VSP Run Cost

[Wolfepack88]

I found an old thread where somebody created a chart that shows the cost at different RPM's. I duplicated it and put my own utility rates which are two charges, delivery rate and the rate for the electricity. Anyhow for Jandy 2.7VSP running 10 hours a day at 2400 RPM's it was $38. Amazing how the price curve rises steeply as you move your RPM's up, its not just linear. 1700 RPM's it cost $13.82, 2000 RPM's it cost $21.38. I wanted to say thank you for whomever created that chart. Can't find it again to identify the user but man it saved me some aggravation as the Mrs was like the electric bill was $299. I'm like its not from the pump. Showed her the chart. Turns out prior two months were estimates and they caught up!! VSP is the way to go and the economics for slow and steady are big time in your favor!!

 

[Rancho Cost-a-Lotta]

It was @PoolGate

 

[Newdude]

Does yours have a wattage readout on the screen ? The intelliflos do and you can watch it happen in real time. Each 100 RPMs increases it a bit more than the last bump and the last several 100 RPM increases are DOOZIES, each.

 

[Wolfepack88]

Does yours have a wattage readout on the screen ? The intelliflos do and you can watch it happen in real time. Each 100 RPMs increases it a bit more than the last bump and the last several 100 RPM increases are DOOZIES, each.

Yes on my Aqualink app it shows the RPM's so that's what I used to plug it in to my chart!! Awesome evidence. Gotta do one for my gas heater so I have an idea that cost too.

Funny I just realized my electricity is cheaper than Poolgate's!!

 

[1poolman1]

Your heater uses 4 therms per hour (1therm = 100k btu). That is how most utilities charge for gas, plus whatever other fees are involved.
That is a constant rate for the heater, they are on or off, no adjustment in flame.
In February New Jersey gas was about $11.00 per thousand cubic feet. That is 1 therm (100k btu).

 

[Wolfepack88]

Your heater uses 4 therms per hour (1therm = 100k btu). That is how most utilities charge for gas, plus whatever other fees are involved.
That is a constant rate for the heater, they are on or off, no adjustment in flame.
In February New Jersey gas was about $11.00 per thousand cubic feet. That is 1 therm (100k btu).

One thousand cubic feet equals a smidgen over 10 therms I think not 1 so based on that calc a little over $4 and hour.

 

[1poolman1]

One thousand cubic feet equals a smidgen over 10 therms I think not 1 so based on that calc a little over $4 and hour.

You're right, got my decimal in the wrong spot, duh. Didn't sound right even as I wrote it.

 

[Wolfepack88]

You're right, got my decimal in the wrong spot, duh.

I just about had the heater mothballed when I read your post, I was like $40 an hour, I'm out!! Kids wait until mid July to swim!!

 

[Toxophilite]

I just about had the heater mothballed when I read your post, I was like $40 an hour, I'm out!! Kids wait until mid July to swim!!

Propane will put you closer to there! I was being charged $2.95 per gallon, and had that calculated at about 4 gallons/hour. Yesterday, the fill up was $3.25/gallon.

 

[Wolfepack88]

Propane will put you closer to there! I was being charged $2.95 per gallon, and had that calculated at about 4 gallons/hour. Yesterday, the fill up was $3.25/gallon.

Holy smokes that is expensive. I looked at my PS&G bill and the cost is about $.82 per therm so x 4= $3.28 an hour to run my heater today (who knows a month from now but hopefully a good rule of thumb). Your cost is crazy high compared to NG.

 

[macdenewf]

I found an old thread where somebody created a chart that shows the cost at different RPM's. I duplicated it and put my own utility rates which are two charges, delivery rate and the rate for the electricity. Anyhow for Jandy 2.7VSP running 10 hours a day at 2400 RPM's it was $38. Amazing how the price curve rises steeply as you move your RPM's up, its not just linear. 1700 RPM's it cost $13.82, 2000 RPM's it cost $21.38. I wanted to say thank you for whomever created that chart. Can't find it again to identify the user but man it saved me some aggravation as the Mrs was like the electric bill was $299. I'm like its not from the pump. Showed her the chart. Turns out prior two months were estimates and they caught up!! VSP is the way to go and the economics for slow and steady are big time in your favor!!

I have a Jandy 2 HP ePump on my filter. I just did the same exercise ( but incremented in 250 RPMs...might have to try a 100 RPM increment when i have the time ). I have a similar curve.
At 2000 RPM the pump is drawing ~ .25 watts per RPM and at 3400 its drawing .7 watts per RPM.

Ive been running 3000 rpm ( for the past 10 years really) and when i calculate the cost at 13.6 KW/Hr...its costing me ~ 67 dollars a month at 10 hours a day circulation
Assuming i drop back to 2700 ( if that cleans the pool) then as long as i don't increase more than 3 hours extra a day its a wash
Similarly if i drop to 2500..i can run up to an extra 7 hours a day before it costs more than 10 hours at 3000 RPM

Clearly a case for scaling back the RPM but that begs the question....how long extra do you need to run the filter pump if scaling back from say 3000 RPM to 2700....and is there a minimum needed to really clean the pool?

I seem to recall i have 26 thousand gallons.
- Hot tub spill over into the pool
- 2 in floor returns
- 1 side wall return
- 2 skimmers
- cant recall how many jets ...seem to think about 6 with the 3 that are in the sun shelf.

I seem to recall there is a calculation for how many times you need to turn over the water in a pool but still need to do some research on Gallons / rev to make the proper calculation

Cheers
Mac

 

[mknauss]

I seem to recall there is a calculation for how many times you need to turn over the water in a pool but still need to do some research on Gallons / rev to make the proper calculation

Turnover is a myth.
You run the pump to skim the surface and create/distribute the chemicals/chlorine added.
It is very likely you can run your pump at far lower rpm if you wish.

 

[macdenewf]

Turnover is a myth.
You run the pump to skim the surface and create/distribute the chemicals/chlorine added.
It is very likely you can run your pump at far lower rpm if you wish.

Appreciate that. Cant get a consistent number with an online search. Some sites say 1 TR others say 2 TR

I found a pool pump calculator on Jandy’s website. they didn’t have my specific pump listed ( its 10 years old) but as a starting point i used their 2.2 HP ( mine is 2) for analysis. It lists their gallons per revolution. It looked very linear regardless of the speed. So - im using 0.0265 Gallons Per Revolution. If i can ever find the real output for my 2HP - i’ll update.

While Jandy doesn't recommend a pool turnover that i can find - their cost calculator notes the annual cost with their pumps at 2 turnovers a day

Jandy Pool Pumps: Variable & Two Speed Pool Pumps | Jandy

Looking for Jandy Pool Pumps? Find Variable & Two Speed Pool Pumps for the Perfect Pool Experience. Buy Now w/ a Pool Pro Near You!

www.jandy.com

Another site notes 2 turnovers per day

Pool Turnover Rate Calculator

Free Turnover Rate Calculator, Total Alkalinity Calculator, Pool Volume Calculator, pH Calculator, Salt PPM Calculator, Stabilizer Calculator, Free Chlorine Calculator

poolchemicalcalculator.com

this site says 1 turn over a day

Pool Maintenance - Pool Pump, Filter & Pool Pump Cleaning

How long should you run your pool pump? It all depends on how much water your pool holds in gallons. Find out the correct amount of time to run your pool’s pump by clicking here. Visit SwimmingPool.com

www.swimmingpool.com

This site notes 2 turn overs

How Many Times Does Pool Water Need to Be Turned Over?

Proper Circulation Proper circulation is imperative to clean, clear and healthy swimming pool water. It allows the chemicals to mix and work effectively. It allows dirt and debris to get collected in your filter. Your filter is the most important stop in your system’s plumbing line. If all...

poolpartstogo.com

Chlorox doesn't mention turnovers..they simply say to run 10 to 12 hours a day to ensure the chemicals mix properly

How to Take Care of a Swimming Pool | Clorox® Pool&Spa™

www.cloroxpool.com

So…seeing as this isn’t an exact science I'm going to shoot for a somewhere in the middle.
- i have a salt water pool and i need to run it about 70% to keep the chlorine at a decent level. Im running 10 hours a day now.
If you think about the chlorox note…10 to 12 hours a day
If you think about turnovers…maybe try and get close to 2

If i look at my table…i can run at 2500 RPM 12 hours a day and get 1.83 turnover That gets me somewhere in the range i suspect. it also gets me the total time needed to keep the chlorine high enough...maybe i can even back off to 60% as its running 15% longer
AND compared to running it at 3000 RPM.... should save me 400 a year!

For a guy that likes spreadsheets…..why didn’t i do this before!
Anyway - if anyone has a different perspective on run times, speeds..etc... sure like to hear it.

Cheers
Mac

 

[mknauss]

Turnover is a myth.

Determine Pump Run Time

To figure out how many hours you need to run your pump, you need to know how fast your pump works. You can find this here.

www.troublefreepool.com