The cost of pool ownership

[Kelly Gordon]

Hi all:

Tl;dr: How much should we budget for pool ownership - specifically equipment?

Longer version: We've owned our pool for five years. We've spent $1000s each year to repair or replace pool equipment. We've bought a new pool pump, a new vacuum, a new vacuum booster pump, a new automatic cover, a new salt water cell, we've replaced the sand in our filter, we've replaced every working part on our heater. The only thing we haven't done to have a completely new pool is put in a new vinyl liner. AND NOW things we installed the first year are failing. This month, we've put in a new pool pump and a new vacuum pump because the ones we installed five years ago have already given up the ghost.

Is that the lifespan we should expect from pool equipment that's properly maintained? Does everyone just allot a big chunk of change to upkeep each year, aside from chemicals and the cost to run the pool? This feels crazy. So far this month, we've spent $1600 on a new VS pool pump and $400 on the vacuum booster pump. And this is before we've even put a toe in the pool.

Kelly

 

[YippeeSkippy]

Wow, I don't think this *is* the norm. I hope not at least. Is there something other than your extreme cold that might be causing such woes? Now I don't run my pump 24/7, but they really can be from what I know.

I know sand never needs replacing in the sand filter, so you can mark that off your future trouble list.

You're buying quality, name brand equipment.....right?

You keep your chemistry levels in check...right? Too low pH is damaging to equipment and gaskets.

Did you put the pool in five years ago, or was it already there when you bought the house?

Maddie

 

[AquaBoy]

If this was the norm, then I'd be hearing the consistent beeps right now coming from a truck backing up to dump concrete into the pool. Beyond the purchases I made for a vacuum, skimmer and pole, leaf bag, test kit, and multiport valve replacement I have only purchased chemicals for the pool. And ours was poorly maintained when we bought the house because the previous owner had rented it out for nine years. And we all know renters are most likely not going to be proactively maintaining the pool on their own dime or time.

So you have been the owners from day one? This almost seems like whoever did the overall installation made some serious mistakes as well as recommendations on pool equipment. Not that it helps you at this point, but that's my only thought. Or as Yippee said, if it was there before you then who knows what mistakes they may have made in buying el cheapo equipment and properly maintaining the pool.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Kelly,

I don't have an answer for your questions, but I would like to know if the IntelliFlo that you have in signature line is your new pump or if you had to have your original IntelliFlo replaced within the five years you are talking about??

If this is the second IntelliFlo, can you please tell me what the problem was that caused you to replace it?

The cell is the only thing that makes some sense, as it is a consumable item...

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Catanzaro]

Kelly Gordon:

Are you the original owner of the pool? Spending this kind of money seems odd, especially for a new pool owner. This fall, my pool will be 4 years old. Nothing, besides a pressure gauge has been replaced, and the manufacturer (Hayward), was kind enough (even without asking), to send me a new one as it kept filling up with water. A $20 part broke from my vacuum and Hayward again sent me a new head because it was still under warranty.

$1,600 on a VS pool pump seems very high. Even in NJ, I believe the pool company charges about $1,000. You can easily find someone for about $200 and the pump is about $400-$600. When my pool was built, I had them install unions everywhere for this reason. This way, If the pump fails, I could easily swap out for a new one.

I have seen pumps last 10+ years and one of my friends has a pool heater that is going on 17 years. Proper chemistry probably has a lot of do with pool equipment, etc., especially your liner.

 

[Kelly Gordon]

I don't have an answer for your questions, but I would like to know if the IntelliFlo that you have in signature line is your new pump or if you had to have your original IntelliFlo replaced within the five years you are talking about??

If this is the second IntelliFlo, can you please tell me what the problem was that caused you to replace it?

I updated my signature line, Jim. The Intelliflo was installed this past weekend. Previously, we had a singles-speed Hayward SuperPump.

 

[Kelly Gordon]

Well, at least I know I'm not crazy. I wondered why anyone would keep a pool around if this kind of expenditure is normal.

Our pool water wasn't great the first few years, but I don't think the PH was ever the problem. Mostly it was just poor maintenance by the pool companies. I took it over two years ago, thanks to TFP, so now we are good 90% of the time. We did NOT install the pool; I'm fairly sure it was installed in the late 1990s. The years before we bought the house, the pool likely wasn't maintained well, since it was rented out. That would explain why we did so much work the first few years. But I'm at loss as to why we are already replacing major pieces of equipment - like the pump and vacuum pump - in just a few years. The pool company assures me the equipment we have should be able to hold up to the elements, even our extreme weather, better than this.

Costs DO seem high. Thanks for that confirmation too. (The first pool company I called quoted us $2400 as the complete cost for the Intelliflo with install.) But neither myself nor my husband are technically knowledgeable enough to deal with these bigger jobs. Example: the vacuum motor that was installed today. I can find it online for $250. Pool store quoted me $420. They did take pity on me and wave the install fee; obviously, the motor is marked up so they can make a living. But sheesh. It's a lot of output for a three-month swimming season here in Minneapolis.

I have two pool companies I usually call for quotes. Should I be calling around for more?

- - - Updated - - -

OH! One thing that might impact? The pool is in our backyard; the equipment is on a different side of our house and 15 feet above the pool surface. So our pump does have to work fairly hard to get prime, if nothing else. The original installation folks clearly didn't think that through. Not to mention that if I want to turn the vacuum off to tighten the drive chain (for example, ::cough Polaris 3900 ::cough), I have to walk around the house, turn it off, walk back to the pool, tighten the chain, walk back to the other side to turn it on.

But aside from inconvenience to me and difficulty getting and maintaining prime, I'm not sure if any of that would have a bearing.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Kelly,

Well, that explains the pump anyway.. I am not a fan of the Hayward SuperPump, the motors more than the pump itself... I went though a couple of them at rent houses..

I think you'll love your IntelliFlo... I have had three of them running 24/7 for the past three years.. My plan is to see which lasts longer, me or the pumps...

Thanks for the feedback..

Jim R.

 

[FLIPPERNUT]

So it's not just me!!!

 

[Catanzaro]

But aside from inconvenience to me and difficulty getting and maintaining prime, I'm not sure if any of that would have a bearing.

Once the pump is primed, unless you open the cover, upon start up there is no air in the system, so this would not be an issue. I really believe you have had a little bit of bad luck. Things could be worse.

 

[scooperhsd]

God I hope your's isn't the usual - I'd be broke several times over on my 20 years of ownership !!!!

I tend to buy a new pool pump about every 7-10 years. When I moved in , the first pump was a Hayward superpump, my first replacement was another Superpump (1.5 HP), and when that rusted out about 4-5 years ago I put in the Superflo, logevity on the this is unknown because I take it out every fall and reinstall it every spring - it spends the winter inside. I did replace the sand filter about 15-20 years ago. in 2007, we replaced the original liner (pool was put in 1983 - when the house was built) - between the liner and the water that we had trucked in that was our most expensive repair.

Mostly - I buy my chemicals and watch over it like a hawk (when we're home).

 

[AquaBoy]

I may be overthinking this, but just noticed you live in MN. I don't know, but would maybe guess, that if the pool was not maintained properly and some brutally cold winters hit that it may have also been nailed a few times over by that over the years. I don't know what is normal in terms of winter there, but I know it's not something I could handle as flurries are about as much as we get here; and that's just on a five year cycle or so, if that. Does make me wonder though if that added to any issues you had upon taking it over. Good for you taking the duties over though. Seemed a bit over my head at first, but it is kind of nice to be able to do things on your own time and learn how to diagnose issues using the folks here and then, when they happen again, you don't feel the need to call out a pool guy since you already know what's going on.

 

[Catanzaro]

Scooper:

How long did your original liner last? What did you do to take care of it, and when did it really become noticeable for fading? If you can remember. Thanks!

 

[SoCalGuy]

Kelly, pools are luxury items, like sports cars and boats. They cost money to maintain, and when they need repair, it can get expensive. That said, I don't think your costs are typical. All the components ... plumbing, filters, heaters, pumps ... have to be compatible and work together, so a lot depends on how the pool was originally designed and constructed, and the quality of the parts originally installed. Pumps normally should last more than five years. We just replaced a Whisperflo after 12 years, and still have two the same age going strong. It sounds like maybe some of the original equipment you had wasn't quite right for your set up. I think once you get the right equipment and get it "dialed in" your costs should go down.

 

[Kelly Gordon]

Thanks everyone. I'm knocking on all the wood I can find (and that's a lot, since my yard is 2 acres of forest) that next year we won't have any major repairs or replacements. Hopefully, it was just a string of bad luck plus ineffective equipment.

One follow-up question, since I'm in the middle of my spring SLAM: so far, I've used about 20 128-oz bottles of 12.5% bleach to slam my pool. I suppose I'll end up spending about $100 on opening chemicals. Does that sound about right for a pool my size? When I opened it, it had no FC and no CYA, so I'm mostly just replacing both (and dealing with the algae that accumulated during the 10+ days we didn't have a working pump).

The silver lining to spending all the money on repairs before the season has even started is that it's been a cool, wet May here in Minneapolis. No one's been itching to swim, so not having a working pool didn't matter. But we *might* hit 80 on Friday, so I'm excited to maybe have the pool ready to go by then.

- - - Updated - - -

Well, that explains the pump anyway.. I am not a fan of the Hayward SuperPump, the motors more than the pump itself... I went though a couple of them at rent houses..

Exactly. What killed the pump last week was the motor. The wet side of the pump *might* have been fine. But the energy savings of the VS pump made us to decide to go ahead and spend the extra money money now to replace the pump altogether, vs just put in a new motor for the SuperPump. We were also told the replacement motors for the SuperPump are pretty worthless, that most last two years max before burning out.

 

[faby3003]

One follow-up question, since I'm in the middle of my spring SLAM: so far, I've used about 20 128-oz bottles of 12.5% bleach to slam my pool. I suppose I'll end up spending about $100 on opening chemicals. Does that sound about right for a pool my size? When I opened it, it had no FC and no CYA, so I'm mostly just replacing both (and dealing with the algae that accumulated during the 10+ days we didn't have a working pump).

If you have a solid pool cover (vs. a mesh cover) then I would say most people don't have to SLAM their pool in the spring. The first couple years I owned the pool I had a mesh winter cover and I would have to SLAM every spring, but I was also opening it mid to late May here in MN. Now I have a solid auto cover and there is always some chlorine in the pool when I open in the spring and I don't have to SLAM it. I try to open it in early May before the water gets too warm.

What time of year are you closing the pool? Are you bringing the FC up to SLAM level when you close? I close my pool in mid-October.

Regarding replacing equipment, my pool was built in 1998. I have owned the house since 2011. I replaced the original liner in 2011, and I am just starting to replace some of the equipment. New pump this year, heater a couple of years ago, will likely need a new filter soon. So, even with the cold MN winters I think you can expect at least 10 years out of your equipment, and 15-20 being possible.

 

[wayner]

@Kelly - your results are not the norm. I live in Toronto so we have a similar climate to yours. I had my pool built ten years ago and haven't had to replace any major pieces of equipment other than the SWCG cells which only last a few years, and the SWCG sensor unit - the Jandy Aquapure 1400 that I have has had issues with the sensors. I have had some minor work done on my heater, such as replacing the igniter, but other than that I haven't had the issues that you have. Just last year I replaced the paper cartridge filters for my pool but that is to be expected after 9 years. But the pump, heater, SWCG, etc are all original. I did buy a new Kreepy Krauly but I got a generic one on Amazon that was only about US$100. I don't even know what an vacuum pump is except to know my pool doesn't have one.

 

[Kelly Gordon]

This is really good information. Thank you. We do have a solid cover. We typically open in mid-May and close in early October. I do not believe the FC was up to SLAM level at close last fall; I think it was just at the normal level. So that's one change I can make this year. When we open in the spring, the water is always clear and blue (and roughly 55-60 degrees), but I've never found residual FC or CYA. Maybe adding more chlorine in the fall will help that. It makes sense to me that we wouldn't have to SLAM if we can have some FC in the pool right away and if we don't have equipment die on us which necessitates the pool not running for a week or more.

 

[faby3003]

Kelly - if your water is clear in the spring and only 55-60 degrees, what is the reason you are SLAMing for so long in the spring? I would think with clear and cold water, even with no FC you might have to SLAM for 24 hours and then be done. Do you fail the overnight chlorine loss test?

 

[Kelly Gordon]

Well, this year the pump died before the water was balanced, and it took us 10+ days to get a new pump installed. So the water sat and turned green. I'm fairly sure there was a similar situation last year; I can't remember specifics, but it seems like every spring something big goes wrong.

From what was said above, I would guess if I was able to add chemicals the day the pool opens next spring, I won't have to SLAM. But this year: yes, I've been SLAMMING for 36 hours. The end is in sight. Water is blue with a green tint, mostly clear. All the leaves and worms and now algae silt is vacuumed up. I don't know that I will hold FC at SLAM levels tonight, but maybe by this time tomorrow we'll be there.

Bonus: the water is finally warming up, so I might be able to turn on the SWG this weekend too.