Trouble with ROCKS!

Aug 12, 2014
58
Las Vegas, Nevada
Hoping someone can give me some ideas about how to handle my ROCK problem.

We built the pool just over four years ago. Having seen lots of beautiful pools here in Las Vegas with natural rocks at the edge, I had the builder put in an all-rock waterfall and also rocks around the far side perimeter of the pool. The builder installed the rocks so that they go down into the water ("notched on beam"). The result was absolutely beautiful ... at first. Still is, if you don't look too closely. If you look closely, though, there's a lot of trouble with them. I'm seeing more and more apparent efflorescence or calcium buildup (?) on them (it's a saltwater pool, but by taste this isn't salt). Worse, the rocks are deteriorating badly. Every time I get in the pool, I find there are flakes ready to come off. I peel them off with my fingernail but the next time I'm in the pool, there are more. Sometimes little bits fall off into the water. There are veins in the rocks that are apparently little more than mud with tiny stones in them. I can rub this stuff loose with my finger.

Also, the calcium level in my pool (tested by the Taylor test kit) has gone from 325 to 625 in a year. In the previous year, it went from 150 (after filling mostly with soft water) to 350 and that was actually less than a year's time. I think this is due to deterioration of the rocks, since the automatic feed to the pool comes directly from a verified-working water softener.

Since most of the deterioration is at or near the water line, I suspect the rocks are absorbing the water, leaching calcium into the water, and that's probably also why they are deteriorating. In previous years when they were sealed, the guys took down the water level and sealed the rocks below the surface. However, the sealer they put on there and elsewhere has turned whitish. The rock was supposed to be granite, and some parts of it do look like granite, but other parts don't. My contract says only "rock" and anyway I'm now well beyond the warranty. I'm pretty angry at the pool salesman, whom I feel should have disclosed this as a potential problem. And it was no skin off his nose, the cost wouldn't have been any different if they'd been installed above the water line.

I'm looking for any suggestions what to do. I thought about draining the pool, sandblasting them to get every bit of loose stuff off and then re-sealing them yet again, but I get the feeling that's not going to be a permanent fix. The rocks are so big, so numerous and so hard to access that removing them would be extremely difficult. Is there any way to coat the rocks below the water line with something that will permanently prevent the water from getting into them? For example, could the part below the water line be covered with pebble-tec like the rest of the pool? I don't care about appearance any more, I just want a solution. The only other possible solution I can think of would be to drain the pool, build concrete forms entirely over the rocks (or at least the bottom part of the rocks, fill the forms with concrete, and then tile over the concrete -- anything to keep the water out of the rocks.
 
Have you tested your tap water or softened water for calcium?

Having worked with rocks for a long time I am actually not sure what would seal them under salt and chlorine water. Spraying gunite/ concrete over the top of the rocks would seal them for good... but others may have better ideas. There was a guy on this site that did beautiful gunite boulders and rocks in and around his pool.

Do you have any pictures?
 
The rocks in our area are not carbonate based so I doubt the calcium is coming from the rocks.

Most any sedimentary rock like we have here will disintegrate in water over time.

You are probably on the right track to devise a way to cover them with gunite and plaster.

Lots of pools here look wonderful when new. But not taking into account our water source and the mineralogy of the rocks used create something not as wonderful over time.
 
I tested the output of my external water softener that runs the automatic feed: Added three drops of R-0011L and the water instantly turned bright blue: No calcium at all. I put on the water softener in the first place because I was tired of the calcium buildup on the tile. I do not understand what could be the source of the calcium other than the rocks. I have not noticed any kind of deterioration of the Pebble-tec. Still looks and feels like new. So, if it's not coming from the water supply and it's not coming from the Pebble-tec, I don't see where else it could be coming from other than the rocks.

Additional photos posted at: johnsimion | Flickr

When viewing the photos, most of the white or whitish stuff peeling off is old sealant. The rock that's peeling and flaking is orange and it's got calcium or something else building up on it (it's a saltwater pool, but my tastebuds tell me it's not salt).

Speaking of salt, my salt level has ALSO steadily increased due to the water softener. In October 2016, the level was 2800. A year ago it was 3400-3600. It went up to 4000 last November and has been 4400 in my last two monthly tests. I tested the water softener output and it shows 400, so that accounts for the salt increase. However, the white stuff on the rocks definitely isn't salt. Is it possible the salt in the water is somehow reacting with the rocks and causing this?
 

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Very nice looking.. I can see your point.

What does muratic acid do if you spray it or brush it full strength on the rocks.

As noted not all rocks are created equal.

Its hard to tell by the pics but how low in the water do the rocks go?

And I do not have a solution for you but I might post on Craigslist to see if there is a local geologist that might be willing to help ID your stone and possible offer some ideas. And if this stone would be leaching calcium.

Or maybe you already know the source of the stone if its local.

In New England we have a lot of hard rocks and granite. Granite would never break down underwater. Maybe in NV there is a lot more sandstone type rocks or softer materials.

And again if your pool builder installed this rock in other installations he would have similar issues, even if its not under warranty etc he may have an idea.

Take Care.
B
 
Blakeusa, I poured muriatic acid on some of the rocks today and got a nice reaction. Most of the reaction was on the efflorescence, but not all. Some of it was on the face of the rocks where there was no efflorescence. Some places didn't react at all. Wherever it had a reaction, the rocks turned a yellow-green color, almost fluorescent. Pictures are on Yahoo -Â*login for July 1 (same site as listed before but you have to look at the camera roll).

The effect is most noticeable on Photo 3 from today. However, you can also see a clear difference between views of the same rocks before and after: Today's Photo 1 = Yesterday's Photo 2, and Today's Photo 2 = Yesterday's Photo 4.

The rocks are about 4-5" under water.

I am thinking about draining the pool and having the guys shoot the rocks with gunite above and below and make them into artificial rocks that can then be properly sealed, while putting matching Pebble-Tec on the parts below the water line so they're then permanently sealed and this situation can't happen again. This would probably be the first time natural rocks are turned into artificial rocks, but it would just be too difficult and expensive to try to pull them out and replace them altogether.
 
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