Pentair Mastertemp 400 vs 400 HD - What is the difference?

[ionizer]

Ok, what is the difference between the 400 and 400 HD?

I know the ASME is considered "commercial" but what is the difference between 400 an 400 HD? Pentair's own site doesn't provide any clarity from this - at least not anywhere I can find.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

The HD has a cupronickel heat exchanger versus straight copper in the regular model. Not worth the extra cost according to our heater experts. Commercial-grade pool heaters are designed for the demanding use of public pools where water is being heating almost continuously while swimmers are in the pool. In a residential setting you are barely using the heater and so there’s no benefit to getting the HD version.

 

[ionizer]

The HD has a cupronickel heat exchanger versus straight copper in the regular model. Not worth the extra cost according to our heater experts. Commercial-grade pool heaters are designed for the demanding use of public pools where water is being heating almost continuously while swimmers are in the pool. In a residential setting you are barely using the heater and so there’s no benefit to getting the HD version.

thanks. so I think I Am getting a quote of $3100 to remove an existing hayward and install the Pentair Mastertemp 400 in its place. I am in NJ. Is $3100 a bit pricey for this + installation? Isnt the regular version like $2100 on amazon, so is $1k a normal cost for an installation with likely only minimal piping to match up the sides?

 

[JoyfulNoise]

$900 for an install. Yeah, it’s pricey but it’s Jersey (I grew up on LI) so everything is pricey. You’re also paying for the installers warranty that his work is done correctly and for him to haul off the old unit and dispose of it. You’re paying him to do the gas connection and plumbing correctly. He’s got the tools and expertise (hopefully) to do the job right the first time. Also, without a pro install, Pentair will not warranty the unit beyond 60 days.

So is all that worth $900 bucks to you....

 

[ps0303]

I would suggest a Raypak/Rheem over the Pentair. The price you were quoted is close to prices here in FL. Remember, they aren't selling you the unit at their cost. These units aren't cheap. Just like anything, there is a markup on the product and then their cost for the install.

 

[ionizer]

$900 for an install. Yeah, it’s pricey but it’s Jersey (I grew up on LI) so everything is pricey. You’re also paying for the installers warranty that his work is done correctly and for him to haul off the old unit and dispose of it. You’re paying him to do the gas connection and plumbing correctly. He’s got the tools and expertise (hopefully) to do the job right the first time. Also, without a pro install, Pentair will not warranty the unit beyond 60 days.

So is all that worth $900 bucks to you....

it's more about what it is to the market and whether my quote is fair compared to the market

to me, a heater isn't worth it at all for the # of times used + cost to use ...but wives dont use rational thinking

 

[SteakWit]

The HD has a cupronickel heat exchanger versus straight copper in the regular model. Not worth the extra cost according to our heater experts. Commercial-grade pool heaters are designed for the demanding use of public pools where water is being heating almost continuously while swimmers are in the pool. In a residential setting you are barely using the heater and so there’s no benefit to getting the HD version.

I have my pool in a residential setting (my home ) and we use the heater a ton. It is constantly on in the spring and fall. We also open in March and close in December (in SE Pennsylvania), so the extra cost is a function of how YOU plan to use the heater. I just had a Pentair MasterTemp 400 fail following a no drain acid wash. The Pool company is replacing the heater (which was only less than 2 years old). They restarted my system but did not add enough soda ash / soda to increase the PH (so I had low PH running through my system for a few days). I told them to install the HD model and I would pick up the extra cost.

Andy

 

[ps0303]

While the HD model is a cupro nickel heat exchanger, keep in mind, it is still not bullet proof. If you do not maintain your chemicals the heat exchanger swill still fail but it will just take a bit longer.

 

[JamesW]

Note that cupronickel does not conduct heat as well as the copper heat exchanger.

The cupronickel is 82% efficient whereas the copper is 84% efficient.

For cupronickel, you get 328,000 btu/hr and lose 72,000 btu per hour.

For copper, you get 336,000 btu/hr and lose 64,000 btu/hr.

For cupronickel, you lose 8,000 btu/hr more than with a copper heat exchanger. That's heat lost with the exhaust gasses.

You lose 12.5% more heat with the cupronickel exchanger over the copper exchanger.

So, you get slightly slower heating and more expensive heating.