New Pool Build - TX

[Ryno98]

That looks great! Agree with the waterproofing issue -- they had to dig behind my waterfall feature for waterproofing as well as re-contour the land behind it due to water coming through. Unfortunately they discovered the need to do this after the color was added to the structure, and now I have a couple of white stains which have not faded in the least. No probs since the waterproofing, though...

I totally agree with the "pacifier" concept. I think this is a well known PB technique for juggling multiple jobs, and we certainly had MONTHS of time where just one lonely worker was out there piddling on some small part of the project while the rest of the backyard remained a giant mudpit. I'm still overall very impressed with your rate of progress, though. It took at least 3 months after digging for them to get to this point with my build! I think the problem is that the pool in it's current state is basically weather proof, so they have very little motivation to work fast (like they do prior to gunite for example). Also, you are getting into the stage of the project where many of the big sub-contractor jobs have been done (save decking and plaster) and so more of the burden is on the actual PB company which frankly doesn't handle it as efficiently.

At least you're not missing any swim time for now. It will be worth it in the end!

 

[JayBauman]

Better look out, Twolabs....I'm my pool is catching up with you. My boulders went in today!

 

[Beadedbiker]

Gosh that waterfall is the fricking bomb! I cannot believe Glock called dibs on the cave. Darn it. I knew I shouldn't have taken a few days off TFP.

I guess we all learn the hard way about PB schedules that make us all feel like we are the forgotten stepchild. I've been going through it myself. I don't take a pacifier well. I spat it out as a baby and yelled harder and my PB is learning that as an adult I have kept the same technique flawlessly. So if I need to yell at yours too, it would almost be cathartic. I can only yell at mine so many times in a day....

 

[Twolabs]

That looks great! Agree with the waterproofing issue -- they had to dig behind my waterfall feature for waterproofing as well as re-contour the land behind it due to water coming through. Unfortunately they discovered the need to do this after the color was added to the structure, and now I have a couple of white stains which have not faded in the least. No probs since the waterproofing, though...

I totally agree with the "pacifier" concept. I think this is a well known PB technique for juggling multiple jobs, and we certainly had MONTHS of time where just one lonely worker was out there piddling on some small part of the project while the rest of the backyard remained a giant mudpit. I'm still overall very impressed with your rate of progress, though. It took at least 3 months after digging for them to get to this point with my build! I think the problem is that the pool in it's current state is basically weather proof, so they have very little motivation to work fast (like they do prior to gunite for example). Also, you are getting into the stage of the project where many of the big sub-contractor jobs have been done (save decking and plaster) and so more of the burden is on the actual PB company which frankly doesn't handle it as efficiently.

At least you're not missing any swim time for now. It will be worth it in the end!

Very true, that's one thing that at least doesn't throw us into raging mode...it's not like we're trying to hurry so we can swim this season. I can't imagine your emotion levels last year.

Speaking of waterproofing, the only problems you had were behind your waterfall? What about your retaining walls on both sides of your pool? Did they waterproof behind those, and if not, have you had any streaking? Right now I think i've convinced him to waterproof behind a section of our retaining wall that he originally wasn't going to. But he's still adamant that the other section doesn't need it because, "Water takes the path the least resistance. Since the yard is sloping towards the fence, that is where the water will go." Which is true, but yard slopes in two directions: away from the house toward the fence, but also left to right directly into that retaining wall. My thinking is, I probably spent several thousand dollars on that stretch of retaining wall...why not spend $50 in material and a couple hours of labor to go ahead and waterproof that wall to be safe? It's a tiny fraction of the cost of this project, I just don't understand why he's kind of making a big deal out of it. We already have a white stain on our new flagstone in one area, and I don't want more.

Better look out, Twolabs....I'm my pool is catching up with you. My boulders went in today!

Very true! Your guys are fast! Of course it helps they just have to drive about 30 minutes to you I'm guessing, instead of 5 hours up to me!

Gosh that waterfall is the fricking bomb! I cannot believe Glock called dibs on the cave. Darn it. I knew I shouldn't have taken a few days off TFP.

I guess we all learn the hard way about PB schedules that make us all feel like we are the forgotten stepchild. I've been going through it myself. I don't take a pacifier well. I spat it out as a baby and yelled harder and my PB is learning that as an adult I have kept the same technique flawlessly. So if I need to yell at yours too, it would almost be cathartic. I can only yell at mine so many times in a day....

Ha thanks! We love how it turned out.

And yeah, it's tough being pushed to the side on things like this. However, when I feel myself getting all worked up...I try to think, "Wow, what a great problem to have. I'm upset that my awesome swimming pool is coming along slowly....poor little me!" And that seems to put things into perspective. Now, if I can just remember that tomorrow....

 

[RangerBob]

And - when the decking is done - you can even sit out by the pool and pretend what it will be like when it's really finished .

 

[JayBauman]

Very true! Your guys are fast! Of course it helps they just have to drive about 30 minutes to you I'm guessing, instead of 5 hours up to me!

You're half-right. They only live about 30 miles from my house. But considering Houston traffic, they live about 2 hours away!

 

[Beadedbiker]

And - when the decking is done - you can even sit out by the pool and pretend what it will be like when it's really finished .

I second this, I went and did some Yoga by my pool this morning, and if i mediated REALLY hard I could almost imagine the sound of water. Or that might have been the soundtrack I was using. Either way I was quite zen like over the whole thing for a few minutes. If yoga isn't your thing I hear enough margaritas have the same effect...

 

[JayBauman]

Well, here are some pictures of the shoot this morning.



We're blown away by how it looks. I can't imagine what it will be like once it is textured, stained and the lights installed.

Hey Twolabs...did you have the water your rocks like you do to the shell? How hard was it? They shot my pool and rocks all at once on Friday, and I'm surprised how long it takes to water everything down. The shell is easy....all the nooks and crannies on my water features and raised spa take forever to spray down.

 

[Twolabs]

Well, the PB said not to worry about it...but, by the sheer presence of me on this board, I worry about those types of things. Even the waterfall guys seemed a little apprehensive about me watering it, he got out in broken english that it wasn't waterproofed yet, and would leak a lot on the inside.

However, to me, gunite is gunite. And the curing process being slowed dramatically increased it's strength, so I wasn't going to take a chance. They gunited the waterfall on a Friday, and we were leaving for Mexico the next morning. So I watered it like normal on Friday and Saturday morning. For the week we were gone, I set up a sprinkler on a timer to run 15 minutes every 6 hours. It didn't get all the nooks and crannies, but it got the majority of it.

Whether or not it was necessary, or good enough, I have no idea. But at least it made me feel better.

In my opinion, what do you have to lose (except for a little time and water). I want this thing to last many many many years, so I want it as strong as possible.

 

[JayBauman]

You are thinking what I am thinking....but I didn't even think about what happens to the water once it reaches the hollow inside.

My PB just told me to water "it" about "once a day is good....twice is better....three times if you're around. If not, no big deal". I'm not sure if "it" references just the shell or the shell + waterfall. While I understand the importance of water in keeping the temperature down and in providing hydration to help with the curing process, I somehow wonder if this isn't a ploy to make us think we're helping. My last pool shell only got watered once a day (Max) for the first 2 days and didn't get watered again until the next week. I had an unplanned work trip and didn't make other arrangements. The shell and pool turned out fine. But of course I want to do the right thing, so I've been able to keep it wet so far. I plan on living here for quite awhile, and I want this thing to last!

 

[Twolabs]

Well, I didn't water it enough so that there would be buckets of water on the hollow inside. Even so, I think that would be good because it would increase the humidity on the interior that wasn't getting directly sprayed, thereby slowing the cure.

I don't think it's just a ploy to buy time and make us feel like we're doing something (even though it also serves those purposes). All the research I did seems to substantiate the importance of moist curing all types of concrete for at least 7 days. Here is a chart that shows the different compressive strength's achieved based upon how they were cured.



via cement.org

 

[JayBauman]

I'm familiar with the page where you found that graphic (I've also been researching this topic!), but I am suspicious of the laboratory control (yellow curve). As a Houston resident, there should be enough water in the ambient air to help with the curing process, especially when dew forms every morning. Of course, since my shell was shot last week, we've had 4 extremely low-humidity days down here!

I realize that gunite is an extremely dry cement mixture, so I wonder if this makes the compressive strength more sensitive to intentional hydration or less sensitive? Now that all the visible work is done on my pool for the foreseeable future, I spend all my downtime contemplating the more etherial aspects of pool construction. I'm sure that I'll get jolted back to reality once the contraction starts back up again!

 

[kimkats]

I think a sprinkler or two would do a better job than a person spraying a hose. The sprinkler does not get tired or bored and quit early LOL

Kim

 

[Glock]

I think a sprinkler or two would do a better job than a person spraying a hose. The sprinkler does not get tired or bored and quit early LOL

Kim

Hahaha!

 

[JayBauman]

I think a sprinkler or two would do a better job than a person spraying a hose. The sprinkler does not get tired or bored and quit early LOL

Kim

I thought about this based on a comment I read in some other thread. However, when I went out to my garage to locate the sprinklers I couldn't find any. I've had irrigation systems for so long now, I think my manual sprinklers were a victim of "thinning the herd" before/after some past house relocation. So I can either go buy one or just do it myself. The lazy money is on me just doing it myself....it's only a week, right?

 

[Beadedbiker]

I watered my shell by hand for 2 weeks. I basically just sprayed it down twice a day to moisten the surface. Thats all they said to do, and it didn't take but about 10 mins. Especially this time of year its cool enough that it cures more slowly anyway. The PB told me they really worry about it when its baking hot in the summer, and in the fall and winter, less so.

 

[Twolabs]

Not much to update, because...well....nothing has been done!

Sigh, I knew my 17 workers comment was going to come back to haunt me.

So, as I mentioned, the PB has been using the waterfall crew to pacify us from having any other work done. The PB's own crew (except for one afternoon last week by a 3 guys for 2 hrs) hasn't worked on our pool in 3 weeks. All of the work that's been done has been by the waterfall crew, which finished last Thursday. We were told by PB, that they (waterfall crew) would be back the next day or Monday to stain the waterfall. Then Monday came and went. Staring at blue sky with rain in the forecast, I texted PB on Tuesday that I'm worried that we're going to run out of good weather days. Case in point, it rained the day we got back from Mexico (Oct 11th) and the entire backyard was a mud pit. There is STILL standing water in some areas...that is how poorly our soil drains. So if we start getting some regular rains (which tends to happen here in November with cold fronts) then we'll never get done.

PB texted back that the waterfall crew would be there tomorrow and they (PB) will be there in the morning to start decking preparation. Well yesterday came and went. PB texted around 1 "Didn't finish this job until too late to come. Will be there in morning." Then he called about an hour later, "Waterfall guys won't be there until Thursday and Friday. So we'll come Monday to start decking, they said they don't want dust flying around." Monday's forecast? 60% of rain. Tuesday? 60% chance of rain. If that holds true, then I doubt any work will be done next week because it'll be too wet...

We've literally had (aside from a small sprinkle yesterday) 20 days of bright sunshine and 70-85 degree weather with absolutely zero done on any part of the pool aside from the waterfall. Oh well, from what I've read on other threads, this just seems to be the norm. Not to mention we're ahead of our originally thought schedule, so I still can't complain too much....even though I just complained alot....

 

[JayBauman]

My PB gave me estimate of 6-8 weeks from date of excavation. I have a co-worker who built a very similar pool to mine with the same PB....from excavation to water fill was 4 weeks. Since my PB is ahead of his original schedule, I could see my project getting finished early.

Of course, I'm sure I just jinxed myself....probably won't be swimming until Valentine's Day now!

 

[Esiebert7625]

Maybe its just me but if someone didn't show up when they were supposed to and did that repeatedly they would get a royal ***-chewing from me. In these days where there are all sorts of online reviews you can't afford to **** off customers as it will come back to haunt you. I'm guess these PBs juggle multiple jobs at once and put off the ones that push back the least when things are delayed. I'd be all over them constantly and threaten them with delayed payments if they don't work when they say they will. Does anyone put financial incentives or penalties in their contracts to reward or punish PBs that do timely work or constantly delay things.

 

[Twolabs]

Maybe its just me but if someone didn't show up when they were supposed to and did that repeatedly they would get a royal ***-chewing from me. In these days where there are all sorts of online reviews you can't afford to **** off customers as it will come back to haunt you. I'm guess these PBs juggle multiple jobs at once and put off the ones that push back the least when things are delayed. I'd be all over them constantly and threaten them with delayed payments if they don't work when they say they will. Does anyone put financial incentives or penalties in their contracts to reward or punish PBs that do timely work or constantly delay things.

Well, in my mind its a delicate balance of how much to push them and when to back off. I would imagine, being in their shoes, if I had a pool owner constantly berating me (whether deserved or not)...that is the one that I would probably not "go the extra mile" for or even do as much of an upstanding job. I would probably want to be done as quickly as possible to get them out of my hair, and if that meant sending my less than talented stone guy to do some finish work...then so be it. I'm a business owner, and as much as I'd like to say that I treat everyone of my customers the same, I'd be lying. I try to qualify my customers as:

A = little work required, high revenue
B = more work required, high revenue
C = little work required, low revenue
D = more work required, low revenue

So obviously I'm going to dedicate the most amount of my time to making the A customers happy, then the B's, then the C's, and then the D's I try to get rid of.

However, I also know that the squeaky wheel gets the grease. So I try to gently remind him of our job and asking when this is going to be done, etc. while trying to be understanding and maintaining a good working relationship. Of course we all have our breaking points and if we get there, then I'll change my tune with him. But we're not there yet, in fact we're not close. Our original estimate was hoping to be done before December, and we're ahead of that schedule. So I'm keeping that in mind when small scheduling snafu's happen.

And speaking of that, the waterfall guys got here about mid-morning and are working on sealing up the cracks in the outer texture. They will begin staining the formation this afternoon. Will upload some pictures this evening.