Sand Suggestions?

[profector]

Hi All,

Looking for suggestions, I have TR 140 filter, it holds 900+ lbs of sand. It seems to have lost of ability it filter out the finer particles. The water is mostly just cloudy, but does a brown\green tint to it. It's so bad you can barely say the bottom at 3'. I've shocked and vacuumed like crazy and still no luck. Last year I started adding DE after backwashing and that helped then so I started to do it again this year, but it doesn't seem to be helping. I talked to the local pool stores folks and had them test my water just to make sure they were getting similar results. Everything looks good number wise. They suggested replacing the sand. Reading here it seems the suggestion is to just clean it so that's what I did. About two weeks ago I pushed the hose into the sand and moved the hose around for more than an hour. Lots of junk came out, but it never ran clear. The PSI did go from 15psi to about 5 psi which is the lowest I've seen it since I've had this house. It's always 15ish after backwashing. More shocking, copper, and clarifier and still dirty water. I'm thinking it's time to replace the sand a check for cracks in the laterals. No sand in the pool so I'm doubting the laterals are cracked. I'm thinking the sand is gunked up and I'll be better off replacing it. I did look at filter cleaners, but after reading about them I wasn't confident it would help any. If I'm off base let me know.



BTW the pump is a Superflo VS 342001

 

[Fingaling]

The general belief here is that sand doesn't go bad. That sand in your filter has been getting pummeled by wind, waves, rain, and glaciers for thousands of years. A few years in your sand filter isn't going to do much to it.

If your water didn't run clear your need to keep deep cleaning. And clarifier only will gunk it up faster. If you're water is cloudy and slightly green that sounds more like algae then filtration problems.

Can you post a full set of test results?

 

[tim5055]

The water is mostly just cloudy, but does a brown\green tint to it. It's so bad you can barely say the bottom at 3'.

More shocking, copper, and clarifier and still dirty water.

I'm sorry, these two statements tell me you don't have a filter problem - you have a chemistry problem.

You need to conduct an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test and I think the results will tell us you need to SLAM Process

But, as Fingaling said - can you post a full set of test results fro your kit, not pool store numbers.

 

[domct203]

And stop with the copper immediately. As copper builds up it will stain pool surfaces and turn hair and fingernails green. The only way to remove copper is to drain & refill. In a properly sanitized pool there is absolutely no need for copper.

 

[profector]

I'm sorry, these two statements tell me you don't have a filter problem - you have a chemistry problem.

You need to conduct an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test and I think the results will tell us you need to SLAM Process

But, as Fingaling said - can you post a full set of test results fro your kit, not pool store numbers.

SLAM I'm familiar with but not OCTL. My fear with SLAM is fading the liner, but I've done it with before. I'll have to look up OCTL

 

[profector]

And stop with the copper immediately. As copper builds up it will stain pool surfaces and turn hair and fingernails green. The only way to remove copper is to drain & refill. In a properly sanitized pool there is absolutely no need for copper.

Right now my tests shows 2 to 4 chlorine, 7.2 ish PH, 120 alk, and I'm out of test for CA but pool store showed it at 40. I don't test for hardness.

 

[Donldson]

SLAM I'm familiar with but not OCTL. My fear with SLAM is fading the liner, but I've done it with before. I'll have to look up OCTL

The active chlorine during a SLAM is absolutely no danger to a liner, shocking and copper is. Copper can stain and usually shocking involves dumping some random amount of solid chlorine in to the pool which would be way more of a concern than a measured SLAM. Your thinking is a bit backwards I'm afraid.

 

[tim5055]

SLAM I'm familiar with but not OCTL. My fear with SLAM is fading the liner, but I've done it with before. I'll have to look up OCTL

We base our pool care system on accurate testing and only adding what the pool needs, when it needs it. To do that you need your own accurate test kit.

The Overnight Chlorine Loss Test is a simple scientific procedure. Science tells us that two things consume chlorine in a pool; UV rays of the sun and organic matter being oxidized by the chlorine.

If we take a accurate measurement of the chlorine in the pool (the test kits we recomend can test down to .2ppm FC) after the sun is off the pool and then take a second accurate measurement of the chlorine in the pool teh next morning before the sun is on the pool then we can see what effect organic matter is having on the pool. As there will always be a little "background noise" of organics in any pool the threashold of loss we find acceptable is 1.0ppm loss

If your FC level remained the same, or went down by 1.0 or less, the water is clean. There isn't any living algae or other organic contamination in the pool.

If you lost more than 1.0 ppm of FC, then there is something in the water that needs to be removed and you should SLAM Process.

As the articles in our pool school point out, the pool industry refuses to recognize the connection between CYA/Stabilizer and the ability of chlorine to do it's thing sanitizing the water. others here can give you the scientific details if you want, but lets just say CYA locks the ability of chlorine to sanitize. The more CYA you have the more chlorine you need to keep in the pool to keep algae at bay and following the same logic, kill the algae.

I took over my pool with a CYA of about 250 (CYA tests above 100 are just a guess, not very specific contrary to what the pool store says). With a CYA of 250 I had to keep my chlorine level at around 20 just to keep algae away. Do not fall for pool store hype that if you have chlorine levels above the "recommended" 2 - 4 you will destroy your pool. Unfortunately the pool industry has evolved into sales by scare tactics, misdirection, misinformation and marketing hype. Pool Stores can and will sell you most anything....whether it helps or hurts your pool.....they just don't know any better.

Do not feel alone. You are among the probably 100 or so folks who have already posted this season wondering how to "fix" their broken filter whe the problem was really in the chemistry of their pool.

 

[profector]

Thanks for the details. Going try SLAM again

I don't give too much thought to cyanic acid. I empty a lot of water out over winter and with the back washing and refills it stays low. Not say they it couldn't creep up. It just hasn't. I betting that happens more the further south you go, especially in dry places.