Prehistoric Pool Gets Major Remodel in NorCal!

Pre,

I really like VS pumps, but in your case, I would recommend a 2-Speed pump.. You would run low speed most of the time when making chlorine and only run high speed when cleaning.

VS pumps are really made for people that have an automation system and have spas, bubblers, waterfalls, or other water features... A good example is when you turn on a waterfall, there is an increased demand for water... With a VS pump the automation system turns a valve to turn on the waterfall and then tells the pump to increase in speed to supply the extra water this is needed..

Thanks,

Jim R.
 
Thanks, Jim. That makes sense. So if I want to stick with PentAir, would something like this would be a good choice? [h=1]Pentair 340042 SuperFlo High Performance Energy Efficient Two Speed Pool Pump, 1 Horsepower, 230 Volt, 1 Phase - Energy Star Certified https://www.amazon.com/Pentair-340042-Performance-Efficient-Horsepower/dp/B002FQIYBY/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1521492224&sr=8-6&keywords=pentair+to+speed+pool+pump[/h]
That pump is 230 volts. I am planning on getting a new electric line from my main circuit box, but I wasn't planning on getting 230 volts. Do you know if they make this in 115 volts? I wasn't able to find it. Anything else you would recommend that is 115 volts?

It's probably a good 100 feet from the circuit box, is it worth upgrading to 230 volt for electricity savings?
 
Pre,

That pump should work fine.

If you plan to get a new line installed anyway, I would not think that adding a 220 volt line would be much more than adding a 115 volt line. If you do get a new 220 volt line, make sure it has the neutral wire so that you can have either 220 or 115 volts... at the pad..

Thanks,

Jim R.
 
Something else to keep in mind is PG&E has high electricity rates, and with a SWCG you often run for many hours during the daytime hours to help keep chlorine in the correct zone. Down here in Santa Cruz I can run my VS pump at 1000 rpm and satisfy my SWCG flow requirements, so I am producing chlorine and only using around 70 watts of electricity. I can run during peak hours and still not get killed...
 
Thanks, Jim. I feel kind of silly now. I had 220 volts at the equipment pad with the old set-up, and I talked to one of the pool crew today and he said they were already planning on putting 220 in with the new circuit. The contract just says a new"30 amp" circuit, and I assumed if they meant 220 they would have said so in the contract, but I guess that was wrong. Remember in the post above where I said "I KNOW NOTHING"?

So if I also want 110 at the equipment pad I guess they will need to stuff another wire in the conduit, but that should not be too big a deal. I definitely want 110 also, and a couple outlets for it.

SantaCruzPool, I think what you are saying is that the low speed setting on a two speed pump might not be low enough for the SWG, is that right? So I should consider a variable speed pump instead of just a two speed for max energy savings?
 
Pre,

I love VS pumps, but they cost significantly more, so the payback on the electrical savings takes a lot longer...

Just tell the pool crew what you want on the electrical connections and they should be able to take care of you..

Thanks,

Jim R.
 
I've read elsewhere here on TFP: if you think there's any chance you'll eventually get automation, then you'll be best served by having your equipment (pump, SWG, lights, etc) all from the same manufacturer. If you're sure you're never going to have automation, then there are better stand-alone SWGs than an IC40 or IC60 (in fact, Pentair's offerings in that size range are pretty poor as stand-alones). Others can elaborate...
 
You can run a VS pump at a lower wattage than the low speed setting on a 2 speed pump. I not sure how quickly, or if it would pay for itself, compared to a good 2 speed pump.

Most people run their SWCG's during the daytime (sunny times) to help keep the chlorine levels steady while the sun burns its part off. However, this will be the more expensive part of the day for PG&E rates payers when everyone is switched to time of use (Time-of-Use rates are supposedly coming for all PG&E customers in 2019-2020), so you may be getting new higher electric rates in the next few years which will make the payback potential a little better.

When our pool was built the builder had our 2HP VS pump running at around 2500 rpm for 8-10 hours and our electricity bill jumped over $100 that month. Once I was able to drop the speed down to 1000 rpm the bills dropped closer to our previous usage. At the time I think the higher speed pushed us into a more expensive tier.

In addition, running the pump at a lower speed is much quieter and can even improve filtering. I don't know what the incremental cost difference is but it might be something to check out. Plus, as others have already stated IF you ever want some sort of automation the VS pump is great - you could also possibly eliminate the need for running your booster pump for the Polaris, by plumbing it to the VS pump.
 

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Thanks SantaCruzPool, Dirk and Jim. I think I need to study up on the pool equipment some more. Fortunately (unfortunately?) I will have some time to do that, because a combination of permit review and rain has halted progress. The permit thing hasn't bothered me this week because the rain would have shut me down anyway, but next week is supposed to be perfect construction weather, no rain, sunny and not hot. Plus I have my pool builder's attention - he has been getting a lot of work done when weather allows. I am going to hate not making progress next week.


Meanwhile, I know that I have to keep feeding you guys photos, so here is one of the tile, plaster, and travertine samples together. You can ignore the gray aggregate tile hearth these are sitting on, it is going to get replaced with travertine. I can't ignore the brick outdoor fireplace and chimney - it's not going anywhere!

https://photos.google.com/album/AF1QipMn_qoktQ5hZPBEF06THG95oNlDtT501o4ZBzzG

Tile, plaster and travertine.jpg

The tile is Casablanca Rust from NPT. I plan to alternate the deco and field tiles every other one (DW thinks we should use one deco for every two or three field, but I think she will see the light prior to install). One pool builder told me that deco tiles were "so ten years ago" and that it would make the pool look dated. I am not too concerned about that - my house is close to 100 years old. I want the tile to look like it could be old. Not going for a modern look at all. Things I like about this tile: to me, it is reminiscent of Spanish tile, Mission architecture and old California, all things I like. The "rust" colors pick up the colors in the red brick chimney nicely. I like a strong, cobalt blue, color on waterline. It just says classic pool to me. There are some tiles that mix classic blue or cobalt colors with golds and terra cotta in kind of a random pattern, like stone, and I guess that look is more up to date. To me it just comes off as false - there is not much natural stone that is cobalt blue, whereas colorful deco tiles have a long history in North Africa, Southern Europe and Spanish California.


On the NPT website, they show this tile with white grout: http://www.nptpool.com/tile/casablanca


I think I am going with a darker grout instead, probably a blue gray color. I think the vertical white grout lines detract from the quatrefoil pattern of the tile itself, while a darker color will blend better.


The plaster is a non-branded mix the pool builder puts together. It has aggregate that is polished after installation, which gives it a feel like Pebbletec Pebble Sheen. It has two shades of blue glass beads mixed in which we like it a lot. The pool builder said he would prefer to polish for sheen finish rather than power wash for a pebble finish because the power washing creates a lot of slurry he has to pump out and dispose of, so he is giving me a good price on it. My whole family likes the smoother finish better.


The travertine is going on the deck and coping. It is supplied by MS International and they call the color "Tuscany Riviera." It has a pretty strong gold tint. I know this is somewhat contrary to current trends for more neutral colors. We like having some color in it and feel the neutrals will look too washed out in bright sunlight. I also feel the gold will go well with the red used brick fireplace and chimney. One of the best things about travertine is that the voids in the stone and tumbled edges give it a weathered look as soon as it is laid down, like it has been there a long time - perfect for an old house, in my view.


The travertine is already ordered and would be difficult to change now. Everything else can be changed easily at this point. Love to hear everyone's opinions, especially on the tile and grout color for the tile. Let me know if you think I am crazy.

Thanks for any input!
 
By the way, how is that some people can have so many photos embedded in their posts? I have only a few in this thread, but when I tried to post more today I got a message that I have used my quota. So I put a photo on Google Photos and linked to it. But the system would not let me use the URL to embed the photo. Said it was an invalid link. I ahve not been able to find anything in the FAQ's or elsewhere that explains how to do this. I know everyone wants pictures, pictures, pictures and not words, words, words and I want to accommodate. I just don't know how! I KNOW NOTHING! I KNOW NOTHING!
 
If you become a supporter and donate to Trouble Free Pool you do get a ton of photo storage space. Or you can also link to externally hosted photos (e.g. Google Photos like you attempted), just make sure you deselect the check box for "retrieve remote file and reference locally" - and it should work...

Many used to use photobucket but they stopped allowing 3rd party images...(edit) some other hosting sites that should work are TinyPic, Imgur, Flickr, and PostImage...
 
If you become a supporter and donate to Trouble Free Pool you do get a ton of photo storage space. Or you can also link to externally hosted photos (e.g. Google Photos like you attempted), just make sure you deselect the check box for "retrieve remote file and reference locally" - and it should work...

Many used to use photobucket but they stopped allowing 3rd party images...(edit) some other hosting sites that should work are TinyPic, Imgur, Flickr, and PostImage...



Thanks, santacruzpool. I just donated so once it's processed I will edit post to put the actual photos in. This forum is a great resource and I am happy to support it.

:hug to both of you!!! THANKS!

Kim:kim:
 
LOL sorry! I forgot about that part of it :hug:

I LOVE that tile!! I like the one on the left the best.

Grout-NOT white for the reasons you stated. I like your color idea for it.

-How often to use the pretty tile-I agree with your wife. Every other would be too much of a good thing. I say do the math and see if 2 or 3 field stones would make it even out overall.

Old house=old style=PRETTY and classic!!!

Kim:kim:
 
Thanks, Kim! So maybe I need to reconsider alternating the deco and the field tiles every other one. Part of my problem is that I haven't seen any examples with deco tiles every second or third tile and can't really envision what it would look like. All the examples I have seen are either every other one, or all deco, like these two examples from NPT's website:

Casablanca examples.jpg

Does anyone have examples of alternating deco tiles every second or third tile which they can share?
 
Okay, I played with paint and set up the tiles with the field tile 2 wide then again with it 3 wide. I do NOT like it LOL I like it your way! Every other. I did not save my work as it is very amateur :oops: but it at least let me see it.

Kim:kim:
 
After reading this forum, I began to be concerned about whether the finish I had chosen used colorfast, nonorganic pigments. Pool builder could not offer much reassurance, but he did say the blues could fade over time. If it faded evenly, I would be OK with that, but I was afraid it would bleach unevenly and leave me with a blotchy finish.

Member bbrock posted a link to an article in Watershapes magazine aobut how to test the dye. For some reason I am not able to post the link itself, but here is a link to the thread where it is discussed, post number 20: Blank slate/Pool build in Maryland

The article laid out a method of testing that involves cutting a plaster sample in two, and soaking half in full strength pool chlorine overnight, then comparing to the half that was not soaked. I did this with my preferred color sample, soaking for 18 hours in chlorine, then rinsing thoroughly and allowing to dry. The results were shocking:

Plaster Bleach 1 IMG_3946.jpg

Obviously, the "before sample is on the top, and the "after" sample is on the bottom. Almost all the blue color leached out. So I am giving up on the blue tint, and going with a white plaster with a pebble finish. The background plaster will be basically the color of the "after" sample in the photo above. It will get some blue from the glass beads. The sample above is 10% glass, and I am going to get 15%. On a sunny day, the sun will make the water look blue. At nighttime, the colored LED's can make it look blue, and the white plaster will reflect the light better. On cloudy or overcast days, the pool won't look so blue :(

But I think that is preferable to risking a blotchy, bleached out finish.
 

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