Taylor Salt Test Inconsistent and More Test Help Needed!

[pauly3dotcom]

Hey Folks I just got my Taylor Salt Kit off of Amazon… it’s super inconsistent and all over the place. We switched to salt last week and I had been using strips. I added 320lbs of salt last Saturday and the Leslie’s Salt strips (repackaged AquaChek strips) have consistently registered 6.6 or 3,490. The IntelliChlor IC40 shows a solid green light on the cell and chlorine production is great.

1st Test - 4,000
2nd Test - 3,200
3rd Test - 3,800
4th Test - 3,600

What would be causing the salt readings to be inconsistent? Is that normal?

Other Questions:
I have a 3’ Fountain plus 2 Pentair Globrite Bubblers and the pH is consistently well over like 8.2 and 8.4. I add muratic acid and it comes down quickly but it gets right back up quickly. I do not run the bubblers or fountain everyday and really they are only on during the weekends. What else can be driving my pH t

Lastly when measuring CYA and looking down the tube should the black dot be completely not visible? Or should I stop adding drops when it is faint. I really struggle with this test because I don’t know when to stop as my brain is like I can still see it. “It’s right there, drop, drop, drop, still see something, drop, drop, drop!” Is there any other way to test it?

 

[HermanTX]

The salt test has a very definitive end point. When it turns salmon color that is it the end point. Are you using a speedstir? You show you are so you should be consistent on that aspect. If not you could have inconsistent results by swirling. Are you using the same sample and getting the inconsistency or is each a different sample of water from the pool at different times. I have never had that much of a difference. Are you holding the bottle vertical and letting the drop form and drop into the vial while on the speedstirrer? You just purchased the test kit so your reagents should be good. Suggest you continue to test and ensure you are consistent in your procedure, vertical bottle, lightly squeezing it, etc.
Also the 10ml volume is before you put the magnetic stirrer in it.

With regard to the CYA test, I have found the best way to test is as follows.
After mixing your 50/50 solution of pool sample and reagent. Let it sit for 30 secs then do 1 shake.
Pour it in the tube to a known value such as 80 mark line. Verify you can see the dot.
Then add the mixture till it reaches the 70 mark line. Then look at the dot. If you you see it then continue to the 60 line,
Do this until you cannot see the dot and then record the number where you last saw the dot.
This way you are not constantly looking at the dot as you add the solution.
Add the solution, then look, add the solution to the next line(look from the side not down into the tube) and then look down.
You only then are looking for the dot every 10 seconds or so and not consistently while you put each drop in.
Remember you only record CYA in decade numbers so by doing this way you are not tempted to say it is between 2 numbers. for example 40 or 50.
If you saw the dot at 50 ( and it may be vague) but you do not see it at 40 then the CYA is 50 for the test.

With regard to pH, what is your TA. That is a buffer for pH. Obviously aeration can increase pH as you have considered that with your fountains, etc. The rate of pH rise with aeration also depends on the TA. The higher the TA, the faster the pH will rise.

 

[pauly3dotcom]

The salt test has a very definitive end point. When it turns salmon color that is it the end point. Are you using a speedstir? You show you are so you should be consistent on that aspect. If not you could have inconsistent results by swirling. Are you using the same sample and getting the inconsistency or is each a different sample of water from the pool at different times. I have never had that much of a difference. Are you holding the bottle vertical and letting the drop form and drop into the vial while on the speedstirrer? You just purchased the test kit so your reagents should be good. Suggest you continue to test and ensure you are consistent in your procedure, vertical bottle, lightly squeezing it, etc.
Also the 10ml volume is before you put the magnetic stirrer in it.

With regard to the CYA test, I have found the best way to test is as follows.
After mixing your 50/50 solution of pool sample and reagent. Let it sit for 30 secs then do 1 shake.
Pour it in the tube to a known value such as 80 mark line. Verify you can see the dot.
Then add the mixture till it reaches the 70 mark line. Then look at the dot. If you you see it then continue to the 60 line,
Do this until you cannot see the dot and then record the number where you last saw the dot.
This way you are not constantly looking at the dot as you add the solution.
Add the solution, then look, add the solution to the next line(look from the side not down into the tube) and then look down.
You only then are looking for the dot every 10 seconds or so and not consistently while you put each drop in.
Remember you only record CYA in decade numbers so by doing this way you are not tempted to say it is between 2 numbers. for example 40 or 50.
If you saw the dot at 50 ( and it may be vague) but you do not see it at 40 then the CYA is 50 for the test.

With regard to pH, what is your TA. That is a buffer for pH. Obviously aeration can increase pH as you have considered that with your fountains, etc. The rate of pH rise with aeration also depends on the TA. The higher the TA, the faster the pH will rise.

Yes I am using the SpeedStir and the samples are from different locations of my pool. All fresh pulls with 20 min of each other. I would also clean the cylinder as those two reagents cause a white buildup very very quickly.

Thank You for the great insight on figuring out the CYA. I will work it like that and record when I cannot see it at all.

My TA is at 60. Here is the link to my PoolMath Logs where you will see that I am consistently over >=8.2. PoolMath Logs

 

[HermanTX]

Yes I am using the SpeedStir and the samples are from different locations of my pool. All fresh pulls with 20 min of each other. I would also clean the cylinder as those two reagents cause a white buildup very very quickly.

Pulling samples from different part of the pool can lead to inconsistent results of the same test. It is generally a good practice to pull your sample from the same area of the pool. Every pool is unique and circulation voids can cause the slight variation.

Calling on @mknauss to look at your pH issue since your TA is at the desired level and you seem to reduce and monitor your water feature use. One other idea, are your pool returns pointed to the surface that could be causing some aeration?
Also, have you verified that your pool volume is set properly in the Pool Math app?

Hope the new test procedure for the CYA works for you. It has really helped me to have more consistent readings.

 

[Newdude]

What would be causing the salt readings to be inconsistent? Is that normal?

Well the Taylor kit which has the best variance is +\- 200 ppm. Technically your 3600 and 4000 are acceptable if it was really 3800. The 3200 could have been an impatient fluke.

Any time the tests get wonky we recommend slowing it down. Bottle goes completely upside down and ever so gently squeeze so that gravity makes perfect, consistent, drops.

rushing isn’t always the culprit, but it does take a lot of us out at times.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

On the salt test you’ll notice it starts to “flash” when you get near the endpoint - the drop is added and the test solution turns from milky yellow color to a slight brownish-red then quickly reverts back to yellow. The test is complete when the very next drop you add causes the solution to turn that brownish-red color and it does not revert back to yellow. That’s the end point. You don’t keep adding drops until it stops changing to darker shades of red, only when it stops “flashing”.

Also, the white precipitate can cling to the plastic test vial. It’s easy to clean off using plain household cleaning ammonia (you can buy a small bottle of ammonia in the dollar store). Just add the ammonia and let it sit for a few minutes and then thoroughly rinse the vial out.

 

[mknauss]

pH issue since your TA is at the desired level and you seem to reduce and monitor your water feature use.

Infinity edge spa, is it elevated? Does that overflow all the time?

What is the TA of your fill water? In your climate, I suspect you are adding water fairly often?

 

[pauly3dotcom]

Pulling samples from different part of the pool can lead to inconsistent results of the same test. It is generally a good practice to pull your sample from the same area of the pool. Every pool is unique and circulation voids can cause the slight variation.

Calling on @mknauss to look at your pH issue since your TA is at the desired level and you seem to reduce and monitor your water feature use. One other idea, are your pool returns pointed to the surface that could be causing some aeration?
Also, have you verified that your pool volume is set properly in the Pool Math app?

Hope the new test procedure for the CYA works for you. It has really helped me to have more consistent readings.

Understood, will keep pulling from same location. Thank You! As far as returns I have 15 Q360 heads in the pool/spa floor that alternate through cycles all day long. I also have 6 jets in the Spa although I have that valve nearly shut and it’s just water. I only turn on the Blower when we are in the spa. I run the pumps from 7AM to 1AM daily. The SWG is ran at 100% from 7:30AM to 10AM and from 4PM to 11PM. I think I am pretty close at calculating the pool volume as I have used the calculator and landed at 16,000. When I add chemicals based on the recommendations from the app when I re-test the changes are pretty close.

Well the Taylor kit which has the best variance is +\- 200 ppm. Technically your 3600 and 4000 are acceptable if it was really 3800. The 3200 could have been an impatient fluke.

Any time the tests get wonky we recommend slowing it down. Bottle goes completely upside down and ever so gently squeeze so that gravity makes perfect, consistent, drops.

rushing isn’t always the culprit, but it does take a lot of us out at times.

Will do the vertical upside down bottle with slight squeeze to form perfect drops, not doing that right now.

On the salt test you’ll notice it starts to “flash” when you get near the endpoint - the drop is added and the test solution turns from milky yellow color to a slight brownish-red then quickly reverts back to yellow. The test is complete when the very next drop you add causes the solution to turn that brownish-red color and it does not revert back to yellow. That’s the end point. You don’t keep adding drops until it stops changing to darker shades of red, only when it stops “flashing”.

Also, the white precipitate can cling to the plastic test vial. It’s easy to clean off using plain household cleaning ammonia (you can buy a small bottle of ammonia in the dollar store). Just add the ammonia and let it sit for a few minutes and then thoroughly rinse the vial out.

Great way of explaining it and definitely seeing the very brief “flash” to red and then back to milky yellow. I completely stop at the first sight of it staying reddish brown. Thank You for the tip on how to clean the vial as it definitely builds quickly and a rinse does nothing to get rid of it.

Infinity edge spa, is it elevated? Does that overflow all the time?

What is the TA of your fill water? In your climate, I suspect you are adding water fairly often?

Yes Sir Infinity Edge Spa that runs pretty much all day. It is negative edge so the water clings the wall on the way down and the most spillover happens when the 3 in-floor cleaners turn on in the spa. When the in-floor cleaners move to the next station it doesn’t really spill.

Sadly I have never tested the TA of my fill water but I will do so today for sure. While we have had a minor reprieve of Triple Digit Heat it has been consistently in the 90’s for weeks. That is BAU for South Texas.

Here is a pic of the spa and my new toy!

 

[mknauss]

Lots of aeration -----

 

[stricttime]

Wow! I love your pool design!

 

[Nikilyn]

The salt test has a very definitive end point. When it turns salmon color that is it the end point. Are you using a speedstir? You show you are so you should be consistent on that aspect. If not you could have inconsistent results by swirling. Are you using the same sample and getting the inconsistency or is each a different sample of water from the pool at different times. I have never had that much of a difference. Are you holding the bottle vertical and letting the drop form and drop into the vial while on the speedstirrer? You just purchased the test kit so your reagents should be good. Suggest you continue to test and ensure you are consistent in your procedure, vertical bottle, lightly squeezing it, etc.
Also the 10ml volume is before you put the magnetic stirrer in it.

With regard to the CYA test, I have found the best way to test is as follows.
After mixing your 50/50 solution of pool sample and reagent. Let it sit for 30 secs then do 1 shake.
Pour it in the tube to a known value such as 80 mark line. Verify you can see the dot.
Then add the mixture till it reaches the 70 mark line. Then look at the dot. If you you see it then continue to the 60 line,
Do this until you cannot see the dot and then record the number where you last saw the dot.
This way you are not constantly looking at the dot as you add the solution.
Add the solution, then look, add the solution to the next line(look from the side not down into the tube) and then look down.
You only then are looking for the dot every 10 seconds or so and not consistently while you put each drop in.
Remember you only record CYA in decade numbers so by doing this way you are not tempted to say it is between 2 numbers. for example 40 or 50.
If you saw the dot at 50 ( and it may be vague) but you do not see it at 40 then the CYA is 50 for the test.

With regard to pH, what is your TA. That is a buffer for pH. Obviously aeration can increase pH as you have considered that with your fountains, etc. The rate of pH rise with aeration also depends on the TA. The higher the TA, the faster the pH will rise.

I had no idea you measured it from the last point you saw it. I've been doing it wrong. Means mine is a little higher than I thought, which is good. Thank you!

 

[pauly3dotcom]

Lots of aeration -----

So... is there any way to slow it down? Or will I just have to keep gallons of MA on hand at all times.

I tested my tap and it is at 90 TA. I also retested Salt using the vertical drop method and it registered at 3,800.

Wow! I love your pool design!

Thank You! I have to give my dear wife all the credit! She chose the design, tiles, plaster colors and travertine. She has great and EXPENSIVE taste!!!

 

[HermanTX]

Suggest you post a picture of your equipment pad from different angles and that will help to see if you can alter the spillover of your spa into the pool

 

[pauly3dotcom]

Hello TFP Pros! I went into Leslie’s for some Liquid Chlorine and to have my salt tested as my Taylor test was all over the place. I walked out with zero LC (out of stock) and a $50 bottle of PHOSfree.

I’ll start with Salt, they came back at 3,443 and my Taylor Kit is saying 3,600 (18 drops) -3,800 (19 drops). Those are pretty close although there is a big difference in the pH and TA between the two tests. They then scared me into buying a $50.00 bottle of PHOSfree because it was measured at 779ppb.

Would you all please review the results below and advise what I should do next. Do I truly need to add 16lbs of Alkalinity Up (I would use Baking Soda) and 67oz of PHOSfree?

 

[mknauss]

Question - since you trust Leslie water testing, why are you not following their recommendations?

We do not use pool store test results for guidance. And you do not need to mess with phosphates.

 

[pauly3dotcom]

Question - since you trust Leslie water testing, why are you not following their recommendations?

We do not use pool store test results for guidance. And you do not need to mess with phosphates.

LOL! Got it, loud and clear! I’ll go get my $50.00 back!