Pool Light Red Brass Connection to Junction Box

[Ozoneduck]

Good day to all and thank you for your help. First post but have gotten a lot of good info over the last few years.

Hopefully an easy question. Had to move some electrical for the pool. I have 2 Pentair 5G lights, one for the pool and one for the spa. Both had red brass conduit from the niche that went back and hooked directly into an EasyTouch 8 control box. The ET8 has been moved and I need to connect the light cables to the ET8 now. I presume I will need to get a pool light junction box (at correct height and distance from pool) and bring both light cables into the JB and then run PVC schedule 40 with THWN wire from the JB back to the ET8 and connect the load through a GFCI. If this is incorrect please let me know.

My next questions are can I just get a plastic pool light JB and attach the red brass directly to the plastic JB with adaptors from the brass threads to plastic? Or do I have to get a metal JB to connect the red brass to? Also with the red brass I don’t have to have a #8 wire to each niche because I have metal conduit, correct? My understanding is that the metal conduit just comes out of the ground and terminates into the JB with no further connecting to ground.

My last question is do I connect either the pool light JB or both or one of the metal conduits to the bonding grid?

Thank you again for your time and help, it is very appreciated.

 

[Dan8899]

I've only recently become an actual pool owner, but I do work in the electrical industry. Here is a bit of the NEC code Art 680 on pools, luckily found on another site so I could cut/paste:
===
680.23 Underwater Luminaires (Lighting Fixtures).
(B) Wet-Niche Luminaires (Fixtures).
2) Wiring Extending Directly to the Forming Shell. Conduit shall be installed from the forming shell to a suitable junction box or other enclosure located as provided in 680.24. Conduit shall be rigid metal, intermediate metal, liquidtight flexible nonmetallic, or rigid nonmetallic.
(a) Metal Conduit. Metal conduit shall be approved and shall be of brass or other approved corrosion-resistant metal.
Nonmetallic Conduit. Where a nonmetallic conduit is used, an 8 AWG insulated solid or stranded copper equipment grounding conductor shall be installed in this conduit unless a listed low-voltage lighting system not requiring grounding is used. The equipment grounding conductor shall be terminated in the forming shell, junction box or transformer enclosure, or ground-fault circuit-interrupter enclosure. The termination of the 8 AWG equipment grounding conductor in the forming shell shall be covered with, or encapsulated in, a listed potting compound to protect the connection from the possible deteriorating effect of pool water.

680.24 Junction Boxes and Enclosures for Transformers or Ground-Fault Circuit Interrupters.
(A) Junction Boxes. A junction box connected to a conduit that extends directly to a forming shell or mounting bracket of a no-niche luminaire (fixture) shall meet the requirements of this section.
(1) Construction. The junction box shall be listed and labeled for the purpose and shall comply with the following conditions:
(1) Be equipped with threaded entries or hubs or a nonmetallic hub listed for the purpose
(2) Be comprised of copper, brass, suitable plastic, or other approved corrosion-resistant material
(3) Be provided with electrical continuity between every connected metal conduit and the grounding terminals by means of copper, brass, or other approved corrosion-resistant metal that is integral with the box

Handbook:
�Where rigid nonmetallic conduit or liquidtight flexible nonmetallic conduit is used between a forming shell for a wet-niche fixture and a junction box or other enclosure, an 8 AWG insulated copper equipment grounding conductor is required to be installed in the conduit to provide electrical continuity between the forming shell and the junction box or other enclosure. The conduit must be sized large enough to enclose both the 8 AWG insulated copper bonding conductor and the approved flexible cord that supplies the wet-niche fixture, to facilitate easy withdrawal and insertion of the grounding conductor and the cord. Low-voltage lighting systems are exempt from this equipment grounding conductor requirement.�

======
Please, any regulars on TFP chime in if I am off here....or to confirm...

The above NEC code in english - If you have 120V fixtures, you need to continue the metal brass or other non corrosive -(NOT regular steel rigid metal) conduit to a junction box with threaded hubs and metal non corrosive(brass) box structure(NOT plastic) so your 2 metal conduits are bonded to each other. From this Jbox(deck box) you can then use PVC to take wiring back to your ET8 or switch. The deck box requires 2 metal conduits to support it, but since you have 2 metal light conduits, the 3rd going back to the ET8 could be PVC. You could use PVC to extend your brass conduits, BUT you would then need the additional #8 ground wire running in the conduits along with the pool light cable and need to connect it to a lug inside the light housing and also need to cover that lug with a potting compound(encase in a playdoh substance to prevent contact with the water and need to drain the pool below light level to do it)

The deck box enclosure must be at least 4ft from the pool wall by code. All exposed metal parts within 5ft of the pool wall must be bonded to the grid, so make sure you put the deck box at least 5ft out and you won't have to bond it or the conduits. The only items outside of 5ft from the pool wall that DO need to be tied to the bonding grid are any components of the circulating system(pump,heater,etc)since they remotely contact the pool water.

If you have 12V (low voltage fixtures) you could switch the brass over to PVC conduits since the same bonding/grounding req's are not needed for LV fixtures and you would not need the extra #8 wire running with the pool light cable.

I'm not familiar with your ET8 unit, but from googling it, it actually sounds like the previous installation was probably not to code, and there should have been a 'deck box' in between the lights and the ET8 enclosure.

also, if you google 'mike holt article 680' you should come across a pdf link with simplified illustrated explanation of pool electrical info and grounding /bonding

 

[Ozoneduck]

Thanks for the help! I will finish the project this coming weekend.

Can I tie the two grounds from the two lights to one THWN ground wire and run the one line from the junction box to the control box or do I need to keep separate lines for each ground and run 2 THWN ground wires from the junction box to the comteol box? Same question for the white neutral leads. Just trying to reduce the amount of wires to pull through the conduit from the junction box to the control box.

Thanks again.

 

[Dan8899]

The pool light junction box(deck box) will come with a grounding bar in it where all the light cord ground wires should be terminated (along with the 2 #8 bonding wires from light niches if your lights are 120V and you switched over to PVC from brass conduit). You only need 1 #12 AWG green equipment grounding wire from the controller to the pool junction box, and also terminate this ground wire on the ground bar with the pool light ground wires. NO wire nuts - they must land on the ground lug in the box. I just bought the intermatic 2 light PJB2175 jbox and that model has 3 PVC conduit openings and a ground bar that will take 6 ground wires.

Like I said earlier I'm not familiar with your controller operation, or if your 2 lights are presently being controlled together or individually by the controller and are on the same GFCI circuit. Assuming they are on the same circuit coming from the same GFCI, you probably have a wire coming off the load side of your GFI and going through a relay on your controller board that then comes out of the relay to feed the light(s). The neutral from the GFCI probably doesn't land on the controller board and probably just goes right out to the lights. If thats the case, the light cord neutrals should be able to be spliced together with only one neutral wire taken back to the controller and ultimately connected to GFCI neutral terminal. See how it is wired now and if the neutral from each light is going back to the same place.