For the past couple weeks I have suspected a leak because of abnormal water loss, we have not had rain and it has been unusually dry and the pump pad area remains wet so I was uncertain. It is not been unusual to see a little but a water around the pump pad over the years, but I keep the pump pad area pretty snug and a very little bit of water does not concern me.
Today I have confirmed my suspicion of a water leak by doing the following: going to the TFP thread regarding leaks, kept the pump off for 24 hours, bucket of water on the step to rule out evaporation, 24 hours later made a water level measurement.
I am losing about 0.25 inches in a 24-hour period so that is not insignificant.
I used food coloring to see if I could see a tendril indicating a leak at all of the usual places (skimmer, 2 returns, pool cleaner return, 2 jet returns). One of the Jets reveals a leak, the food coloring sucks right into the opening (the other jet return is about 2 feet away and seems fine).
The culprit jet return is:
- about 7.5 inches below the "ideal water level" (this ideal water level is irrelevant during winter closing)
- about 3-4 inches below the "tile line" which is just about exactly where winter/closed water level is.
- Just above a bench, practically in line with the drains in the deep end i.e. the culprit jet return in the deeper end of the pool,
This leak needs correction obviously, the question is fix it now or do it in spring? I'm pretty sure I want to do this now, before closing, unless you guys tell me that it is no big deal to lower my water level for winter closing another 3-4 inches deeper than normal winter/closed water level.
I am approximately 10-20 days away from closing the pool for winter, usually around October 20th.
The weather is certainly nicer to do work in the fall/now, the water temperature is presently warmer than it will be in the spring/opening, I will be having a pro do this, not me. The return pipe is underneath the concrete deck so there will be all that mess +pouring new concrete; again probably nicer to do now than in the spring.
The downside of having it done now/in the fall is that I will not confirm it works over the course of the winter. I suspect that I can have the Pro finish it within a week or so; so before closing. I suppose that I could just delay closing by 2-3 days to get 2or3 24-hour-tests to confirm it was solved. Even if I had the delay closing for weeks I suppose it is not a not that big of a deal, we do not get ice until December January February if at all, just more leaves to deal with, and just as well deal with the busted up concrete now than in the spring/opening (pool is easier to close that it is to open).
If I delay it until spring, I would need to keep the "winter/closing water level about another 3-4 inches lower in order to keep the water away from the leaking culprit jet during winter. This is less ideal for the structure of the pool. Also I will need to make a more concerted effort to keep an eye on the water level over the winter which is not easy with a cover on.
So my first question to you guys is: you would do it now, right?
My second question is: I assume that the pro will know where the leak is? I plan to call American leak detection, have worked with them before and they are good. I suppose it is feasible that I also have a leak around the pump pad area simply because it is more wet than it should be.
My next question is: I could not lose 0.25 inch of water at the pump pad area in 24 hours with the pump off could I? From some type of siphon effect? The pump pad is about 4-6 inches above the ideal water level, the jet pipe is another roughly 7.5 inches deeper yet until it rises at the pump area. I do understand that I could have more than one leak and perhaps maybe even in a different pipe. I would think of a pool this size that if I was losing 0.25 inches at the pump pad area it would be quite noticeable at the pump pad, which as I say is indeed wet and probably more what the normal but your comments & thoughts appreciated.
My final question is: I think I should try to plug that culprit jet line, right? To stop the leak until the pro gets here for his diagnosis. I did confirm that the leak is NOT where the plaster meets the pipe, the food dye sucks into the pipe not at its plaster junction. It is an eyeball. When I take the eyeball off it is some kind of weird size and weird internal. Here are notes I made describing the the jet piping (that the eyeball screws onto), it is not the crux of my concern with this post, but if you know I can go find a part quickly to close the pipe off I will do so; if you can provide a link of the part I need that would be great, in the meantime I will attempt to seal the eyeball myself and run the food coloring test again when I think I have it sealed.
pipe inside the wall appears to be 1 inch? Impossible to tell because of such a weird "pool-size" "eyeball" fitting that is fitted into it. The fitting goes inside a stub and then funnels outward away from the wall and then funnels outward to the threads etc., very complicated and furthermore if you stick your finger way inside the pipe you will feel some projection in the middle of the lumen.
-the outermost fixed/not removable male end with threads that the eyeball housing screws onto are NOT "1.5 inches at the threads" , it is some "pool-size" very close to 1.5inch;
-the removable housing that houses the mobile eyeball appears to be a 1 inch opening
-the mobile eyeball appears to be a 0.75 inch opening meaning that the pipes get reduced down to 0.75 inch for the massage/spa affect
I should mention that if I successfully close it off (no water loss), I will be perfectly happy with no jets (did not use them for a decade in the past, just resumed recently & that was only to improve surface flow which I can live without ). That is OK right? To just not repair the leak if I have no water loss since I have successfully isolated it & will not use the pipe in the future?
Thanks
Today I have confirmed my suspicion of a water leak by doing the following: going to the TFP thread regarding leaks, kept the pump off for 24 hours, bucket of water on the step to rule out evaporation, 24 hours later made a water level measurement.
I am losing about 0.25 inches in a 24-hour period so that is not insignificant.
I used food coloring to see if I could see a tendril indicating a leak at all of the usual places (skimmer, 2 returns, pool cleaner return, 2 jet returns). One of the Jets reveals a leak, the food coloring sucks right into the opening (the other jet return is about 2 feet away and seems fine).
The culprit jet return is:
- about 7.5 inches below the "ideal water level" (this ideal water level is irrelevant during winter closing)
- about 3-4 inches below the "tile line" which is just about exactly where winter/closed water level is.
- Just above a bench, practically in line with the drains in the deep end i.e. the culprit jet return in the deeper end of the pool,
This leak needs correction obviously, the question is fix it now or do it in spring? I'm pretty sure I want to do this now, before closing, unless you guys tell me that it is no big deal to lower my water level for winter closing another 3-4 inches deeper than normal winter/closed water level.
I am approximately 10-20 days away from closing the pool for winter, usually around October 20th.
The weather is certainly nicer to do work in the fall/now, the water temperature is presently warmer than it will be in the spring/opening, I will be having a pro do this, not me. The return pipe is underneath the concrete deck so there will be all that mess +pouring new concrete; again probably nicer to do now than in the spring.
The downside of having it done now/in the fall is that I will not confirm it works over the course of the winter. I suspect that I can have the Pro finish it within a week or so; so before closing. I suppose that I could just delay closing by 2-3 days to get 2or3 24-hour-tests to confirm it was solved. Even if I had the delay closing for weeks I suppose it is not a not that big of a deal, we do not get ice until December January February if at all, just more leaves to deal with, and just as well deal with the busted up concrete now than in the spring/opening (pool is easier to close that it is to open).
If I delay it until spring, I would need to keep the "winter/closing water level about another 3-4 inches lower in order to keep the water away from the leaking culprit jet during winter. This is less ideal for the structure of the pool. Also I will need to make a more concerted effort to keep an eye on the water level over the winter which is not easy with a cover on.
So my first question to you guys is: you would do it now, right?
My second question is: I assume that the pro will know where the leak is? I plan to call American leak detection, have worked with them before and they are good. I suppose it is feasible that I also have a leak around the pump pad area simply because it is more wet than it should be.
My next question is: I could not lose 0.25 inch of water at the pump pad area in 24 hours with the pump off could I? From some type of siphon effect? The pump pad is about 4-6 inches above the ideal water level, the jet pipe is another roughly 7.5 inches deeper yet until it rises at the pump area. I do understand that I could have more than one leak and perhaps maybe even in a different pipe. I would think of a pool this size that if I was losing 0.25 inches at the pump pad area it would be quite noticeable at the pump pad, which as I say is indeed wet and probably more what the normal but your comments & thoughts appreciated.
My final question is: I think I should try to plug that culprit jet line, right? To stop the leak until the pro gets here for his diagnosis. I did confirm that the leak is NOT where the plaster meets the pipe, the food dye sucks into the pipe not at its plaster junction. It is an eyeball. When I take the eyeball off it is some kind of weird size and weird internal. Here are notes I made describing the the jet piping (that the eyeball screws onto), it is not the crux of my concern with this post, but if you know I can go find a part quickly to close the pipe off I will do so; if you can provide a link of the part I need that would be great, in the meantime I will attempt to seal the eyeball myself and run the food coloring test again when I think I have it sealed.
pipe inside the wall appears to be 1 inch? Impossible to tell because of such a weird "pool-size" "eyeball" fitting that is fitted into it. The fitting goes inside a stub and then funnels outward away from the wall and then funnels outward to the threads etc., very complicated and furthermore if you stick your finger way inside the pipe you will feel some projection in the middle of the lumen.
-the outermost fixed/not removable male end with threads that the eyeball housing screws onto are NOT "1.5 inches at the threads" , it is some "pool-size" very close to 1.5inch;
-the removable housing that houses the mobile eyeball appears to be a 1 inch opening
-the mobile eyeball appears to be a 0.75 inch opening meaning that the pipes get reduced down to 0.75 inch for the massage/spa affect
I should mention that if I successfully close it off (no water loss), I will be perfectly happy with no jets (did not use them for a decade in the past, just resumed recently & that was only to improve surface flow which I can live without ). That is OK right? To just not repair the leak if I have no water loss since I have successfully isolated it & will not use the pipe in the future?
Thanks
