Recent Fire has me struggle to keep pool clean

[TFP_Addict]

This is a 2 part question.

After a recent fire in Burbank, Ash was left in our pool and spa.

I attempted to clean it out like anything else left at the bottom of the pool, but having major issues because of it.
After running our pump for about 3 hours and cleaning the pool manually with the vacuum. Black ash begins to seep back out of the skimmer after the pump turns off into the pool over night. I'm not sure how quickly it happens.

Is the filter overloaded?

The 2nd part of my question is How can I pump water out of the pool using the vacuum with my equipment.
I'm not sure it's possible, because never having been taught about our equipment. Here are some pictures.

Imgur: The most awesome images on the Internet

 

[Richard320]

If the pressure gauge is really high on that filter, that and stuff bypassing would indicate an overloaded filter. Or something cracked or torn internally.

If that is a canister filter, you probably don't have a multiport valve that allows you to pump to waste. It might be possible to replace the filter drain plug with a valve and a hose barb and use a backwash hose. For about the same money and a whole lot less work, you could get a cheap submersible pump that uses a garden hose at Harbor Freight or Home Depot or Lowes.

 

[Zrock]

Do u know if the ash is floating back from pump or just from skimmer? I would clean both skimmer and filter after shutting down until Ash problem is cleared up. Not familiar with your setup but is their a valve marked waste?

 

[TFP_Addict]

I've posted pictures above of my equipment.

Nothing shows "waste", But the labels have mostly all worn off or been removed completely.

 

[zea3]

If water is flowing back from the skimmer into the pool then you need a check valve to prevent the water from siphoning backwards through the plumbing. It has probably been doing this for a while and you are only now noticing it because of the ash discoloring the water. You would want to place it after the filter on the line going back into the pool.

I looked at your pictures. OMG! Whoever plumbed the pool looks like they were in a contest to fit as much plumbing as they could in the smallest possible space! I would follow Richard's suggestion and add a valve where the filter plug is located. That will allow you to remove the cartridge and vacuum to waste if needed as well as draining the pool. I don't think you need to drain to get rid of the ash, but vacuuming to waste would probably help a lot.

 

[TFP_Addict]

If the pressure gauge is really high on that filter, that and stuff bypassing would indicate an overloaded filter. Or something cracked or torn internally.

If that is a canister filter, you probably don't have a multiport valve that allows you to pump to waste. It might be possible to replace the filter drain plug with a valve and a hose barb and use a backwash hose. For about the same money and a whole lot less work, you could get a cheap submersible pump that uses a garden hose at Harbor Freight or Home Depot or Lowes.

The pressure on the filter says it's at 20 PSI when the pump is turned on. After watching a few youtube videos. They indicate that I needed to know the pressure when the filter is clean to determine if the filter needs to be cleaned.
But I don't know that PSI reading. What should I do?

Do u know if the ash is floating back from pump or just from skimmer? I would clean both skimmer and filter after shutting down until Ash problem is cleared up. Not familiar with your setup but is their a valve marked waste?

How would i know if the ash is floating back from the pump? When I open the pump, to clean the skimmer from the pump, i do see ash.
But I know for a fact it's floating back from the skimmer 100%.

If water is flowing back from the skimmer into the pool then you need a check valve to prevent the water from siphoning backwards through the plumbing.

What does a check value look like? How would I determine if I have one.

but vacuuming to waste would probably help a lot.

That was the 2nd part of my question, how do I know if my pool equipment is capable of doing that? What valve should I be looking for, for that?

Please remember, I'm a complete novice at troubleshooting this pool stuff, and you guys are talking to me like i'm a seasoned pro. lol

 

[Zrock]

Now I'm confused.. are u seeing ash from pump skimmer or pool skimmer

 

[TFP_Addict]

Now I'm confused.. are u seeing ash from pump skimmer or pool skimmer

Both. But it's much more obvious from the pool skimmer.

 

[Zrock]

Ahh ok... ash is a real pia... not sure if it would work but some flocking agent to clump the ash together and vacume out?

 

[Richard320]

The pressure on the filter says it's at 20 PSI when the pump is turned on. After watching a few youtube videos. They indicate that I needed to know the pressure when the filter is clean to determine if the filter needs to be cleaned.
But I don't know that PSI reading. What should I do?(

You're going to have to take it apart and clean it to figure out the clean baseline reading. But in the meantime... is there normal looking flow in the skimmer and coming out the return?

 

[TFP_Addict]

You're going to have to take it apart and clean it to figure out the clean baseline reading. But in the meantime... is there normal looking flow in the skimmer and coming out the return?

Yes. Everything seems to be flowing properly. The pool skimmer takes in water normally and the spa fills up at the same speed as always.

Btw, I made a post a while ago similar to this here: Filter Issues - How do you know if your filter is really working?

I'm not sure if the 2 are related. But my filter has been the same for over 25 years.

 

[zea3]

To vacuum to waste, you would need to remove the filter drain cap and replace it with a valve and a backwash hose adapter . Use a clamp to attach a backwash hose to the backwash hose adapter. Remove the cartridge from the filter, open the valve and vacuum. The majority of the water should go into the backwash hose.

The check valve will look like this or this or this.

The product links are for illustration purposes. I don't know if they are the sizes you need for your equipment.

 

[TFP_Addict]

Ok, i'm an idiot. I completely forgot I made a post regarding the check valve around a month ago. This Thread

This is it: Imgur: The most awesome images on the Internet

Ortega Flo-Chk Valve
This is the check valve disassembled.

Imgur: The most awesome images on the Internet

I took the entire thing apart, applied Aladdin Magic Lube to the Cylinder Piece and put it back together. The majority of the time the spa's water doesn't push back into the pool. But some days it does. I don't understand how this part really works to understand why it's failing. From the looks of it, the parts seem fine, but maybe I do need to replace the parts? I have no idea? The only thing that looks abnormal is maybe the spring is bent a little bit at one end (around 5 degrees)

 

[TFP_Addict]

So, an update. The problem is when I started taking over the pool, the pool equipment was in such bad shape, i didn't really know the difference. Which is why I started to give up taking care of the pool, It seemed to never get clean for more than a few days. Also, I had no idea what most of the valves/switches did on the equipment because nothing is labeled! The majority of the valves are to set for going into spa mode. Which we never do. So I wasn't missing out on much.

I've taking in everyone's advice and finally decided to have a guy come out and service the equipment of our pool.

There were so many things worn out or needed to be replaced.

1. Cleaned the Filter. Replaced 1 of the filter sheets because it had a hole in it.
2. Replaced the seal ring around the filter lid.
The pressure now reads 15 PSI after it was cleaned. Before it was at 20. The filter was almost black and looked like mud. How any water got through that mess is beyond me.

The guy also taught me how to vaccum to waste, there is a switch at the bottom of the filter that I never would of noticed.

3. The pool pump lid O ring was worn away and the pump kept getting air inside of it. Decided to replace the lid all together because after the filter was cleaned, we noticed a crack on the top of the lid.
Now you can actually see clearly into the pool pump lid, there isn't a single air bubble. Which finally looks normal.

4. REPLACED THE CHECK VALVE!!!! Yes! which was the root of most of my problems. According to the pool guy, our check valve, which was the Ortega model. Always had a flawed designed. The problem is that sometimes the check value would work fine for a month, then it would fail for a few days. Then off and on, off and on. Took the guy 10 minutes to replace it. Now the spa's water doesn't drop a single inch when the pump turns off. Money well spent.



Total Cost for all the parts and labor was around $280.
Yea, he charged me double on all the equipment, but I didn't mind. I asked him about 400 questions and he kept answering every question without getting annoyed.

 

[Sseaman]

Glad you got it figured out