Polaris Robot - using the unused pressure sided plumbing from old sweeper

[aquaman]

I have a Polaris robot that works well (going up the walls does nothing for algae I'll tell you) .

BUT- tired of schlepping it out, plugging into exterior outlet in an unprotected area and then placing it in pool. Sure it can stay out there for weeks (electronics protected from sun at least) and the cord is always laying on the concrete decking.

IS there a unit with a longer cord that I could fish up the unused pressure side pipe that used to drive P.S. sweep and come up into my pool equipment area?
That pressure pump has been taken out.
Then buy a programmable unit always plugged in and then I just deal with the basket cleaning and expecting a unit will not last as long since it always in the water.

Pool guy wants me to invest in the Polaris Quattro and go back to pressure sided system.

Until my wife agrees to take out slate tiles on walls above the pool I will always have silt/mud fine particulate -- the robot grabs this WELL. My previous sweeps and their bags - not so much.

 

[mknauss]

How long of a cord?
There are Commercial Dolphin robots with longer cords, but very high prices. You could find out if you could just get the cord and whether that will work with your unit.

Interior diameter would need to be large enough to pass the screw in plug for the control unit.

 

[Dirk]

Devil's advocate here...

If I'm understanding your question, your robot will be permanently installed in your pool. It will hide the cord, unless you want to take the 'bot out, for say a party, in which case the cord will be back on the deck, when you would least want it there. I know robots are left in the water, but are there any whose manufacturers actually support that? And then there is retrieval, which means you'll no longer be able to just grab the cord off the deck to haul it out, you'll need to stick your arm into the water.

Regarding your distaste of the standard config, with the cord on the deck, you've hit upon the primary reason I wouldn't want a robot. #2 is having to haul it out regularly, all year-round, to clear the collector. #3 is the weight. #4 is the expense, and repair costs. So...

My solution was to convert my pressure-side vac plumbing to suction, and I run a Pentair Rebel. The conversion probably involves no more work or skill than what you're about to do. My Rebel cleans great, at least as well as my pressure vac did (and no more booster pump!). Light weight. When I pull it out for a large group, it's easy, and it's gone and out of sight. And no bag to clean. It's working for me everyday, all year long, but for 98% of those days, I don't even think about it, including all winter long.

I do have to clean the pump basket, which is where the debris gets collected, but that is much easier, no hauling out, no getting wet. Plus, I don't have to guess if a bag in my deep end is full or not, I can just glance into my pump's transparent lid to see if it's time, which greatly lessens the number of times I have to do that.

Some will say a robot uses less electricity, but, while true, I claim that is a very minimal benefit. My vac run is part of my filtering run, so really it's only adding a slight increase of RPMs to function during an hour of my pump's normal runtime. With a variable speed pump, that is next to nothing.

My vac does not brush my finish. So that's where a robot shines (?). But as you point out, is that really helping all that much? I wouldn't know, never having owned one. Admittedly, my bias is technically unfounded!

When they make one like my Roomba, when it can haul its cordless self in and out of a pool, and park itself for recharging, and empty its bag on its own, then I'm in!

 

[aquaman]

Thanks for thinking this through with me - somehow I didn't think about the "can't put in the shed" if I run it through a pipe! I was focused on taking it in and out of shed.
I pretty much love the Polaris robot.

 

[aquaman]

Thanks for thinking this through with me - somehow I didn't think about the "can't put in the shed" if I run it through a pipe! I was focused on taking it in and out of shed.
I pretty much love the Polaris robot.

BTW -- our friends just replied to me - their builder did run a pipe from pool to 120 plug to keep robot cord off the deck. He hasn't replied yet about whether he is bothered by it being trapped poolside now.

 

[aquaman]

Devil's advocate here...

If I'm understanding your question, your robot will be permanently installed in your pool. It will hide the cord, unless you want to take the 'bot out, for say a party, in which case the cord will be back on the deck, when you would least want it there. I know robots are left in the water, but are there any whose manufacturers actually support that? And then there is retrieval, which means you'll no longer be able to just grab the cord off the deck to haul it out, you'll need to stick your arm into the water.

Regarding your distaste of the standard config, with the cord on the deck, you've hit upon the primary reason I wouldn't want a robot. #2 is having to haul it out regularly, all year-round, to clear the collector. #3 is the weight. #4 is the expense, and repair costs. So...

My solution was to convert my pressure-side vac plumbing to suction, and I run a Pentair Rebel. The conversion probably involves no more work or skill than what you're about to do. My Rebel cleans great, at least as well as my pressure vac did (and no more booster pump!). Light weight. When I pull it out for a large group, it's easy, and it's gone and out of sight. And no bag to clean. It's working for me everyday, all year long, but for 98% of those days, I don't even think about it, including all winter long.

I do have to clean the pump basket, which is where the debris gets collected, but that is much easier, no hauling out, no getting wet. Plus, I don't have to guess if a bag in my deep end is full or not, I can just glance into my pump's transparent lid to see if it's time, which greatly lessens the number of times I have to do that.

Some will say a robot uses less electricity, but, while true, I claim that is a very minimal benefit. My vac run is part of my filtering run, so really it's only adding a slight increase of RPMs to function during an hour of my pump's normal runtime. With a variable speed pump, that is next to nothing.

My vac does not brush my finish. So that's where a robot shines (?). But as you point out, is that really helping all that much? I wouldn't know, never having owned one. Admittedly, my bias is technically unfounded!

When they make one like my Roomba, when it can haul its cordless self in and out of a pool, and park itself for recharging, and empty its bag on its own, then I'm in!

Dirk - The Rebel runs into the skimmer intake for intermittent use?

 

[aquaman]

How long of a cord?
There are Commercial Dolphin robots with longer cords, but very high prices. You could find out if you could just get the cord and whether that will work with your unit.

Interior diameter would need to be large enough to pass the screw in plug for the control unit.

mk and Dirk-

It has been said that robots running up walls doesn't do a good job. Have you come across any posts of people saying they could see any cleaner taking algae off walls?

 

[mknauss]

Algae is not a pool cleaning issue, it is a chemistry issue.
My robot climbs the wall and scoot’s along the water line. I get no build up at the waterline and do not brush the walls manually.

 

[Dirk]

Dirk - The Rebel runs into the skimmer intake for intermittent use?

I think it can be run that way, but that's not how I'm doing it. I had a pressure vac port in the pool (from when it was built). I replumbed that at the pad into a suction port. My Rebel connects to the old pressure port (now a suction port), about 12" or so below the surface.

mk and Dirk-

It has been said that robots running up walls doesn't do a good job. Have you come across any posts of people saying they could see any cleaner taking algae off walls?

No, but I've read posts that claim it doesn't do that well. Again, never owned one, all my opinions are based on my own logic from reading about others'. I think if you've got the robot scrubbing walls and tile regularly, it might keep buildup from happening. Kinda like your teeth: if you floss and brush regularly, you minimize plaque, but if you neglect your chompers and get some built up plaque, brushing it at that point won't do much.

To your cord hiding notion: I've written about this before, and I'm not sure why something like this isn't done yet, considering the popularity of robots. It'd have to be done during the build, but it's possible to do afterward, if you're very determined. There could be some sort of trough, that runs perpendicular to the coping, cut right into the deck and the coping. The robot cord could lay in that. The trough could have a simple lid of some sort, or one of those in-deck drain covers, which could be easily removed to get at the cord. Five feet or more away from the coping could be a switched plug (wired to a timer or pool automation), next to, or in the back of, a little robot house of sorts, kind'a hidden in some landscaping, that could store the 'bot and its cord when out of the water. It'd be relatively easy to pull the 'bot and cord and stuff it into the 'bot house, right there near the pool. That's how I'd do it, anyway, if I ever got one.

Theoretically, you could saw such a trough through existing deck and coping, but you can imagine the challenges of getting that done, and getting it to look OK. Something like this kind'a thing could be installed in the trough:

 

[Dirk]

BTW -- our friends just replied to me - their builder did run a pipe from pool to 120 plug to keep robot cord off the deck. He hasn't replied yet about whether he is bothered by it being trapped poolside now.

I think the trick would be to use a pipe large enough that you could pass the plug through, so that you could remove cord and 'bot if you needed to, just by sliding the cord end through the pipe. Do these all come with a big honkin' GFI plug on them? You could work around that, by replacing the GFI plug with a regular one, and then plugging that into a GFI outlet, but it does leave it somewhat less safe, in that a user has to know, and remember, to only use a GFI outlet. It would trash the warranty, of course.

My "channel idea" gets around all that, because the cord can be both hidden and removed without having to permanently alter it or trap it.

 

[mwemaxxowner]

Devil's advocate here...

If I'm understanding your question, your robot will be permanently installed in your pool. It will hide the cord, unless you want to take the 'bot out, for say a party, in which case the cord will be back on the deck, when you would least want it there. I know robots are left in the water, but are there any whose manufacturers actually support that? And then there is retrieval, which means you'll no longer be able to just grab the cord off the deck to haul it out, you'll need to stick your arm into the water.

Regarding your distaste of the standard config, with the cord on the deck, you've hit upon the primary reason I wouldn't want a robot. #2 is having to haul it out regularly, all year-round, to clear the collector. #3 is the weight. #4 is the expense, and repair costs. So...

My solution was to convert my pressure-side vac plumbing to suction, and I run a Pentair Rebel. The conversion probably involves no more work or skill than what you're about to do. My Rebel cleans great, at least as well as my pressure vac did (and no more booster pump!). Light weight. When I pull it out for a large group, it's easy, and it's gone and out of sight. And no bag to clean. It's working for me everyday, all year long, but for 98% of those days, I don't even think about it, including all winter long.

I do have to clean the pump basket, which is where the debris gets collected, but that is much easier, no hauling out, no getting wet. Plus, I don't have to guess if a bag in my deep end is full or not, I can just glance into my pump's transparent lid to see if it's time, which greatly lessens the number of times I have to do that.

Some will say a robot uses less electricity, but, while true, I claim that is a very minimal benefit. My vac run is part of my filtering run, so really it's only adding a slight increase of RPMs to function during an hour of my pump's normal runtime. With a variable speed pump, that is next to nothing.

My vac does not brush my finish. So that's where a robot shines (?). But as you point out, is that really helping all that much? I wouldn't know, never having owned one. Admittedly, my bias is technically unfounded!

When they make one like my Roomba, when it can haul its cordless self in and out of a pool, and park itself for recharging, and empty its bag on its own, then I'm in!

Interesting. I have not considered converting my pressure port to a suction port. I'm a decent plumber, that would be a relatively easy and cheap project.

My pressure port plumbing is either 3/4 or 1" pipe. Would that be an issue? (IDK what size suction port cleaner plumbing typically is, but my skimmer back to pump is much larger) It's a fairly short run of pipe, maybe 12".

 

[Dirk]

My pressure port plumbing is either 3/4 or 1" pipe. Would that be an issue?

I think it could be.

My pressure port pipe turned suction port pipe is 1.5" PVC, and even that makes me nervous. If I was installing new, I'd use 2" pipe and sweep elbows throughout, to minimize the possibility of a clog. I think what you have to consider is the size of the opening in the vac head. I think mine is 1", which means (theoretically), nothing larger than 1" in diameter can get to the pipe. A 1.5" pipe should be able to pass anything less than 1" in size (so far it has). But if the pipe is 3/4", and the opening on the vac is 1", that's just asking for trouble.

Worse still are the elbows involved, that's where the clogs will happen. I can imagine a 3/4" inch something passing through the 1" vac opening, but if that something is 3/4" wide, and, say, 1.5" long (like a chunk of mulch, for example), it might make it through the vac head, through the vac hose, and through the suction pipe, but not be able to "make the turn" at the first 90° elbow. That's the real problem with the smaller diameter pipe.

Are you sure your underground pipe is that small? Pressure vac booster pumps typically use 3/4" flex hose to connect to plumbing. Mine did. But the hose then connected to the much larger underground pipe, which was 1.5" PVC. Can you actually see the smaller pipe go into the dirt? It's even possible that smaller pipe connects to a large one underground. Might be worth exploring.

Or you could check the other end if you happen to have some swim goggles. Is the pressure port in the pool removable? It should unscrew. Peer inside and see if you can see the diameter of the pipe behind the port. If that is 3/4" pipe, then you'll know. But if it is 1.5" pipe, then somewhere between there and the pad the pipe transitions to the smaller size. Maybe you could get at the location of that transition. Maybe it's just below the surface of the dirt near the pad.

Pool plumbers have been known to do crazier things.

 

[mwemaxxowner]

I'm not real sure. I had read that it's typical for booster pump>pressure cleaner port to be 3/4 but I don't know.

The port on the wall is screwed to the wall. Removing it would require removing those screws, but I could certainly do that. I've never peered into it but I'll have a look some time. I bet I could see without pulling the port on the end. This port is for a Polaris, I think maybe it was a 380. It was belt driven and boosted. It wasn't the shaft driven 280.



This 3/4 pipe going into the ground is all I really know. I'm not sure what it does once it goes down. It's been there 50 years. Also, if it does change, it better do it very shortly after going into the dirt, otherwise homeboy here ain't digging it up. Also there isn't much room to work as it's surrounded by concrete.




It sounds like this isn't really an option in my situation.

 

[Dirk]

Doesn't look good. See what you can see behind that port without unscrewing anything. Probably best to let 50-year-old sleeping dogs lie.

That said, something's up with the PVC pipe. Barcodes have been around for almost 50 years, but I can't imagine one on a PVC pipe looking that good, not to mention the pipe itself. And no way would that red-handled PVC ball valve be 50 years old. They're not known for longevity outdoors. So that whole chunk of plumbing is not 50 years old. Maybe all your plumbing was redone at some point.

Of course, there might be copper pipes underground, if the original plumbing is still buried. Who knows. Just the kind of thing that would drive me crazy, until I dug it up to find out, breaking something unrepairable in the process, and then kicking myself for not leaving well enough alone!!!

 

[Dirk]

PS. Some (all?) PVC pipe is date-coded, if you really want to get into it.

 

[mwemaxxowner]

Some of the pump room plumbing has obviously been redone over the years when pumps were replaced and whatnot, but what's underground has not (as far as I know). My point was really just that it's been buried there a long time, longer than me, and I have no idea exactly what's under there...nor does anybody else who's still alive.

I pray there are never any problems so I don't have to tear any of the patio up!