pump and SWG height in relation to filter?

imagineero

Member
Nov 24, 2019
18
sydney australia
Hi all,
total new guy when it comes to pools, my housemates are naturally anti-talented though and managed to turn our pool into a horror movie swamp complete with monsters from the deep. Have spent the last few weeks in the deep end and managed through lots of good advice and some luck to turn our pool back to clear water before stumbling upon this amazing site! Wish I had of found it earlier, would have saved so much time!

Anyway, long story short our S600 sand filter has possibly not ever had the media changed and I figured out eventually that it was contaminating the water. Tried deep cleaning the media, but after 4 hours of having the hose running into it with the top off and another hose sucking all the floating Crud out of it, it really didn't ever stop spewing out floc and what looks like dog Crud but is more likely some sort of clay/dirt so I bought some sand and will be changing it out this weekend. Seemed like a good opportunity to correct some of the more basic evils of the whole setup, of which there are many. The pipes are all routed in completely absurd ways, most have no less than 5 x 90 degree bends, when one would be fine.

Both the filter and the pump are off level by as much as 10 degrees - the enclosure in the photo is level, which shows how far on the lean the filter is. The pipes going into the pump are on the lean the opposite way. To make life more interesting, both the basket and the SWG have pipes crossing directly in front of them, which means disassembling the whole thing just to clean them. I grabbed an abundance of pressure pipe and bends and will use the opportunity while the filter is empty of sand to level it and re-do the pipes. My question is, do the height of the pump and SWG in relation to the filter affect operation? I've only ever seen the pump sitting on the same ground level as filters in photos of other peoples setups. Does the SWG need to stay below the top of the operating water level of the filter?

The whole setup is at most 8 or 9 yards from the skimmer basket and not much above the water level. I haven't measured, but I'd estimate less than a foot above the water level. The enclosure itself is poorly designed though - it's brick all the way to the ground, no slab or anything, just sitting on sand. Nowhere for water to escape if a leak occurred, and zero breather holes anywhere so no ventilation. The enclosure is bricked well above the top of the filter, and has a hinged ply lid which causes things to get hot in there - and very corrosive due to the moisture and chlorine which can't escape. The mains switch is heavily corroded, and appears to already have been replaced multiple times. I'll be dealing with all those issues at the same time, so if you have any tips I'd welcome them.

Thanks everone!

Shaun

IMG_1897.jpg
 
Welcome to TFP.

My question is, do the height of the pump and SWG in relation to the filter affect operation?

No, the pump has sufficient “head” to push the water through the pipe and equipment. The relative heights do not matter much.

Good luck on your equipment cleanup. Sounds like you have a solid plan and understand the issues.
 
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My concern would be the angle of that first 90. It is more than 90 degrees and could be putting stress on the fittings and/or union. Did the installer force it that way or used heat to bend it?
 
Welcome to TFP.



No, the pump has sufficient “head” to push the water through the pipe and equipment. The relative heights do not matter much.

Good luck on your equipment cleanup. Sounds like you have a solid plan and understand the issues.

Thanks for the kind words and the useful information. At the risk of making myself immediately unpopular, I don’t even swim in pools, I’m more of an ocean swimming kind of guy ;) I got dragged in to this as a matter of life and death. About 5 months ago the family I share the property with had a kids party and one of the little boys had Down syndrome. He sure did take an instant shining to that pool, and when nobody was paying attention headed over there. He’s tall enough that he was able to throw things over the pool fence into the pool, and throw things he did!

Everything went in. The shoes of every guest in the house (about 50 pairs!), 4 or 5 buckets of river pebbles, clothes, little statues, food, bottles, cups, you name it. I only own one pair of shoes and they were on my feet at the time so I was able to laugh it off and consoled the parents of the buy who were mortified.

Fast forward to today and I wasn’t laughing any more. Dark green swamp water, fish, frogs, ducks (!), and the Loch Ness monster took up residence. The family didn’t know how to deal with it. I didn’t either, but I’ve got an advantage in being able to speak English. I’d be screed if it happened in China!

After much coffee, reading and head scratching things started making a little more sense. If I’d found this site earlier I could have spent more time in my hammock!

My end of the bargain is getting the water clear and balanced, sorting out the filter/plumbing etc then handover to the husband of the family with a basic written maintenance routine. The end is within sight!

My concern would be the angle of that first 90. It is more than 90 degrees and could be putting stress on the fittings and/or union. Did the installer force it that way or used heat to bend it?

Nothing at all would surprise me about this place. Not all the pipe is even pressure pipe! I didn’t have too close of a look at the elbow - I think the angle of the shot probably exaggerates things a bit too. That pipe dies come out of the ground well off plumb.

I grabbed some good armfulls of various elbows and joiners, few lengths of pipe etc. the supplier is happy to take back anything unused. Was planning to just replace the whole lot and make the setup a bit more rational, and so the swg and pump basket can be accessed for cleaning.

I don’t know the full history of the place. The pool was done around 2002 and only has a few years life in it realistically. The whole site is on reactive clay and the retaining walls are letting everything slowly shift. It’ll crack at some point, at which time they’re planning to most likely fill it in.

Edit to ask - is 38 PSI high with the multi port set to recirculate? No amount of backwashing can bring it below 60 on filter, but I’m guessing that will drop with new media.
 
You need a new pressure gauge.


That is a new pressure gauge. The previous one was badly corroded, but FWIW, read the same. I replaced the whole top half of the multi port from the spider gasket up (had a broken handle), replaced the salt cell which was a huge chunk of rock and wouldn’t function after cleaning. Put socks on basket and leaf catcher, man this pool hobby sure adds up fast :cautious: little clips and gaskets, bits and pieces here, and there, yikes!

I’m seeing 38 on recirc, around 60 on skimmer running through filter. Gets up to maybe 70 before I clean it out. No amount of backwashing brings it below 60.

Is 38 high on recirc then?
 
Your pump can't generate that much pressure.

Something is wrong.

You probably need a new gauge.

Do you have a picture of the gauge?

Does the pressure go to zero when the pump is off?
 
That is a new pressure gauge.
I’m seeing 38 on recirc, around 60 on skimmer running through filter. Gets up to maybe 70 before I clean it out. No amount of backwashing brings it below 60.

Is 38 high on recirc then?
I know you said PSI in one of the posts above but my guess is these are actually kpa numbers as we sometimes only get metric gauges in Aus ...
assuming kpa readings
38kpa = 5.5psi
60kpa = 8.7psi
70kpa = 10.1psi

would seem to be in the general area of low to normal .... how about a picture of the gauge and a reading
 
I know you said PSI in one of the posts above but my guess is these are actually kpa numbers as we sometimes only get metric gauges in Aus ...
assuming kpa readings
38kpa = 5.5psi
60kpa = 8.7psi
70kpa = 10.1psi

would seem to be in the general area of low to normal .... how about a picture of the gauge and a reading

9647803F-4C64-48AA-9ABB-36690E3E32F5.jpeg

Right you are! I guess I was just seeing what I wanted to see. As much as I love the metric system, it’s not without its problems. If the French had their way every measure would have a French name in it somewhere, and there’d be 400 degrees in a circle

Further down my list of things to give some attention to was the thought that the whole system had really high pressure. One of the reasons for changing the sand in the first place - asknde frlm the age and filthy state of it - was the hope that maybe the high pressure was a result of it being heavily compressed. There was a fear some place in the back of my mind that if I changed the sand and the pressure didn’t drop, I’d have to trouble shoot the buried pipes for obstructions. It was even a factor in deciding to replace the plumbing at the filter, I figured if I can reduce the 4-6 90 degree bends in each pipe down to one or two, and replace those with two 45 degree bends I might be in a better position pressure wise.

Wish I’d have posted up long ago. My overthinking was totally unnecessary, and you’ve managed to solve all of my high pressure issues in a single post!
 
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