New to testing and Balancing... need a touch of guidance

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kimkats said:
Pucks either have CYA (stabilizer) or CH (calcium hardness) to help bind the chlorine in to the solid form. The person that finds a way to make pucks without anything "harmful" will make a fortune!

You can do Reverse Osmosis that will remove CYA and CH. It is $$$ but in places with water restrictions it is an option. Not many places have it available.

I don't see it as being stupid. It is more not knowing. The pool industries are just now starting to know about and accept the CYA/FC ratio. There are many (most) that do not understand it OR chose to ignore it because it hits their bottom line $$.

You go to the pool store thinking they know what is best for your pool. You have them test your water and they tell you you need to buy this and that so your pool will be all set. You go back the next week and they test and say oh now you need that and this. Just the opposite of they said last week :shock:

The pool service comes once a week so they have to hit it so hard it is not safe to hope the FC makes it until the next week. Just think about the people who don't have their own test kit and let their kids and family swim with the FC so high :sad:

I am glad both of you found TFP. You will not believe how your water looks when I am done with it!

Sprangdog-I look forward to seeing your own thread when you go to open. If I do not see it right away make sure to PM me so I can help you out.

Newton, you are on the right track. We are close to getting everything where it should be. I can't wait to see just how high your CYA is :rolleyes: No matter how high it ends up you can go ahead and start your 64% drain and refill as we KNOW that needs to be done. The only question is how many times.

:hug:

Kim:kim:
Click to expand...

Kim

I was thinking since I need to drain a significant amount of water


Would it be a good idea to go ahead and do a full drain and acid wash the pool (I have a feeling the pebble is probably coated with the Calcium since the hardness is so high)

What are your thoughts ?

Then do a fresh fill and start this baby off the right way


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That is up to you. A acid wash will shorten your plaster life. How much I do not know. But it will take care of any plaster problems you inherited from the former owner. Now IS the time to do it-need to remove some water, it is cooler, etc. My gut goes with yes do it but that is just I am thinking like you......in for a dime, in for a dollar. Go big or go home. LOL However you want to say it.

Let me know what you decide.

Kim:kim:
 
I still go to the local pool store for parts. Last week when I was there the manager asked why I had stopped buying chemicals (except MA) from him. I told him about TFP. He understood the concern about CYA. He also stated that next year a puck will be available without CYA. We will wait and see!

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Ok so I did some thinking... I know that can be dangerous... or so my wife tells me

I decided instead of renting a pump to drain the pool for 50 I would just pay the pool store 100 and they will come put the pump in and drain it and come back and pick up the pump the next day and I will start the re-filling... (the pebble looks really good) so I have decided not to acid wash, and save the money, as well as not to lessen the life of the plaster... With that out of the way

they will be here this Thursday to drain it and I will start filling It back up on Friday
I ran the Fill numbers through the pool math calculator and this Is what I came up with

Kim can you tell me if there is a specific order I need to start the pool up in ?

the Fill numbers are

FC - 1.5
PH - 7.8
TA - 125
CH - 300

based on the calculator I will need

59oz of Bleach (6% solution)
13oz of MA
60oz by weight or 63oz by volume of Stabilizer (or 156oz of liquid stabilizer)

I want to make sure of 2 things.... I have enough supplies to do the complete start up correctly (which may take some time over the next few weeks to get it dialed in and settled) and that I am putting the right stuff in

can you provide me a list of the things to buy?

also the DE filter was recently taken apart and cleaned in September (it is reading 10 pounds of pressure higher than at cleaning) should I go ahead and backwash it now and add a pound of DE so the filter is all set prior to Draining or wait till after the pool is drained and refilled.

I almost feel as if there is one shot at getting this thing off to the right start, and any misstep will send me down the wrong path again

Kim you have been a beacon of light on this journey and It is very appreciated
 
The drain is VERY easy to do but if you feel better paying them to do it then go for it. They might have a bigger pump then you can rent so it might be faster.

I would start refilling as soon as the last drop of water it out of the pool. Better safe than sorry in the Texas sun even if it is fall (cooler).

Shopping list:

From Dollar store:

-white plastic plate-to be held up behind the PH test tube to help you with the color match. It really helped me dial the colors. I pull the plate back and forth until I can see the match.

-two plastic measuring cups-one for chlorine and CYA and one for Muratic Acid-they do NOT play well together.

-plastic bottle-like the ketchup ones with the pointy tops. This is for collecting your water from your pool

-getting fancy here-1/2 inch PVC pipe, length to be determined by you. This is so you do not have to kneel down to collect the water. You put it down into the water, put your thumb over the hole and bring it up and put the water in the above bottle. You can just use the bottle above if you want to but it get old kneeling down and sticking your arm in cold water LOL

Now you have to call around your area for this one:

-Bleach or chlorine-You are going to need to add chlorine or bleach (same stuff with different % of active stuff) every day. Less in the cooler months, more in the warmer months. Right now I am adding 2 cups a day. During the summer I add 5 to 6 cups a day depending on bather load.

Your Pool $tore might have liquid chlorine that is around 11%. You will have to put a deposit down on their jugs. The jugs I get are the 2.5 gal ones. They do offer the 5 gal but that is too heavy for me to lift and pour. I have 4 jugs that way I can go about 8 days during the summer between trips by the store.

Some people find their local Walmart, Target, Sam's, Costco, etc. has the best price on their bleach (store brand is fine) that is around 8.25%. Make sure to check the date code!! You do not want it to be older than 3 months as it will degrade over time.

Look around your area and see what works best for you. You want it to be easy and cheap.

I would buy about 5 gals to get you started and set up for the week.

-Muratic acid-Lowes or Home Depot-look in the outside area. Get the one that is 31.?%. They sell the lesser % one for the same cost. It will come in 2 gal. boxes. You will have this for a while.

M.A. storage-it should be stored well away from where you store the chlorine in a well ventilated area with no metal around as the vapors can cause rusting. Most of us keep it outside in a safe area from critters and kids.

-CYA-power works just find and is cheaper but is some extra work to get it in. Liquid gold CYA is easier and faster. Let me know which one you decide to get and I will tell you how and when to add it. ONLY shoot for a CYA of 30 to start with. We will adjust as needed. You can buy it from Lowes and Home Depot. Walmart might have it but most of the time they only have it during the season. You can order it on line if needed. We have not found any one brand better than another yet.

I THINK I covered everything. I have another post waiting for you. It will help you in your daily life with your pool. I am holding off on it as I do not want to overwhelm you.

:hug: You are doing GREAT!

Kim:kim:
 
I just wanted to pop in and say hi :handwave:

Kim has you in great hands and if you follow what she says you will be off to a great start and learn why you are doing what you are doing. It is really easy once you know how

I almost feel as if there is one shot at getting this thing off to the right start, and any misstep will send me down the wrong path again
Click to expand...

Dont worry too much about missteps. At the end of the day it is only pool water and somewhere in the forum is pretty much a way to simply and easily fix any issues you may come across. I think Kim either knows the answer to everything or maybe more importantly knows where to find the answers :D

I think the only bad misstep you could make would be not to ask the question when you think you may have an issue

The only advice I could add to what Kim has said is to take a picture of your pool now, before you drain and refill. It would be nice to compare in a couple of weeks/months down the track how good your water looks compared to how it looked when the pool guy maintained it. I think you will be amazed at how easy, cheap and really trouble free it will be and how clear, sparkly and soft the water will feel
 
Caco, That is an AWESOME idea about the picture! Take one looking down at your main drain cover. Now if you are feeling REALLY brave you can throw quarter in the water and take a pic of it. We will get your water so clear that you will be able to read the heads or tails on a coin in the deep end :shock: BUT who wants to get in that cold water??? NOT ME!!!! LOL

Kim:kim:
 
Bought the supplies
I got HASA liquid chlorine at a local shop 12.5% 4 gallons

And some granular stabilizer conditioner

Some pics of the pool as is

I will post more after the drain and refill


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That is such a pretty pool and area! What a neat shape it is! Did you buy for the house or the pool?

I am glad you were able to find a good source for the chlorine.

Your pool does look good right now. It is hard to imagine but it will look even better when we get through with it! There will be a sparkle to it that you have not seen.

While you are waiting for Thurs. to get here go find some long socks (yeah the kind you wear) to put the CYA powder in. Think about how you will hang those sock(s) in front of your returns so that as soon as you are able to turn the equipment back on you can start adding the CYA. We have found this is a MUCH better way to add it. The directions on the bottle can cause many problems such as clogs, waste (undissolved), etc.

You can and should squeeze the sock after it gets good and wet to help it dissolve. Once you drop the sock in front of the return you act as if the CYA is in the pool when you are using Pool Math to find your other values. We have found the CYA shows on the test after it is all dissolved and has had a chance to mix in the water good.

Kim:kim:
 
We bought the house for both the pool and the home
Hoping it will be our last home to own (so taking good care of the pool is of the utmost importance)

We love to sit in our spa on cool evenings here in Phoenix and enjoy the stars

The pool is very nice in the summer months as well

Thanks for all the info
I will keep you posted
And already with the sock


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Kim the pool is filling with fresh water
It is about half way done
Should be ready for chemicals tomorrow
I will run a test on the water when it's done and post the results as well as put them in the pool calculator


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Does it already look better??? LOL

I will be in and out most of the day tomorrow but will check in often to keep you on the right track. You can go ahead and set up the CYA in the socks. Shoot for 30 to start with. We will adjust from there as needed.

I want you to adjust the PH first. Use care when working with the Muratic acid. Add it slowly in front of the return. Let it mix for about 30 mins. then retest and see if you met your goal.

Once you get the PH where you want it start working on adding the chlorine.

When working on the PH and FC make sure there is about 15 mins between adding them. They do not play well together.

Kim:kim:
 
Can I put the MA and the Socks in at the same time or wait for the CYA to dissipate?

- - - Updated - - -

also I read something on the forum about the hard water here in the Desert southwest that talked about adjusting the goals based on how hard the water is...

I will see if I can find that again and put those targets in the calculator, it adjusted TA and PH slightly to allow for better balance with the CH levels (which I believe will be at or over 300 to start out with)
 
The only two you have to "keep apart" is Chlorine and Muratic acid. Everything else plays well together so your socks can hang around while you do everything. I would squeeze them often to speed up the dissolving and mixing.

Your fill water had a CH of 375 according to your test on the fill water.

Look on Pool Math for the CSI and do some reading on here about it. The search box at the top is awesome. It will take you to TFP links!

Play around with the PH and TA levels in Pool Math and see how they impact your CSI.

I am loving how much you have already learned! It really looks like you have been doing quite a bit of reading-nice job!

Kim:kim:
 
It is almost done filling
I will let the pumps run for an hour when it's full and then run a full test to verify all the results and tap those into pool math

As well as post
Them here

I drained roughly 90% of the water the pump left some in the bottom
So not sure how that will impact all the values
I also bought a filter at the pool store for the water hose to reduce some of the contaminants that the fill water has



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