Organic stains?

[AmyCJeff]

Moved from HERE

Run your FC at 1/2 to 3/4 of SLAM level and the chlorine should bleach out organic stains over time.

AJW22 - If you don't mind, I have a question for you about this. Long story short, I just recently (in the last two weeks) have been following the TFP method. We built our pool 3 years ago and I came here looking for advice about some staining. Come to find out, our pool was being maintained all wrong! So, we just drained all 18,000 gallons and have gotten everything to where it needs to be (there was a person here not eh boards that helped TREMENDOUSLY with the process). I am now in official "maintenance mode". Now that I have al figured out, I am trying to address the staining. my CYA = 50 and I am maintaining a level of FC = 8.
You noted that if you run FC at 1/2-3/4 SLAM rate (which for me SLAM rate is 20....so 10-15), the Stains will fade over time
I have two questions about doing this:
1) Can you swim in the pool with FC that high?
2) How long does it normally take to see the stains fade? 2 days, 2 weeks, 2 months? The stains appears about 2 months ago..not sure if that plays a factor
3) with is being summer I am not sure I can actually maintain 10-15 without using a TON of Chlorine (I am in Las Vegas). So, I am wondering if I should do this process in Winter since the FC will last longer

I have included pics in case it helps

 

[ajw22]

You noted that if you run FC at 1/2-3/4 SLAM rate (which for me SLAM rate is 20....so 10-15), the Stains will fade over time

The stains MAY fade over time.

I have two questions about doing this:
1) Can you swim in the pool with FC that high?

It is safe to swim up to SLAM FC level.

2) How long does it normally take to see the stains fade? 2 days, 2 weeks, 2 months? The stains appears about 2 months ago..not sure if that plays a factor

From a few days to never.

3) with is being summer I am not sure I can actually maintain 10-15 without using a TON of Chlorine (I am in Las Vegas). So, I am wondering if I should do this process in Winter since the FC will last longer

This is three questions but I will give you a bonus round.

You can try it anytime and see what your results are. All it costs you is some chlorine.

 

[Texas Splash]

Amy, being a Vegas native myself, your post caught my attention since you are from Henderson. Your poolmath logs show some very high CH levels which is somewhat expected, but it's important to be sure of the CH accuracy. either your very first entry was incorrect, or it was incredibly high and you did a water exchange recently. Not only is this important for stain treatment now, but historically since sometimes organics can become embedded with calcium (scale) at which point it's not just a simple organic stain removal process by increasing the FC level, but also about the calcium build up. Make sense?

I figured I'd toss that out there for you to consider or perhaps expand upon in this discussion if it applies.

 

[AmyCJeff]

Amy, being a Vegas native myself, your post caught my attention since you are from Henderson. Your poolmath logs show some very high CH levels which is somewhat expected, but it's important to be sure of the CH accuracy. either your very first entry was incorrect, or it was incredibly high and you did a water exchange recently. Not only is this important for stain treatment now, but historically since sometimes organics can become embedded with calcium (scale) at which point it's not just a simple organic stain removal process by increasing the FC level, but also about the calcium build up. Make sense?

I figured I'd toss that out there for you to consider or perhaps expand upon in this discussion if it applies.

Hello Fellow Vegas Native Thank you for replying! I am learning soo much on these boards. And it definitely helps people who are familiar with our weather and water chime in

Ok...first let me answer the CH levels. When I first came to this forum (a few weeks ago) I quickly learned we were maintaining the pool all wrong (thank you PB). Yes, my original Ch levels were +1600...yikes! We did a 100% water refill (18,000 gallons) and our CH it down to 700. Now, I know that is still on the high end...but several people who were helping me with the process said it is "doable" for now (we will do another water exchange at the end of the summer).

As far as the calcium buildup....so, when we first discovered the staining we felt the surface and it did feel rough. So, we sanded it (that is a whole other story...lol). But, long story short...we did smooth out the areas with stains so if there is dirt/algea that was attached to the calcium buildup I would think the sanding addressed that? But I could be wrong....

I am open to any and all suggestion...as I would really like to get rid of these stains (luckily they can only been seen in the shade and when the water is still)....about 2% of the pool gets shade at 6:00pm....so most will never see the staining

 

[AmyCJeff]

ajw22 -
Thank you for the quick reply Your answers help tremendously!

Oh, and thank you for the "bonus round" I just wasn't sure how long to run FC high, before I could determine whether it is working or not. I am out of town this weekend, so maybe I will do it next week.

I think the fact that I am now running FC = 8 is s step in the right direction

 

[Texas Splash]

You're doing very well taking control. Since you are using the Poolmath app, I'm sure you see the CSI number and that recommends a slightly negative CSI as it generally helps to prevent scale build-up. Your test logs show you have a TA of about 50 which is fine, and the pH on the low end which in your case, with an elevated CH, is good. Keep up the good work in that area.

With a negative CSI, you "might" get lucky to see some calcium build-up try to thin over time - maybe. That coupled with brushing may help. As Allen noted above, you can always increase the FC a bit to see if it cuts through any organic staining. It won't hurt anything at all.

 

[Texas Splash]

Watch your calendar later. You know how the area loves those August monsoons. Almost like clockwork later in the afternoon. If you see a rare chance to get some fresh (soft) water, take advantage of it.

 

[AmyCJeff]

You're doing very well taking control. Since you are using the Poolmath app, I'm sure you see the CSI number and that recommends a slightly negative CSI as it generally helps to prevent scale build-up. Your test logs show you have a TA of about 50 which is fine, and the pH on the low end which in your case, with an elevated CH, is good. Keep up the good work in that area.

With a negative CSI, you "might" get lucky to see some calcium build-up try to thin over time - maybe. That coupled with brushing may help. As Allen noted above, you can always increase the FC a bit to see if it cuts through any organic staining. It won't hurt anything at all.

Yes...I am using the Pool Math app and trying to maintain levels of the following:
FC =8
Ph = 7.2
CH = 700
CYA = 50
TA = 100 ( this was at 180 AFTER the refill, and worked hard to get it to 100). Will now hopefully get it closer to 90 with normal addition of MA

You noted that I have a TA of 50...it is 100. CYA is 50

Now...in regard to CSI..I am trying to maintain close to zero. But you are saying that since I have calcium buildup (due to my previously EXTREMELY high CH) and currently have a higher than normal CH maintaining slightly negative is a better way to go? And by doing this it ,it might also get rid of some of the build up? How long would that process take? days, weeks, months?

When we sanded our pool (about 3-4 weeks ago) we sanded any and all rough spots. Would that have gotten rid of the build up? Or are you saying even if it is "smooth" to the touch...it could have buildup? Ok...I promise I think that is all my questions for today....lol

 

[Texas Splash]

You noted that I have a TA of 50...it is 100.

I must've misread that in the log. Thank you. You can continue to control your pH with acid and let the TA fall as low as 50. A TA of 50-60 will work in your favor.

maintaining slightly negative is a better way to go?

Absolutely. It "might" help to thin-out existing scale build up. Certainly can't hurt.

Would that have gotten rid of the build up?

Maybe. Without seeing the areas it's hard to tell. We anticipate scale to feel rough which is why you sanded, however depending on its thickness, it's possible that scale might have just been sanded smooth. But if you see improvements that's a good thing.