I have a pool at my rental in Saugus, CA that I'd like to have acid washed. I found someone to clean the tile, but I'd like to have a recommendation for someone to acid wash the pool. My old Phoenix pool cleaner did a lousy job on the sides, so I have scale built up on the sides. Now that I've replaced the Phoenix with a Nautilus CC Pro, which does a much better job on the sides and tile, I want to get the pool in shape. I'd appreciate hearing about reasonably priced quality acid washers.
Seeking recommendation for quality yet cost effective acid wash person for Santa Clarita pool
- Thread starter Rental Pool
- Start date
- Jul 17, 2019
- 3,721
- Pool Size
- 13000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Scale is usually caused by water chemistry not the cleaner. Do you have a set of water test results you can post?
I would caution you against an acid wash as that takes a layer of plaster off and shortens the life span, plus does not address the root cause of your scale.
I would caution you against an acid wash as that takes a layer of plaster off and shortens the life span, plus does not address the root cause of your scale.
- May 23, 2015
- 24,450
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
I'd say we can't recommend anyone because we don't recommend doing acid washes. While they are often considered by most to be a routine service for plaster pools, they are incredibly damaging to plaster finishes. even if you could find someone that has good skills and does an "excellent" job, you are still removing millimeters of the plaster surface and it's being done in a haphazard and random way. The uniformity of the surface will suffer and the porosity created by it will only make the plaster more susceptible to algae growth and staining later on. All it really winds up doing is reducing the useful life of the plaster surface. There really is never a good reason to acid wash.
Can you show pictures of the problem you are trying to fix?
Can you show pictures of the problem you are trying to fix?
I know the pool cleaner didn't cause the scale, but it could have lessened the likelihood of it sticking to the walls, as the tenants never brush down the pool. Water is very hard out here. I don't have a current water test result, but I can get a reading when I go there next Tuesday.
I would not acid wash.
There are other options.
You can try an ascorbic acid treatment.
You can try a no drain acid wash by lowering the TA to zero for a day or so with extensive brushing.
You can try Jack’s #2 copper and scale stuff (sulfamic acid).
You can try a no drain zero TA process and sulfamic acid at the same time.
You can drain and sand with diamond pad sanders.
Note: Do your research on all things before deciding what to do.
A zero TA process will eat away some cement, like an acid wash and it can attack metals.
Sulfamic acid can be aggressive to cement and metals like a no drain acid wash.
Metal items like a copper heat exchanger, pool lights, ladders, handrails, light niches etc. are susceptible to attack by sulfamic acid and by a no drain acid wash.
Also, sulfamic acid locks up the chlorine for months.
Draining can cause a pool to pop out of the ground if the water table is too high.
Note: I am not recommending any specific process.
Do your own research before deciding what to do so that you understand all risks and costs.
Check with a local expert before deciding what to do and how to do it.
All processes involve risks and they might not work and they might even make things worse.
www.troublefreepool.com
www.troublefreepool.com
www.troublefreepool.com
There are other options.
You can try an ascorbic acid treatment.
You can try a no drain acid wash by lowering the TA to zero for a day or so with extensive brushing.
You can try Jack’s #2 copper and scale stuff (sulfamic acid).
You can try a no drain zero TA process and sulfamic acid at the same time.
You can drain and sand with diamond pad sanders.
Note: Do your research on all things before deciding what to do.
A zero TA process will eat away some cement, like an acid wash and it can attack metals.
Sulfamic acid can be aggressive to cement and metals like a no drain acid wash.
Metal items like a copper heat exchanger, pool lights, ladders, handrails, light niches etc. are susceptible to attack by sulfamic acid and by a no drain acid wash.
Also, sulfamic acid locks up the chlorine for months.
Draining can cause a pool to pop out of the ground if the water table is too high.
Note: I am not recommending any specific process.
Do your own research before deciding what to do so that you understand all risks and costs.
Check with a local expert before deciding what to do and how to do it.
All processes involve risks and they might not work and they might even make things worse.
Acid - Further Reading
www.troublefreepool.com
Metals - Further Reading
www.troublefreepool.com
Ascorbic Acid Treatment - Further Reading
www.troublefreepool.com
It appears all options will be potentially damaging and labor intensive. I'm on a hillside, so the water table won't cause the pool to rise. I'm sensing draining and then sanding with diamond pad sanders would probably be best. That way, the problems can be spot cleaned with the least damage to the pool as a whole. Can you recommend anyone who serves this area who could do a reasonably priced yet high quality cleaning?
- Jul 21, 2013
- 52,940
- Pool Size
- 35000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
@AQUA~HOLICS is the best try for references in So Cal.
You want a plaster company who installs polished finishes like Hydrazoo. They have the equipment and experience to do power sanding of plaster.
- Nov 12, 2017
- 11,896
- Pool Size
- 12300
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
IMO, mechanically abrading the stains away is the only option. My pool was destroyed by an acid wash, requiring a complete replaster. Reduced plaster life from a chemical treatment is the best case scenario. It only gets worse from there. To make the damage done to my pool all the more worthless, just after the pool was refilled after the wash, and before the plaster started bubbling up and falling off the walls and floor, the finish looked perhaps 30% better. So not only did the wash destroy my pool, but it wouldn't have been worth it even if it hadn't.
Mechanical abrasion is only slightly better. If done correctly, it's more controllable, and will leave the finish smoother than acid washing, but it's still going to take some plaster off.
And the risk of emptying a pool is not just the pool popping out of the ground. The water is part of the structure of the pool. It is supplying the counter force against the surface of the finish and the surrounding soil. Many (most?) pools can be emptied for a short span of time without issue. But that is not a guarantee. In some pools, it is the counter force of the water that is stabilizing the plaster. Once removed, the plaster can dry out and start to bubble off, or fall off in larger patches. It's not common, but possible. And the odds increase as the plaster ages.
The reality is, you (or the pool guy, or the previous owner) let the pool's chemistry get out of range and the calcium is the result. The damage is done. If that happened to my pool again, I'd just live with it, let the plaster live out its natural life, and replace it when it is time.
I inherited the calcium on my finish from the previous owner and their inept pool maintenance company. The plaster was ruined in only about six years (I, too, have really hard water). Since the new plaster has been installed, I've taken over the water maintenance 100%. And that's been for about six years. The finish looks like new, without a hint of calcium deposit. Same pool. Same source water. Same span of time. I don't have a robot, just a suction-side vac, so the sides don't get brushed at all (and I don't do it, I have to admit). Still no calcium. No acid wash. No no-drain acid wash. Just good ol' TFP chemistry. That's about as controlled an experiment can get! It's the chemistry, not the 'bot.
Accept your finish. Save the money you'll waste trying to restore it. Put that into the replaster when you're ready. In the meantime, protect your current finish from getting any worse (and hone your skills) by practicing the TFP method of pool care. Your next finish will thank you.
Mechanical abrasion is only slightly better. If done correctly, it's more controllable, and will leave the finish smoother than acid washing, but it's still going to take some plaster off.
And the risk of emptying a pool is not just the pool popping out of the ground. The water is part of the structure of the pool. It is supplying the counter force against the surface of the finish and the surrounding soil. Many (most?) pools can be emptied for a short span of time without issue. But that is not a guarantee. In some pools, it is the counter force of the water that is stabilizing the plaster. Once removed, the plaster can dry out and start to bubble off, or fall off in larger patches. It's not common, but possible. And the odds increase as the plaster ages.
The reality is, you (or the pool guy, or the previous owner) let the pool's chemistry get out of range and the calcium is the result. The damage is done. If that happened to my pool again, I'd just live with it, let the plaster live out its natural life, and replace it when it is time.
I inherited the calcium on my finish from the previous owner and their inept pool maintenance company. The plaster was ruined in only about six years (I, too, have really hard water). Since the new plaster has been installed, I've taken over the water maintenance 100%. And that's been for about six years. The finish looks like new, without a hint of calcium deposit. Same pool. Same source water. Same span of time. I don't have a robot, just a suction-side vac, so the sides don't get brushed at all (and I don't do it, I have to admit). Still no calcium. No acid wash. No no-drain acid wash. Just good ol' TFP chemistry. That's about as controlled an experiment can get! It's the chemistry, not the 'bot.
Accept your finish. Save the money you'll waste trying to restore it. Put that into the replaster when you're ready. In the meantime, protect your current finish from getting any worse (and hone your skills) by practicing the TFP method of pool care. Your next finish will thank you.
Reasonably priced and high quality rarely go together.
Realistically, the two are generally mutually exclusive.
I suspect that an ascorbic acid treatment would probably make a pretty good difference.
The worst stains look like iron and the calcium will generally be unnoticeable if it is white.
The worst stains look like iron and the calcium will generally be unnoticeable if it is white.
- May 23, 2015
- 24,450
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
I don’t think you’d find a reputable plaster company that would be willing to touch the surface other than to do a full chip out and replaster. They wouldn’t want to risk having to warranty their work on a compromised surface. That would leave you few options aside from a “handyman” willing to do the job with absolutely no guarantee or warranty on work.
@Dirk and @JamesW have the right idea - consider doing the least aggressive chemical cleaning process (ascorbic acid cleaning or a Jacks Magic copper and scale removal process), dump the pool water (to flush out any crud released from the pool surface), and then refill the pool. Save the money you’d spend on hiring someone and put it towards a new surface.
@Dirk and @JamesW have the right idea - consider doing the least aggressive chemical cleaning process (ascorbic acid cleaning or a Jacks Magic copper and scale removal process), dump the pool water (to flush out any crud released from the pool surface), and then refill the pool. Save the money you’d spend on hiring someone and put it towards a new surface.
- Nov 12, 2017
- 11,896
- Pool Size
- 12300
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
I should have mentioned, the first step is to determine if it's actually calcium or not. My post was about a plaster surface subjected to hard water and poor water maintenance resulting in calcium scale deposits. That's what my pool's problem was, and an acid wash only made things worse. If it's something other than calcium scaling, then others here know more about dealing with that.
- Nov 12, 2017
- 11,896
- Pool Size
- 12300
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Yah, my calcium scaling was awful because it was white on a dark finish. That greenish/yellowish stuff in the OP's pic could be something else (or something in addition to calcium scaling). Again, step one is to figure out what you're dealing with and to not assume it's one thing or another. Then apply the proper fix for the actual problem.
I’m only in contact with plaster companies for new and re-plaster type of work and not what you’re describing, sorry.
What I'm hearing from you doesn't appear very promising. Maybe I'll just have to live with it the way it is (other than have the tile cleaned with Maxx Strip -- I got a referral from the distributor). I replastered the pool 8 years ago and don't plan on redoing it in the near future. I'm open to using ascorbic acid, though I'd prefer hiring someone who is experienced at doing it.
I tested the water at my rental today, both with my Taylor kit and Leslie's in store AccuBlue. Our results didn't turn out the same, so I'll provide both. The first number is Leslie's, and the second from my Taylor kit.
Free Chlorine ----------2.19 --------------2.0
Total Chlorine --------- 2.62 ------------- slightly over 2.2
pH --------------------- 8.2 --------------- 1 drop took it down to 7.8 and 2 drops to 7.2
Total Alkalinity -------- 125 -------------- 120
Calcium Hardness ----- 138 -------------- 170
Cyanuric Acid ---------- 5 ----------------- >30
Iron --------------------- 0.1
Copper ----------------- 0.1
Phosphates ------------- 292 --------------- 0
TDS --------------------- 1100
I generally add 8-12 oz of muriatic acid every week, and that seems to keep it balanced, though Leslie's says I need to add 2 gallons 4 oz of muriatic acid for the high alkalinity. I added 12 oz today.
For the low calcium, Leslie's recommended 56# of their Hardness Plus. I added 2# of HTH Calcium Plus today.
For the high combined available chlorine, Leslie's recommended 4# of Leslie's Fresh 'N Clear.
For the low CyA, Leslie's recommends 4 gallons 48 Fl oz of Instant Pool Water Conditioner or 11# 11oz of Leslie's Conditioner. I've used whatever Walmart's cyanuric acid in the past.
For the high Phosphates, Leslie's recommends 62 Fl oz of Leslie's NoPHOS. I added 4 oz of SeaKlear Phosphate Remover today.
I'd appreciate your recommendations.
New item by Barry Levine
I tested the water at my rental today, both with my Taylor kit and Leslie's in store AccuBlue. Our results didn't turn out the same, so I'll provide both. The first number is Leslie's, and the second from my Taylor kit.
Free Chlorine ----------2.19 --------------2.0
Total Chlorine --------- 2.62 ------------- slightly over 2.2
pH --------------------- 8.2 --------------- 1 drop took it down to 7.8 and 2 drops to 7.2
Total Alkalinity -------- 125 -------------- 120
Calcium Hardness ----- 138 -------------- 170
Cyanuric Acid ---------- 5 ----------------- >30
Iron --------------------- 0.1
Copper ----------------- 0.1
Phosphates ------------- 292 --------------- 0
TDS --------------------- 1100
I generally add 8-12 oz of muriatic acid every week, and that seems to keep it balanced, though Leslie's says I need to add 2 gallons 4 oz of muriatic acid for the high alkalinity. I added 12 oz today.
For the low calcium, Leslie's recommended 56# of their Hardness Plus. I added 2# of HTH Calcium Plus today.
For the high combined available chlorine, Leslie's recommended 4# of Leslie's Fresh 'N Clear.
For the low CyA, Leslie's recommends 4 gallons 48 Fl oz of Instant Pool Water Conditioner or 11# 11oz of Leslie's Conditioner. I've used whatever Walmart's cyanuric acid in the past.
For the high Phosphates, Leslie's recommends 62 Fl oz of Leslie's NoPHOS. I added 4 oz of SeaKlear Phosphate Remover today.
I'd appreciate your recommendations.
New item by Barry Levine
I thought I posted this on Tuesday. Apparently I didn't hit the post reply button. I look forward to your suggestions.
It's pretty easy.
Ascorbic Acid Treatment - Further Reading
www.troublefreepool.com
Forget about phosphates.
- May 23, 2015
- 24,450
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Aside from managing your FC and pH better, absolutely none of those Leslie’s recommendations are necessary. Why on earth would anyone suggest to add calcium increaser to a pool in a western state where extremely hard fill water is the norm?? That’s total rubbish … and so are Leslie’s recommended levels.
FC and pH, that’s what you need to control. Your staining is aesthetic in nature and has no impact on the pool’s usefulness. An ascorbic acid treatment is easy to perform and best done in the early spring when the pool water is still too cold to swim in but you can work reasonably well outdoors. Hiring someone to do it will only likely cause more problems and cost you lots of unnecessary expense.
FC and pH, that’s what you need to control. Your staining is aesthetic in nature and has no impact on the pool’s usefulness. An ascorbic acid treatment is easy to perform and best done in the early spring when the pool water is still too cold to swim in but you can work reasonably well outdoors. Hiring someone to do it will only likely cause more problems and cost you lots of unnecessary expense.