere in the 7s.

Just realized by goal you likely meant what is set in PoolMath. Regardless, there is no reason to try to get the TA to a specific value.
 
There is no reason to have a TA goal. The hope is the TA finds a happy value where the pH is stable somewhere in the 7s.

Just realized by goal you likely meant what is set in PoolMath. Regardless, there is no reason to try to get the TA to a specific value.

Good info. And that's where I'm at. TA is stable when pH is 7.5. The combination yields the most stability and least chemical dosing. The higher my pH the less stable TA becomes which drives up CSI to 0.3 and easily higher. And I am then frequently (almost daily) adding acid to keep pH in check whereas in my current state I have gone over ten days.

I'm still wet behind the ears with all this but I have collected a lot of data which is beginning to support what I am doing.

Always willing to listen and learn though.
 

Enjoying this content?

Support TFP with a donation.

Give Support
Chalk this up to yet another user that, like me two years ago, found this information out the hard way; basically on his or her own. The truth is that for all but a few exceptions and some parameters and circumstatnces, the best TA level is not a specified range as it is shown and taught in "pool school" but rather the level at which YOUR pool keeps PH the most steady. I like using the word "steady" over "stable", because "stabilized" and "stabilizer" mean something totally different here on this site. We're getting at least one inquiry each week with this same issue. The answer is not in pool school in a very direct manner.

Summer 2015 my PH began to continually drift up to 8. I was lowering PH with MA; lowering PH with MA; lowering PH with MA. Two or three times per week. I had read pool school and knew all the recommended ranges for my-type pool. Then I'd run a routine, regular full test of all my levels every couple weeks and my TA would always have fallen out of range; at or about 50. A full 20 below the recommended range back at that time. Guess what??? I was a good reader and comprehended pool school real well, so I knew that my TA was out of range. I wanted to keep my pool levels as close to the ranges as possible so as not to have a troublesome pool; but my pool was not trouble free since I was adding acid every two to three days. Little did I know back then, because it wasn't addressed in pool school, and I didn't know what questions to ask since I'm not a chemist, that if I had just left my TA alone and kept adding acid until the PH quit rising, my problem would have been solved on its own. Instead, since I'm not a chemist and did not know this, I was raising my TA back up to 80 each time I'd test it. Right in the middle like a good student would do. The cycle continued. Finally, after posting/asking if I could let my PH stay up around 8.0 with no problem and posting all my numbers, not even not even suspecting that TA was the culprit, since it was right in the middle of the recommended range and I'm not a chemist, Chem Geek gave me my true parameters for TA (a low of 29). This was a number that I had to stay above to avoid the threat of a PH crash as long as I wasn't using acid products like trichlor regularly. My PH finally became steady, and TA ended up being 40 the rest of that season. Ever since that time, for me, TA will be adjusted only to help make PH more steady. I'll measure and record it from time to time, but that's it. The next Spring my PH was dropping; borax; dropping; borax; dropping. I added enough baking soda to raise PPM only 5. I wanted to be careful and deliberate about what I was doing with TA. PH Kept dropping but more slowly now; borax; dropping; borax; dropping; added 5 more ppm baking soda. That was April 2016. I haven't adjusted PH since. My TA has been from the 50-60 range. I record it but that's it.

Please don't get discouraged by this "TA dilemma". They have added some words in pool school these days that talks about TA's job for keeping PH steady. Those words didn't used to be there. They have also increased the gap of the range for TA for some pools as compared to when I was having the problem. There needs to be something more or different written about managing TA or more correctly, not managing TA when PH is steady. But there is a trade off of simplicity of pool care instructions, versus 100% correct information for everyone all the time. The listed ranges probably work for 90% of our members' pools. Personally, I watch for this same-type post all the time and make sure it's answered correctly. The experts have been all over it lately, and there are some pool school words nowadays to back up what they say, so it's better than it was back when I had the problem and only Chem Geek gave me the right way forward.
 
This is helpful. So I was under the impression that a higher TA would yield more "tighter" PH swing. From what i am hearing there needs to be a "perfect" TA for a individual pool. Pool A may like 80'ppm TA pool B 50 ppm TA. So given that bringing my TA to 100 seems to have made it worse maybe go down to 70 again?
 
This is helpful. So I was under the impression that a higher TA would yield more "tighter" PH swing. From what i am hearing there needs to be a "perfect" TA for a individual pool. Pool A may like 80'ppm TA pool B 50 ppm TA. So given that bringing my TA to 100 seems to have made it worse maybe go down to 70 again?

Possibly. Can you start your own thread? Best not to hijack this one.

Take care.
 
Honestly, you could likely NEVER test TA and completing ignore it and have less confusion. By keeping the pH in range, the TA will basically self adjust. This assumes you are not using tablets as you sole chlorine source.

If you do use tablets, the TA can get too low and the pH may swing too much.

- - - Updated - - -

It is kind of interesting that newer members tend to get wrapped around the axle as far as TA is concerned and it is really nearly always the last thing to even think about.
 
This reinforces what, (was it Chemgeek?), told me. I too had to let my TA drop to 60 to get daily acid additions down to 8 oz a day. I try to keep pH at 7.7 . Maybe I should experiment with TA 50 given what is being said here?
 
Thread Status
Hello , This thread has been inactive for over 60 days. New postings here are unlikely to be seen or responded to by other members. For better visibility, consider Starting A New Thread.