Pentair variable speed pump 3.0 HP turning off randomly

[lafonte98]

Hey all,

Just had pool opened yesterday and I have found my pump off twice now when it should be on. My schedule set is on from 4am to 3am then off an hour and back on. Any ideas on ehy this would happen?

Thanks,

Greg

 

[todd.brock]

If I read correctly, it’s on 23 hours and off one. Is there some kind of Thermal protection that is shutting off the pump due to over heating? Did you lose power that caused the timer to hiccup and shut the pumps down? Did you find the pump off when checking? Did you have to turn it back on?

 

[lafonte98]

If I read correctly, it’s on 23 hours and off one. Is there some kind of Thermal protection that is shutting off the pump due to over heating? Did you lose power that caused the timer to hiccup and shut the pumps down? Did you find the pump off when checking? Did you have to turn it back on?

Yes, it is on for 23 hours since that is what the pool company that installed pool told me to run it. It ran this schedule all season last year with no issues. Should I be running it less per day? I live in Midwest so pool is open from April until October. They informed me the less the pump turns on and off the longer it will last. I am on second pump since pool was installed in April 2012. Any advice is appreciated.

 

[lafonte98]

If I read correctly, it’s on 23 hours and off one. Is there some kind of Thermal protection that is shutting off the pump due to over heating? Did you lose power that caused the timer to hiccup and shut the pumps down? Did you find the pump off when checking? Did you have to turn it back on?

I did not lose power and when I have in past the pump comes back on when power comes back.

 

[todd.brock]

Full disclosure- I don’t have a pool pump (yet- come on dry weather ). So I can’t necessarily say how often it should run.

They do however run on electricity, so I was trying to help troubleshoot what is causing it to stop running. Could be losing power, could be thermal overload protection- assuming it has this, a mechanical timer failing, and automation system receiving a conflicting signal to shut off the pumps, act of God , or Aliens.

Out of curiosity- how were you alerted the pump shut down? Did you have to re-start ?

 

[lafonte98]

Full disclosure- I don’t have a pool pump (yet- come on dry weather ). So I can’t necessarily say how often it should run.

They do however run on electricity, so I was trying to help troubleshoot what is causing it to stop running. Could be losing power, could be thermal overload protection- assuming it has this, a mechanical timer failing, and automation system receiving a conflicting signal to shut off the pumps, act of God , or Aliens.

Out of curiosity- how were you alerted the pump shut down? Did you have to re-start ?

I noticed it was off when looking out my back window. There was no water movement which notified me the pump was off. I turned it back on so I am curious to know if its still on when I return from work. Not sure if it has thermal protection or not. I would doubt it.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Greg,

How are you turning the pump on/off?

The next time you go out to your pump when running, look at the pump's display... it should say "Display not active".. If it does not, that means that your pump is not being controlled by your EasyTouch, which may be in the service mode... ???

I would check when running, and then again the next time the pump turns off on its own.

I really doubt the pump is bad, it is more likely a programing or operation issue with the ET.

The fact that your pool company told you to run the pump 23 hours a day, tells me that they really do not understand what they are doing... 24/7 might make sense, 8, or 12 hours per day might make sense, but there is just no rational reason for 23 hours a day...

Tell us what happened to the first pump??

Oh!! Do you have the IntelliFlo + SVRS... If so, that may be the issue...

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[lafonte98]

Greg,

How are you turning the pump on/off?

The next time you go out to your pump when running, look at the pump's display... it should say "Display not active".. If it does not, that means that your pump is not being controlled by your EasyTouch, which may be in the service mode... ???

I would check when running, and then again the next time the pump turns off on its own.

I really doubt the pump is bad, it is more likely a programing or operation issue with the ET.

The fact that your pool company told you to run the pump 23 hours a day, tells me that they really do not understand what they are doing... [emoji14] 24/7 might make sense, 8, or 12 hours per day might make sense, but there is just no rational reason for 23 hours a day...

Tell us what happened to the first pump??

Oh!! Do you have the IntelliFlo + SVRS... If so, that may be the issue...

Thanks,

Jim R.

Hey Jim,

I am controlling the pump with Easy Touch panel not from display on pump. How do I ensure the ET is not in service mode? Whish is possible since they just opened the pool yesterday and it was off when I got home so I hit the pump button on the panel to engage the pump. The first pump bearing went out I believe, it became extremely noisy almost unbearable. Which is why I replaced it with this one. It worked fine last year with no issues. I'm thinking you are right it could be a ET panel issue. Do you recommend certain hours the pump should be running for a pool in the Midwest???

 

[Melnic]

Jim,
You have mentioned how the egg timer on the pool plays with the scheduling before (I think it was you). I myself am still struggling with manually turning the pump on and off via screenlogic and it messing with my schedules.
(I still the pump being activated by a relay, as I have not wired up the RS485 line)
I'm wondering if this is what is going on with the OP, where manually turning pool on/off messes with a schedule depending on how the egg timer is set up?

 

[Jimrahbe]

Greg,

Do you have ScreenLogic???

If the ET is in the Service mode the little 3" LCD will say "Service" instead of "Auto"

If it is in the Service mode, just push the mode button (twice)...

Pump run times and speeds are really more of a personal preference and the requirements of your pool... Here are the main reasons to run your pump...

You generally run a pump for three reasons:

1. To keep surface debris moving and being pushed into the skimmers. The more debris the more often you need to run the pump.

2. If you have a Salt Water Chlorine Generator (SWCG) you'll need to run it long enough to generate the amount of chlorine needed.

3. To circulate the water to ensure the chlorine is effectively distributed throughout the pool. Two or three hours per day is all that is needed for this to happen in most pools.


In my case, I have a SWCG and run my pump 24/7 at 1200 rpm most of the time.. I do this so that I am generating a little chlorine all the time... The cost to run the IntelliFlo 24/7 at low rpms is less than $20 per month..

I also like the idea that I am skimming all the time...

You need to figure out what works best for you... My point about the 23 hours was that it does not make sense.. To mix the chemicals you only need 2 to 4 hours.. but this is most likely not enough to keep your surface skimmed, so 6 to 12 hours might work better.. but it all depends on your pool... If the only two choices were 23 hours or 24 hours, I would go 24 hours just because it means you don't have to go through pump's start cycle each day. It also makes ET programming easier..

Thanks for posting,

Jim R.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Jim,
You have mentioned how the egg timer on the pool plays with the scheduling before (I think it was you). I myself am still struggling with manually turning the pump on and off via screenlogic and it messing with my schedules.
(I still the pump being activated by a relay, as I have not wired up the RS485 line)
I'm wondering if this is what is going on with the OP, where manually turning pool on/off messes with a schedule depending on how the egg timer is set up?

Mel,

That is why I asked about the "display not active"... I want to know if the pump is being controlled by the ET serial bus or not...

The way the ET's egg timers work with schedules makes my head hurt, but I suspect you are correct... Anytime the ET does turns off at odd times, they are almost always in the mix..

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[lafonte98]

Greg,

Do you have ScreenLogic???

If the ET is in the Service mode the little 3" LCD will say "Service" instead of "Auto"

If it is in the Service mode, just push the mode button (twice)...

Pump run times and speeds are really more of a personal preference and the requirements of your pool... Here are the main reasons to run your pump...

You generally run a pump for three reasons:

1. To keep surface debris moving and being pushed into the skimmers. The more debris the more often you need to run the pump.

2. If you have a Salt Water Chlorine Generator (SWCG) you'll need to run it long enough to generate the amount of chlorine needed.

3. To circulate the water to ensure the chlorine is effectively distributed throughout the pool. Two or three hours per day is all that is needed for this to happen in most pools.


In my case, I have a SWCG and run my pump 24/7 at 1200 rpm most of the time.. I do this so that I am generating a little chlorine all the time... The cost to run the IntelliFlo 24/7 at low rpms is less than $20 per month..

I also like the idea that I am skimming all the time...

You need to figure out what works best for you... My point about the 23 hours was that it does not make sense.. To mix the chemicals you only need 2 to 4 hours.. but this is most likely not enough to keep your surface skimmed, so 6 to 12 hours might work better.. but it all depends on your pool... If the only two choices were 23 hours or 24 hours, I would go 24 hours just because it means you don't have to go through pump's start cycle each day. It also makes ET programming easier..

Thanks for posting,

Jim R.

Jim,

Thanks so much for the information! I do not have Screen Logic just the standard easy touch. I think I am going to check the pump speed and maybe slow it down to 1200 rpm and see what happens. Pump is the Intelliflo, 1171862.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Greg,

ScreenLogic2 makes using and programming the ET about 10 x easier and much more fun... As an example the following is how I change pump speeds.. Just a mouse click and I can set the exact speed I want, at any time I want, without having to go out to the panel...

Of course there are other pages that allow you to schedule, set up circuits, check the weather and pool and spa temperatures, turn on lights or aux circuits, etc...

ScreenLogic costs about $370 and an easy DIY install..

Thanks,

Jim R.

- - - Updated - - -

Oh!!! I don't see that pump part number, was it a typo or ????

 

[lafonte98]

Greg,

ScreenLogic2 makes using and programming the ET about 10 x easier and much more fun... As an example the following is how I change pump speeds.. Just a mouse click and I can set the exact speed I want, at any time I want, without having to go out to the panel...

Of course there are other pages that allow you to schedule, set up circuits, check the weather and pool and spa temperatures, turn on lights or aux circuits, etc...

ScreenLogic costs about $370 and an easy DIY install..

Thanks,

Jim R.

- - - Updated - - -

Oh!!! I don't see that pump part number, was it a typo or ????

That looks so streamlined! I would love to have that someday. Below are pics of my pump and ET, perhaps I gave the wrong number?

 

[lafonte98]

So i dropped the rpm to 2000 and the watts went down to 550 instead of the 854 watts it was at for 2300 rpm. The pressure gauge on my filter went below the 10psi the pool company said it should be at. Is that okay or does it need to stay around the 10 or 11psi mark until it rises to 21psi and I then need to backwash??

 

[Jimrahbe]

Greg,

My filter pressure usually runs at about 2 or 3 psi... So, once again your pool company is not up to speed... (Pun not intended, but I like it...)

Filter pressure just shows the amount of "effort" it takes to push water through your filter and return plumbing.. The slower the pump speed, the less effort it takes. Saying it should not be below 10 lbs. might have been valid years ago when everyone had a single speed pump, but does not apply today when everyone is using VS pumps.

We recommend backwashing or cleaning when the filter pressure increases about 25 to 30% over the pressure when the filter is clean. This is just a general rule and you should do what works for you. With a VS pump you should select a middle range speed, like 1800 or 2000, and record the pressure when the filter is clean.. and then use that same speed when checking to see if the filter is dirty (+25 to 30%)...

I have a couple of rental house pools that have DE filters... I never backwash them and only take them apart and clean them twice a year... They also have VS pumps running at low rpms...

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[lafonte98]

Jim,

First of all. Haha. I think you are correct regarding my pool company which is why I joined this forum. You have been a wealth of knowledge so thanks for that!!! My flow seems fine at the lower rpm of 2000, pool is 30000 gallons, DE filter, SWG, Plaster bottom and if i plan to leave pump on 24 hours, i should be okay, right? I was even thinking i could lower the hours of operation to save a few bucks. I just don't want to cause any issues with water clarity.

 

[lafonte98]

Greg,

My filter pressure usually runs at about 2 or 3 psi... So, once again your pool company is not up to speed... [emoji14] (Pun not intended, but I like it...)

Filter pressure just shows the amount of "effort" it takes to push water through your filter and return plumbing.. The slower the pump speed, the less effort it takes. Saying it should not be below 10 lbs. might have been valid years ago when everyone had a single speed pump, but does not apply today when everyone is using VS pumps.

We recommend backwashing or cleaning when the filter pressure increases about 25 to 30% over the pressure when the filter is clean. This is just a general rule and you should do what works for you. With a VS pump you should select a middle range speed, like 1800 or 2000, and record the pressure when the filter is clean.. and then use that same speed when checking to see if the filter is dirty (+25 to 30%)...

I have a couple of rental house pools that have DE filters... I never backwash them and only take them apart and clean them twice a year... They also have VS pumps running at low rpms...

Thanks,

Jim R.

I must be doing my math wrong on how you figure the filter needs cleaned. Currenty if it were running at 8 rpm clean then I would need to backwash at 10psi according to the 25% guideline.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Greg,

Your math skills are just fine... The 25% is just a starting point and is really dependent on the pool plumbing and the type of filter, etc...

In my mind the key is how the return water feels... If you can't "feel" a reduction in the amount of water returning to your pool, then there is no reason to clean your filter.. It really is not a big deal.. It is perfectly fine for you to come up with a "time to clean the filter pressure" that works for you.

Thanks for posting,

Jim R.

- - - Updated - - -

For reference, my IntelliFlo run 24/7 for less than $20 bucks a month... Does not leave much savings to be had...

 

[lafonte98]

Greg,

Your math skills are just fine... The 25% is just a starting point and is really dependent on the pool plumbing and the type of filter, etc...

In my mind the key is how the return water feels... If you can't "feel" a reduction in the amount of water returning to your pool, then there is no reason to clean your filter.. It really is not a big deal.. It is perfectly fine for you to come up with a "time to clean the filter pressure" that works for you.

Thanks for posting,

Jim R.

- - - Updated - - -

For reference, my IntelliFlo run 24/7 for less than $20 bucks a month... Does not leave much savings to be had...

Thanks again Jim!

The display of watts on the easy touch. Is that per hour what it is pulling? So if is says 814watts, every hour it uses that many watts of energy?