Super High CH (875)

[JamesW]

I would contact NPT to see what they think.

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[SuperMiguel]

Will NPT come out for free? Or how does it work?

 

[JamesW]

Will NPT come out for free? Or how does it work?

It depends on the details of the case.

Contact them and see what they say.

 

[Uhhello]

Sometimes plaster dissolves and the pH, TA and CH all go up continuously.

I would also recommend a K-1766 salt test kit and a salinity meter that measures salinity using conductivity.

Monitor the levels for a while and keep good notes so that we can see some history to see if there is an obvious pattern.

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Do you own either of these? Other than ease of use and possibly greater accuracy, is there any advantage over a drop test kit?

 

[SuperMiguel]

Try scratching the plaster to see if it is hard or soft.

Weak plaster scratches easily and good plaster is hard to scratch.

In weak pebble plaster, the pebbles come loose easily when brushing or scratching.

Are you getting a lot of loose pebbles?

This is difficult to tell the difference if you do not have a reference for good and bad plaster.

If the pH, TA and CH are all increasing continuously without adding fill water or chemicals, then the plaster is dissolving.

If the TA and CH increase the exact same amount, the plaster is probably dissolving.

Did you register the plaster with NPT?

Contact NPT and see what they have to say.

They can get a sample of the plaster by doing a core drill down to gunite and then examining the plaster for quality assurance.

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The plaster is not soft, i tried scratching it with my nails and almost lost my nail but nothing from the plaster.

My TA is not increasing, it was 80 last test. I think only CH and pH are increasing. Also i forgot to mention that my pool was also started with adding a bunch of acid, and then 2 or 3 months later then bunch of acid was added, i wonder if the plaster is fine just reacting to the acid washes?

 

[SuperMiguel]

Called them, and was told that they can only test for material issues, not installation issues, will send them require documentation to get that started

It depends on the details of the case.

Contact them and see what they say.

 

[JamesW]

Other than ease of use and possibly greater accuracy, is there any advantage over a drop test kit?

By comparing the salinity as tested by a drop kit vs. a conductivity meter, you can distinguish between salt and other TDS (total Dissolved Solids) components like calcium.

Normally TDS is not a thing to measure, but you have an unusual case where knowing the components can be helpful in diagnosing the source of rising pH and CH.

The acid dumps definitely dissolved plaster and increased the CH.

The fact that the pH bounced back on its own indicates that the plaster has a problem.

Normally, the acid needs to be neutralized with baking soda or some other chemical.

How long was it from the acid dump until the pH recovered on its own?

 

[Uhhello]

By comparing the salinity as tested by a drop kit vs. a conductivity meter, you can distinguish between salt and other TDS (total Dissolved Solids) components like calcium.

Normally TDS is not a thing to measure, but you have an unusual case where knowing the components can be helpful in diagnosing the source of rising pH and CH.

The acid dumps definitely dissolved plaster and increased the CH.

The fact that the pH bounced back on its own indicates that the plaster has a problem.

Normally, the acid needs to be neutralized with baking soda or some other chemical.

How long was it from the acid dump until the pH recovered on its own?

Sorry, i don't have the issue, just reading all the replies the last couple of days and was wondering if this is a "nice to have" for everyday testing.

 

[JamesW]

Called them, and was told that they can only test for material issues, not installation issues, will send them require documentation to get that started

They are plaster experts, so they should be able to test and examine a sample to see if there is a quality problem and they should also be able to determine if the problem is a material issue or if it is due to an installation problem.

Ask them how to take a sample so that you can send it to them for analysis.

 

[JamesW]

Sorry, I don't have the issue, just reading all the replies the last couple of days and was wondering if this is a "nice to have" for everyday testing.

It's nice to have, but not necessary.

If you have a K-1766 and a reading from the SWG, that is usually sufficient.

My preference is extra certainty for all measurements, so I tend to want to test more than necessary with more equipment than necessary.

 

[SuperMiguel]

By comparing the salinity as tested by a drop kit vs. a conductivity meter, you can distinguish between salt and other TDS (total Dissolved Solids) components like calcium.

Normally TDS is not a thing to measure, but you have an unusual case where knowing the components can be helpful in diagnosing the source of rising pH and CH.

The acid dumps definitely dissolved plaster and increased the CH.

The fact that the pH bounced back on its own indicates that the plaster has a problem.

Normally, the acid needs to be neutralized with baking soda or some other chemical.

How long was it from the acid dump until the pH recovered on its own?

About a week

 

[JamesW]

About a week

They probably waited too long.

In any case, I suspect that the plaster is probably bad.

I suspect that the plastering company will go into defensive mode and try to convince you that there is no problem.

The Plaster Manufacturer (NPT) will probably try to avoid getting involved and refer you to the installer.

 

[SuperMiguel]

They probably waited too long.

In any case, I suspect that the plaster is probably bad.

I suspect that the plastering company will go into defensive mode and try to convince you that there is no problem.

The Plaster Manufacturer (NPT) will probably try to avoid getting involved and refer you to the installer.

So what can i do? How long will a bad plaster last? What does it mean by bad plaster? Bad for health? Can i somehow still manage it?

 

[JamesW]

So what can I do?

See what the installer and NPT think.

How long will a bad plaster last?

No way to tell; it depends on exactly what is wrong with the plaster.

That's why you need to have it tested.

What does it mean by bad plaster?

It means that it is probably defective in some way.

Without knowing the details of the mixing and application or test results, there is really no way to tell exactly what went wrong.

There are more than 100 different mistakes that can be made that will cause the plaster to be below acceptable quality standards.

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[JamesW]

Also I forgot to mention that my pool was also started with adding a bunch of acid, and then 2 or 3 months later then bunch of acid was added

Every time they do that, the calcium is increasing by about 300 ppm, especially if the pH bounces back on it's own without adding anything.

How many times have they added acid?

How much acid was used each time?

Why does this need to be done so many times?

 

[SuperMiguel]

Every time they do that, the calcium is increasing by about 300 ppm, especially if the pH bounces back on it's own without adding anything.

How many times have they added acid?

How much acid was used each time?

Why does this need to be done so many times?

Twice, one to start the pool, and another time to get rid of some scaling/white spots