Time to SLAM?

[kraftchick]

New pool and have been working to get numbers up from 0, or whatever they were naturally on new fill. Current numbers are below as of this morning. Water is extremely cloudy, can't see drains, can see maybe 1 - 1 1/2 feet in. Last week rains splashed in lots of our NC red clay, but I've gotten most of this out with the Dolphin....running the Dolphin around with microfilters and cleaning them every 45 mins. or so. As info, the water was fairly clear until that heavy rain, red clay splash and subsequently running Dolphin mixing everything up. Anyway, here's current numbers......I'm going to do OCLT tonight. Should I anticipate a SLAM, or is it possible that with the numbers now what they are, that it might begin to start clearing up?

FC: 6 (boosted SWG yesterday)
CC: .5 (this had been zero up until this morning)
TA: 70
CYA: 60
PH: 8.0

 

[mknauss]

Do the OCLT. That will tell you what is occurring. I suspect it is dirt.

What do you find on thee floor/steps of the pool overnight? Dirt or dead algae. Dead algae goes 'poof' when you attempt to brush it. Dirt normally moves.

 

[kraftchick]

I do see settling on the steps, its the red clay silt/dirt that settles. With filter, I did do a backwash yesterday and it was really really dirty (red clay) water coming out a good amount too.

 

[kraftchick]

Good news with OCLT....FC was 5.5 at 9:30pm last night and 5.5 at 7:15am this morning. So the question is the cloudiness. I suppose it all could be suspended silt/dirt. I've had the pump/filter running since Tuesday and I have backwashed it twice and could see a good amount of red dirt being blown out (less the second time). I know there is still red clay dirt settled at the bottom because I can still see it in the corners at the shallow end. But I'm also wondering if it's anything with my levels. I do know that when I brought the PH up my TA was very low, so it swung up very high....above 8.2 on OTO tester. I've been slowly trying to bring it down with muriatic acid and have it now at the numbers below. (since the PH up with Borax I've brought TA up to prevent the wild PH swings)(and I've been running the SWG and learning that can drive PH up also). Can high PH cause/keep cloudiness? The kind that you can't see the drains? One thought I've had was to shut everything down for the day to see if whatever's suspended would settle to the bottom? Ideas?

FC 5.5
CC 0
TA 75
CYA 60
PH 8.0

 

[mknauss]

Good to hear on the OCLT.
So, you had not mentioned you were doing the borax acid thing. That is just a horrible way to get borates in your water, if that is what you were trying to do. Boric acid is much better.
Also, SWCG does not effect pH very much. A much bigger driver of pH rise is higher TA fill water. And aeration.
Your test results above, you show a TA of 75. Did you do that test with 10 ml or 25 ml of water sample? Normally we recommend using 25 ml of water sample and then TA is results in a factor of 10 ppm.
High pH can cause cloudiness, depending on TA (high) and CH (high). You do not list the CH of your pool water.
In your case, it most likely dirt. You could raise your FC to 20% of CYA level (12 ppm) using liquid chlorine and then let the pool sit one day and overnight without the pump. See if the dirt settles and you can vac it out easier.

We rarely recommend clarifier but when a pool has been filled with dirt from a flood, it can be handy for a one time use. But it must be a quality clarifier and is rarely available except on line. SeaKlear or Orenda make quality, chitosan clarifiers.

 

[kraftchick]

So yes, the TA test was done with 25 ml. CH is 25 (all testing done with TF100 kit per their instructions). The Borax 20 Mule add was to get pH up, but it went way high (assuming this was because my TA at that time was really low). So based on that...before doing anything else drastic (clarifier), should I boost up the FC as you mentioned, then go pump off for a full day? If so, should I do the FC boost in the evening, let pump run overnight (no swcg or swcg?), cut lump off in the morning and then let it sit 24 hrs til next morning to see if it will settle out?

 

[mknauss]

If your TA is below 50 ppm, use baking soda to raise it. If pH is a little below 7.2, use aeration to raise it.

should I boost up the FC as you mentioned, then go pump off for a full day?

I would. Timing is up to you. I have a feeling you will need to do it multiple times as when you go to vac (I am not sure the robot would be a good idea to use during this as it will disturb the dirt alot) you will not get all the dirt in one pass.

 

[kraftchick]

Update: So I did the FC ramp up, pump off 24 hour settle. Some of the dirt did fall out, but it was minimal from what it had been. Still couldn't see the drains in the deep in, same thick dull cloudiness. So today, after validating pH was still high (this morning it was somwhere above 8.2 again). So I treated it with 4 cups of muriatic acid per Pool Math calculator, and the pump running full speed. 45 minutes later and I can make out the drains, and pH was measuring spot on 7.5 (I have the returns not pointed at the surface to avoid aeration as much as possible). Is it possible that my Borax add that drove the pH so high in such a wild swing (due to TA being very very low at that time) is what caused the heavy clouding? I am going to do nothing else the rest of the day and see if the cloudiness continues to improve with the pH now at a proper level.

 

[mknauss]

Is it possible that my Borax add that drove the pH so high in such a wild swing (due to TA being very very low at that time) is what caused the heavy clouding?

Yes. A high pH spike can precipitate calcium carbonate.

 

[kraftchick]

Okay, so after another day of letting everything settle (last addition was muriatic acid yesterday morning to pull down pH' to 7.5)....still very very cloudy. I can make out the drains at the bottom only when the sun is on it, but it hasn't changed any since yesterday....meaning the pH being brought down to normal range didn't continue to clear things up. I did some vacuuming in the shallow end and down the slope as far as I could see to remove settled dirt, backwashed and rinsed, but still very cloudy. Current numbers from this morning are below...all seems to be in good ranges. This definitely appears to be suspended silt/dirt in the water (filter has been running around the clock, apart from the 24 hr stop to see if everything would settle out). Is it time for a clarifier?

FC: 11
CC: 0
TA: 70
CYA: 60
pH: 7.5
CH: 25

 

[mknauss]

You mentioned backwash earlier do I assume you have a sand filter. Please add what you have to your signature.
The clarifier I recommend is typically only available online. So if you order it now you can re-evaluate when you receive it.

Chitosan Clarifier - SeaKlear

seaklear.com

 

[kraftchick]

Yep, sand filter (added to sig).

 

[kraftchick]

Wanted to report back that clarifier was what it finally needed. I went conservative and only started with 3 oz for our 26000 gal. 24 hours later and water is crystal clear!!!! It definitely was suspended silt that was just passing through our sand filter. Backwashed the bad stuff out of the filter and cannot believe how good it looks now! Thanks again for all the help!

 

[mknauss]

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