New pool design finalized. Open to suggestions.

[masterofnone48]

Hello,
My wife and I are looking to start construction of our first pool around January/February. It will be a 13' x 26' gunite pool with attached 6' x 6' spa and 12"x24" bullnose ivory travertine coping. It will be a broom finish concrete deck. There will also be 6" glass tile on the waterline and quartzscape plaster. We have worked with the contractor on the design and laid it out in the yard a few times. It will be 4' deep sloping to 5.5' deep with a bench across the wall in the deep end. I have been reading a lot here and feel like I have a pretty good setup going. I'm open to suggestions.

Components will be:
2 LED lights in pool and 1 in the spa (4bubblers in spa and 1 drain)
SWG
2 skimmers, 5 eyeball returns, and 1 main drain
Pentair Intelliflo variable speed pump
Mastertemp 400k BTU heater
320 sf 4 cartridge filter
I think it will be 2.5" piping throughout

I plan to add a robotic cleaner and some sort of cover once the pool and startup is done. I will also buy my test kit before the pool is filled. Any other things I should be planning on getting? Any issues with the components listed above?

 

[Rocket J Squirrel]

Well, since none of the well-known experts have chimed in yet, I, a non-expert, will.

No one on TFP recommends chlorine tablet feeders (except perhaps for occasional vacation use). Long story short, the cyanuric acid "conditioner" in the conditioned tablets builds up to unsustainable levels. If you hate the idea of manual dosing from a jug, look into a Stenner pump or a salt water chlorine generator.

Given that your pool is rectangular, you might consider putting the spa inside the rectangle instead of jutting out the side. This would enable you to install a motorized auto-cover at build time. The auto-cover is easily my favorite feature of my pool. My spa is in a corner at the shallow end of the pool.

 

[Rocket J Squirrel]

Also, you didn't mention what type of controller you'll be using. Electronic automation? Mechanical timer? You'll need some type of controller unless you want to manually mess with the pump, valves, and heater when you switch between pool and spa modes.

 

[ajw22]

Are you planning on automation now or in the future to switch from POOL mode to SPA mode?

You want all Jandy NeverLube valves. No ball valves.

What model LED lights?

Consider a SWG.

 

[YippeeSkippy]

Definitely go for the Salt Water Chlorine Generator for your sanitation needs! Simplifies your life enormously....and also makes the water feel more silky.
For a pool that size an autocover shouldn't cost you the moon and back. Great help in keeping the pool/spa warm and keeping debris out. Also provides a safety factor that can't be surpassed.

Maddie

 

[masterofnone48]

Also, you didn't mention what type of controller you'll be using. Electronic automation? Mechanical timer? You'll need some type of controller unless you want to manually mess with the pump, valves, and heater when you switch between pool and spa modes.

I'm not entirely sure. The estimate states "Pentair control panel, pumps, lights, spa"

Well, since none of the well-known experts have chimed in yet, I, a non-expert, will.

No one on TFP recommends chlorine tablet feeders (except perhaps for occasional vacation use). Long story short, the cyanuric acid "conditioner" in the conditioned tablets builds up to unsustainable levels. If you hate the idea of manual dosing from a jug, look into a Stenner pump or a salt water chlorine generator.

Given that your pool is rectangular, you might consider putting the spa inside the rectangle instead of jutting out the side. This would enable you to install a motorized auto-cover at build time. The auto-cover is easily my favorite feature of my pool. My spa is in a corner at the shallow end of the pool.

I'm not sure if that means it will be a chlorine feeder. I have read about the issues here and will just not use it if it is included in the price. We do travel often so it could be handy for during a trip.

We had the spa in the pool but had to move it to work with the layout we wanted. Thanks for the feedback.

 

[Rocket J Squirrel]

The estimate states "Pentair control panel, pumps, lights, spa"

That's too vague. You need to pin them down on the exact models of controller, pumps (plural?), etc. How can they give you a quote without specifics?

They probably intend to sell you an EasyTouch. This is a 1980s style piece of electronics. It works, but I would not buy one of these today. The newer panel is the IntelliCenter, just released last year. You can find reviews of that newer panel on the TFP site if you search. Also visit the Pentair automation page to see what the differences are.

Pool Automation

Pentair's pool automation systems give pool owners full control of pumping, heating, sanitizing, water chemistry, water features and lighting. Learn more here.

www.pentair.com

 

[masterofnone48]

Definitely go for the Salt Water Chlorine Generator for your sanitation needs! Simplifies your life enormously....and also makes the water feel more silky.
For a pool that size an autocover shouldn't cost you the moon and back. Great help in keeping the pool/spa warm and keeping debris out. Also provides a safety factor that can't be surpassed.

Maddie

We will have three deck jets and was suggested to not do the SWG because the water is being thrown in the air and we are also trying to keep the price down on the pool. The SWG seemed a good bit more expensive upfront and probably almost even in the long run when changing out the salt cell compared to chemicals. I could be wrong though.

 

[ajw22]

You need to pin down manufacturer and model numbers for all equipment provided for a price.

I will let others tell you why you will be penny wise and pound foolish in not getting a SWG.

 

[masterofnone48]

You need to pin down manufacturer and model numbers for all equipment provided for a price.

I will let others tell you why you will be penny wise and pound foolish in not getting a SWG.

I had thought the estimate was a bit generic but all of the estimates I had received were that way. I have reached out to the builder for more information on exactly what components will be used. I will update the thread once I find out. Thanks for all of the suggestions!

 

[kimkats]

If you travel a bit you DO want the SWG as it will manage your pool for you. The puck feeder will manage it WHILE it adds extra stuff to the pool.

Is the spa elevated?

Kim

 

[bmoreswim]

Specify the depth of the pool every 2' along it's length so there are no disagreements later on slope. Regardless of what is said, there is no standard.

 

[masterofnone48]

If you travel a bit you DO want the SWG as it will manage your pool for you. The puck feeder will manage it WHILE it adds extra stuff to the pool.

Is the spa elevated?

Kim

No the spa will be at the same level as the pool.

 

[masterofnone48]

Specify the depth of the pool every 2' along it's length so there are no disagreements later on slope. Regardless of what is said, there is no standard.

Good thought! My wife and I discussed that and tried to figure out where the slope will start etc.

 

[masterofnone48]

I think we are going to go for the SWG over chlorine last minute. My only concern is the saltwater reacting with the travertine coping but I have seen conflicting results on if that actually happens or not. Any advice?

 

[ajw22]

My only concern is the saltwater reacting with the travertine coping but I have seen conflicting results on if that actually happens or not. Any advice?

High quality travertine is not effected by the elements or salt water.

Low quality travertine will flake in time and the SWG is a good excuse by builders.

From Unfinished Travertine Decking Erosion around entry and exit points

I truly believe this is a materials quality problem and not so much a chemistry problem. Not all travertine is the same, it's quality depend A LOT of where it was mined from and how it was formed. Travertine is nothing more than limestone that has formed from a flowing water source. True travertine comes from hot spring sources where superheated water that is saturated with calcium carbonate rises up to the surface. Once there, the excess dissolved CO2 rapidly outgassed and the pH rises. As the pH rises the calcium carbonate precipitates out of solution. There are two forms of calcium carbonate - calcite and aragonite (different crystalline structures). If the water that the travertine deposit forms in is hot (the hotter the better), then the aragonite is the preferred precipitate and the travertine will be harder, more dense and less porous. If the water is cooler, then the calcite form is favored where the travertine will be less dense, softer and more porous. In the extreme case of fluvial waters (free flowing cool waters like rivers and lakes), the deposit that is formed is very porous and weak; as such, it is not technically travertine but it is called tufa.

So, my gut feeling is that the homeowner simply has a poor quality batch of travertine that is likely more porous and soft. As such, the constant exposure to water, wet/dry cycling and chloride exposure (from the chlorine used in the pool) has simply caused the travertine to spall and disintegrate. Chloride and sulfate attack are well known problems in cementitious materials especially in arid climates where the rapid evaporation allows the pool water to deposit lots of chloride into the surface of the stone. Those tiles should have been sealed to prevent the damage you are seeing. My guess is they were not to prevent them from being slippery.

 

[masterofnone48]

Thanks for the share. The search engine on the site has not been working for me today. It keeps erroring out.

 

[masterofnone48]

I just built a patio cover and the pool deck will extend from the patio. I have attached a photo of the yard where the pool will be and the patio.

We were very close to signing our agreement with the PB but I found some issues with the details in the estimate after numerous attempts to get it clarified. The biggest being they specified we would be getting 6" glass waterline tile since the beginning and on every estimate revision since but are stating that glass tile is not included so we have a big issue there!

 

[ajw22]

We were very close to signing our agreement with the PB but I found some issues with the details in the estimate after numerous attempts to get it clarified. The biggest being they specified we would be getting 6" glass waterline tile since the beginning and on every estimate revision since but are stating that glass tile is not included so we have a big issue there!

My experience in construction is contractors know how much profit they need to get out of a job. If you squeeze them too much they figure out where they can recover it. Either in quality of materials or quality of work. I seek to understand where the builders profit is and let them keep it in a few areas. They need to put food on their table.

You need to look at the overall cost of the project and decide if it is a decent value.

 

[masterofnone48]

I sat down with the project manager and two owners of the company and sorted everything out. They made a mistake in including waterline tile on the estimate so they are giving a $400 credit towards installing the waterline tile as well as upgrading the white LED lights to the multi-color lights at no charge. I felt that was a fair offer and jumped on it. I also was able to clarify that the pool does have an overflow and auto leveler included and the IC40 SWG. One of the pools they installed had a really nice color which is Quartzscapes blue with a little extra black aggregate added and they will be doing that for our pool also.

As of now, there will be an Easytouch 4 and I'm on the fence about automation with valve actuators etc. I'm only really concerned about being able to automate turning the spa on on the way home from work etc. I'm fine with the deck jets and lights just being operated on a timed schedule for the most part. Thoughts?

They should be digging on Monday and rolling because the gunite crew will be taking off for two weeks so they want to get the gunite done before the 18th. We will be going with the Artistry in Mosaic Azure 1"x2" and a gray grout. We were torn between this tile and the Blue Lightwaves but I was worried about the Lightwaves being a little too much bling and the tile we chose has about half of the tiles blinging. lol I'm open to any opinions.