Recurring Metal Stains... worse than ever...

Jump to latest Follow Reply
carlos31820 said:
Sounds good. It looks like my MM tally for the month of June is exactly 5 bottles. That's higher than I was hoping but at least this regimen is a lot easier to carry out.

Expense wise I'm ahead of doing GLB Stain Magnet followed by Jacks Purple stuff. As I've mentioned before, I was having to use AA or GLB Stain Magnet every 7-10 days. I would also use a full quart of Jacks per week only to see the stains reappear.

So even though I'm using about the same amount of sequestrant as before, I don't have the expense of GLB Stain Magnet or AA. I also don't have the increased chlorine demand and cloudiness issues that follow AA treatments. Metal Magic is also about $5-6 cheaper per bottle.
Click to expand...

Swampwoman said:
Carlos, glad its at least more trouble free and cheaper, though of course I wish we could someday determine the source so you could get it dialed down ;)
Click to expand...

5 quarts per month @ $14/qt = $70/month

That's pretty steep for extra chemicals but, given how bad your liner gets, I don't see a short term solution that would be any cheaper.

I wonder if any of these scale remover manufacturers use PBTC (2-Phosphonobutane -1,2,4-Tricarboxylic Acid) in their formulations? The technical literature around PBTC shows it to be much more immune to chlorine oxidation and it is a better scale inhibitor because it is fully dissociated at pool pH values, meaning it is capable of achieving a -4 charge, as opposed to HEDP which only will be doubly negative charge, and thus PBTC can "capture" more +2 valence metal ions.

I have not found any products that explicitly use it though....

See this PDF link (download) for a technical paper on PBTC - https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=7&ved=0ahUKEwiIyZ2zhubUAhUjHGMKHeX_DTAQFghVMAY&url=http%3A%2F%2Fdownloads.hindawi.com%2Fjournals%2Fbca%2F2005%2F546865.pdf&usg=AFQjCNHSYmlcLfnRFa-zTByA-OB_VxqAKw
 
Just updating that the pool remains stain free by simply using regular doses of Proteam Metal Magic. Here is what the pool looked like this evening.

26410ab6ad66a2fe3f665d25cc66bb86.jpg
 
After reading this and suffering stains coming back I decided to give metal magic a try at a dose of 2 qts for 19k gal in vinyl pool. 36 hours in the darker stains have noticibly lightened and the lighter ones have disappeared. Lights and returns are bright white again. fC dropped a bit and PH dropped to below 7 so I adjusted it back to 7.6 and it's holding steady.

Prior to this I had done 2 AA treatments and used quite a bit jacks purple stuff only to have stains return once ph and FC were balanced.

So far I think Proteam Metal Magic is a winner.
 
Did you add borates? It's been a little while since I read through the whole thread, and I can't remember. I've been using the hth metal and stain remover from Walmart, and after I added borates I have dramatically longer periods between doses. Before I would have to add a quart about every week to keep it looking nice. Now I just barely start seeing any stains return after two weeks.
 

Enjoying this content?

Support TFP with a donation.

Give Support
Carlos et al other metal stain sufferers...just checking in to say that after my initial treatment with MM on 6/27, my stains are starting to slightly creep back (really have to look for them) but nonetheless are returning. I believe I will be able to manage with basically the recommended dosage on the bottle to keep them at bay, but we will see how that works moving forward.

Btw, pool is looking great Carlos...hope yours is a little cooler than my "hot tub" right now.
 
Aubie99 said:
Carlos et al other metal stain sufferers...just checking in to say that after my initial treatment with MM on 6/27, my stains are starting to slightly creep back (really have to look for them) but nonetheless are returning. I believe I will be able to manage with basically the recommended dosage on the bottle to keep them at bay, but we will see how that works moving forward.

Btw, pool is looking great Carlos...hope yours is a little cooler than my "hot tub" right now.
Click to expand...

Good to hear from you, neighbor... I'm keeping my stains away using only MM but it takes a LOT of it (about a quart per week). It's still looking pretty good though.

About the heat, my pool is staying around 85 degrees since I have a lot of trees that shade the pool after around 3pm.

Here's a shot I just took from my Nest security cam.

fullsizeoutput_309.jpg
 
Swampwoman said:
^My theory on that would be that your ph is more stable.
Click to expand...

I think that is the case as far as the ph in the cell itself. My TA started at 50 this year, and is just now up to 70 now that I've had to add a little water here and there. I have not added a drop of acid this year. I started the season at 7.3ph, my cya additions dropped it to 7.2, and now it has crept back up to 7.3 again. It took three years of tfp, but my ph has been rock solid. In the cell, who knows what happens or how high the ph goes. I also know that I did a partial slam earlier this year, and the stains immediately came back when the FC went up. I did one 3-4 weeks ago, and did not see the same effect with the borates in the water.
 
Ive got my own tiny thread entitled "my iron adventures"..but wanted to say that the metal magic just floored me with its results over the weekend. This year I got about 3 weeks out of my vitamin C and jacks pink stuff treatment. Saturday night I added 2.5 qts of the magic to my 24000 gallon pool and by Sunday night/Monday morning I was blown away.

This has been a very informative thread. Thanks Swampwoman.
 
cricri1234 said:
Hello Carlos,

I have the same problem as you and you seem the pro in metal staining removal! What's your ''regimen'' to keep the pool stain free?
Click to expand...

Well, there's not much to the current regimen other than frequent doses of ProTeam Metal Magic. I'm having to use about a quart per week. There are several others on this thread and forum that are successfully keeping their metal staining under control using much lower amounts of Metal Magic.

As you have probably seen me mention before, the thing that I prefer about ONLY using Metal Magic is that it doesn't deplete chlorine like Ascorbic Acid does. It is also a cheaper alternative for me. Before, I was having to use Ascorbic Acid or GLB Stain Magnet to lift the stains, then I'd also have to add a sequestrant like Jack's Purple stuff at a cost of anywhere between $45-70 per treatment only to see the stains slowly return in about 7-10 days later.

Doing Ascorbic Acid treatments in the middle of the hot summer here in the south (Georgia) is a risky endeavor since the AA depletes all the chlorine and puts a really high chlorine demand on the pool immediately following the treatment. AA also seems to cause water cloudiness problems in my pool. For my pool, AA treatments would be a 3-4 day ordeal of frequent chlorine testing/dosing as well as 24-hour pool filter runs (for the cloudiness).

With Metal Magic, I only experienced cloudiness on my very first treatment. In hindsight, I think I just over-dosed my pool as I added 4 quarts of Metal Magic on that first treatment. I think 2 quarts would have probably done the trick.

So now, all I do is add Metal Magic, I leave the chlorine at my regular levels and MM does not seem to affect the chlorine level. The only thing I have to keep an eye on is the pH. Since MM is acidic, my pH tends to stay lower than it has in the past so every couple weeks, I have to adjust the pH up by adding Borax.

I wish I did NOT have to use anything at all but it is what it is. My pool has high amounts of metals so I have to deal with it. At least, I have found a way to control the stains with a method that isn't as disruptive as AA treatments.
 
Hello TFP friends. Just checking in to say that I’m still having success with using a weekly regimen of Metal Magic to keep my staining at bay.

Last weekend, however, I had to bump up the pH level to 7.2 in order to run my pool heater. My pool heater is completely bypassed from the flow of water unless I’m using it. Long story short, I increased the pH and much to my dismay, the staining came back full force.

Luckily, about a day after adding two bottles of Metal Magic, the stains were slowly lifted.

Photos after last weekend:
fc4cc47c02b5d5485df093b0e476ab6c.jpg


889bc2a188c497ba19cdd8528aee0b0d.jpg


Photo a day after adding Metal Magic:
abe5553190403fe6f1248db9ce3b4437.jpg
 

Enjoying this content?

Support TFP with a donation.

Give Support
You must log in or register to reply here.
Thread Status
Hello , This thread has been inactive for over 60 days. New postings here are unlikely to be seen or responded to by other members. For better visibility, consider Starting A New Thread.
Top Bottom
Back
Jump to latest Follow Reply