Photometer Water Testing Equipment

[n0rthern]

Hello from Europe!

I'm an avid consumer of information from TFP. What a great resource for pool owners!

There doesn't seem to be much enthusiasm at TFP for photometer / tablet based reagent water testing equipment. Any reason why? Taylor test kits were scarce in Europe when I got a pool, so I researched the alternatives and went with lovibond. There are other suppliers such as Palintest.

Lovibond Water Testing and Colour Measurement

The Lovibond range from the Tintometer Group offers a single source of instruments, reference materials and reagents

www.lovibond.com

They are simple to use, don't rely on your eyes, they are calibrated, and they are accurate (with stated +/- tolerances). The tablets have long shelf lives, some up to ten years. They are made by companies that produce equipment for the laboratory testing of water. You do nothing more than crush a tablet in 10ml of pool water for each test. What's not to like?

My photometer can test:
Alkalinity 5 - 200 mg/L
Bromine 0.05 - 13 mg/L
Free Chlorine (High Range Tablet) 0.1 - 10 mg/L
Free Chlorine (Normal Range Tablet) 0.01 - 6.0 mg/L
Total Chlorine (High Range Tablet) 0 - 4 mg/L
Total Chlorine (Normal Range Tablet) 0 - 1 mg/L
CyA 10 - 160 mg/L
Hardness Calcium 20 - 500 mg/L
pH value 6.5 - 8.4

 

[newdude]

There doesn't seem to be much enthusiasm at TFP for photometer / tablet based reagent water testing equipment. Any reason why?

Member report after member report after member report says they are unreliable. Or they work for a while and then become unreliable. Somebody is always trying to prove otherwise.

Most pool stores use a photometer and it's been reported oodles of times that its particularly bad at CYA. Both those and the ones most people buy claim to be lab grade, but lab grade equipment costs $10k or more. The $1k range devices do not compare.

I understand your test kit sourcing issues though and maybe it's the lesser of two evils.

 

[n0rthern]

Member report after member report after member report says they are unreliable. Or they work for a while and then become unreliable. Somebody is always trying to prove otherwise.

Most pool stores use a photometer and it's been reported oodles of times that its particularly bad at CYA. Both those and the ones most people buy claim to be lab grade, but lab grade equipment costs $10k or more. The $1k range devices do not compare.

I understand your test kit sourcing issues though and maybe it's the lesser of two evils.

Interesting. Not saying your wrong. Only had my MD110 for a year. Both Taylor and Lovibond use a Melamine based reagent. The exact same chemical.

I just think it's a bit odd that Europe favours photometers/tablets and North America titration testing. Why is this?

Web page of the store I buy from in Madrid:

Swimming Pool Accessories Measurement, water analysis and safety Photometers

Purchase and sale of Swimming Pool Accessories Photometers

www.piscinayspa.com

They sell all the strips and OTO drops too.

 

[newdude]

I just think it's a bid odd that Europe favours photometers/tablets and North America titration testing. Why is this?

Europe is forced to look for other options as the titration is hard to aquire. Across the pond we have easy access to cheap and reliable test kits (compared to a $1500 photometer) so it's a no brainer.

 

[n0rthern]

Europe is forced to look for other options as the titration is hard to aquire. Across the pond we have easy access to cheap and reliable test kits (compared to a $1500 photometer) so it's a no brainer.

I used a $150 SCUBA II for the previous four years without any pool issues - just followed the TFP method. The MD110 was an impulse buy from ebay!

 

[newdude]

Both Taylor and Lovibond use a Melamine based reagent. The exact same chemical.

With different 'eyes' reading it. I know how bad I'm at the test I wouldn't trust anyone or anything to do better.

 

[98Poolmaster]

Interesting. Not saying your wrong. Only had my MD110 for a year. Both Taylor and Lovibond use a Melamine based reagent. The exact same chemical.

I just think it's a bid odd that Europe favours photometers/tablets and North America titration testing. Why is this?

Web page of the store I buy from in Madrid:

Swimming Pool Accessories Measurement, water analysis and safety Photometers

Purchase and sale of Swimming Pool Accessories Photometers

www.piscinayspa.com

They sell all the strips and OTO drops too.

We have used them for years,and they work great we have used Taylor test kits to confirm our lab test results on both Palin and LaMotte Spinlab it’s not worth the argument on here you will have multiple people disputing and attempting to convince you they don’t work so take my advice save yourself the time.I know they work and I have proven it with comparisons of field test by poolmen and customers also.I greatly respect and admire the knowledgeable people on TFP but in this particular case I disagree,and I have twenty five years in the pool industry.

 

[newdude]

time.I know they work and I have proven it with comparisons of field test by poolmen and customers also.I greatly respect and admire the knowledgeable people on TFP but in this particular case I disagree,and I have twenty five years in the pool industry.

I will happily file your report into memory. Find many more friends who agree and I'll be 50/50 about it.

 

[98Poolmaster]

I will happily file your report into memory. Find many more friends who agree and I'll be 50/50 about it.

How are you bad at the test?I’m sure you are pretty smart you can either do the tests or not unless you have trouble with colors,that is why some people prefer the other testing methods due to not seeing the color shade differences.By friends do you mean pool guys regular customers neighbors or personal friends?

 

[newdude]

How are you bad at the test?

The test mentioned was CYA. Photometers have proven to suck at it worse than our eyes, which also suck at it.

By friends do you mean pool guys regular customers neighbors or personal friends?

People who actively use the photometers and can verify it consistently lines up with Taylor. The overwhelming majority of the posts I've seen are either that they were off out of the box new, or worked well for a year before being off. So my opinions are formed from those real world reports. Yours counts with equal weight in there too, but it's one of few.

 

[Mdragger88]

The major factor for not recommending photometer type tests for the average residential pool owner is the cost - when cheap & accurate (at higher fc level) titration is unavailable then it is perhaps the only option other than strips or oto alone.
@n0rthern for instance, The test you posted has a limit of 10ppm. This is fine if you never have a problem & end up needing to do the SLAM Process. Sure you can dilute but that introduces an even higher margin of error.
There are a couple of tests that are known to produce varying results with the Lamotte & other photometer type systems for instance. This is all discussed & explained here

Pool Test Kits - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com

While tfp is on the World Wide Web & has members from all around the world it is a US based site geared towards helping the most homeowners manage their pools affordably. For most that means titration.
If you want to buy an expensive photometer that’s fine but in general its not necessary nor is it more accurate & often has its limitations.
Unless titration becomes widely unattainable I imagine that TFP will not likely recommend anything else for most people. Even for those who choose photometers it is recommended to back those results up on a regular basis with titration.
Most new comers already balk at buying a $70- $90 kit to properly manage their pool.
Certain Palintest & lovibond options are most certainly recommended for those who cannot aquire Taylor reagents as outlined in the article I linked.

 

[98Poolmaster]

The major factor for not recommending photometer type tests for the average residential pool owner is the cost - when cheap & accurate (at higher fc level) titration is unavailable then it is perhaps the only option other than strips or oto alone.
@n0rthern for instance, The test you posted has a limit of 10ppm. This is fine if you never have a problem & end up needing to do the SLAM Process. Sure you can dilute but that introduces an even higher margin of error.
There are a couple of tests that are known to produce varying results with the Lamotte & other photometer type systems for instance. This is all discussed & explained here

Pool Test Kits - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com

While tfp is on the World Wide Web & has members from all around the world it is a US based site geared towards helping the most homeowners manage their pools affordably. For most that means titration.
If you want to buy an expensive photometer that’s fine but in general its not necessary nor is it more accurate & often has its limitations.
Unless titration becomes widely unattainable I imagine that TFP will not likely recommend anything else for most people. Even for those who choose photometers it is recommended to back those results up on a regular basis with titration.
Most new comers already balk at buying a $70- $90 kit to properly manage their pool.
Certain Palintest & lovibond options are most certainly recommended for those who cannot aquire Taylor reagents as outlined in the article I linked.

Very valid points as usual @Mdragger88 I agree totally with a confirmation,with test kits always have and always will.I guess we are lucky in the USA with having options and different viewpoints on both ways of testing our water.Good article you linked also thank you.

 

[Mdragger88]

@98Poolmaster ,
You’re new so, If you haven’t already, take a moment to also read What is TFPC?
It will give you a better understanding of what we’re all about (ie. keeping expenses low whenever possible while still properly maintaining a beautiful, safe pool & also keeping things simple whenever possible).
Expensive photometers just don’t really fit into that goal for the target base audience (most residential pool owners).
Yes, We are very lucky in the US to have access to so many options! I wish others had the easy availability of the affordable options we do. We have quite a few members in far away lands that have to go to great lengths to obtain proper testing supplies.

 

[98Poolmaster]

@98Poolmaster ,
You’re new so, If you haven’t already, take a moment to also read What is TFPC?
It will give you a better understanding of what we’re all about (ie. keeping expenses low whenever possible while still properly maintaining a beautiful, safe pool & also keeping things simple whenever possible).
Expensive photometers just don’t really fit into that goal for the target base audience (most residential pool owners).
Yes, We are very lucky in the US to have access to so many options! I wish others had the easy availability of the affordable options we do. We have quite a few members in far away lands that have to go to great lengths to obtain proper testing supplies.

Appreciate your responses thank you

 

[ILSBJ]

Hi, I'm also from Europe and can't get the recommended Taylor test kit here.
I have a PoolLab 1.0 photometer (price approx. 100 USD)
I have a 1100 liter (cca 300 gal) hot tub.
In winter season my CYA target is 20ppm

Regarding the accuracy of the CYA measurement with my digital photometer, I am attaching all the measurement results - since the last water change at the beginning of November

With the help of PoolMath and a digital scale, I dosed Dichlor up to a cumulative CYA value of 20 ppm

Then I started to measure CYA. Small fluctuations in the results are CYA losses due to degradation and sometimes I add a few grams of dichlor to maintain CYA level close to 20 ppm (and slightly correct the pH (instead of adding bleach for FCl+ and MA for pH-)).
10.12. I changed 150 liters of water, 20.12. I changed 60 liters of water

I'll leave it up to you to judge

ILSBJ