New In Ground Pool - NJ, Closing Time - have some questions

[jimmythegreek]

That's tricky because of the shape of the glass, plus the rounded corners. Definitely shouldn't have used mortar in there, a sanded tile caulk would be better, I'd even try polymeric paver sand, I've used it in similar fashion

 

[jonnyd91]

That's tricky because of the shape of the glass, plus the rounded corners. Definitely shouldn't have used mortar in there, a sanded tile caulk would be better, I'd even try polymeric paver sand, I've used it in similar fashion

They are coming back to fix it this week. There is a slight flex in the fiberglass spa, so it will definitely need something flexible.

 

[jonnyd91]

I am trying to figure out the proper way the pool is supposed to run with a spillover spa installed.

Mostly what configuration should be used so the spa gets the chlorinated water from the SWG.

I was hoping to not have to run it in waterfall mode most of the time so the spa get the cleaned water,
however i was messing around with the valves and I was trying to have both the spa AND the pool recirculate the water at the same time.

The issue with this is it make it hard for the spa to maintain the water level if both the spa and pool drains are open at the same time.
I have to close the spa drain to about 1/4 and even they its hit or miss that the spa maintains its level over time.
Maybe its just not supposed to work that way, i have not had my new pool orientation yet so I haven't asked the pool company.

I was also looking to install 2 automatic valves on the pool.
I ask, because when i look at the pro-logic settings for the automatic valves I see:

"Spa Spillover When spa spillover is “Enabled” and “Pool and Spa”, the homeowner will be able to rotate through “Pool Only” (both suction and return valves switched to pool), “Spa Only” (both suction and return valves switched to spa) and “Spillover” (suction valve switched to pool and return valve switched to spa) by successive presses of the “Pool/Spa button."

So if I were to buy 2 automated valves I would only be able to do the above configurations with the valves.
One other note, in the drawing below does it make sense where they plumbed return 1 and 2?

 

[ajw22]

I don't understand why with having a Prologic system valve actuators were not put on your suction and return diverter valves. That then let's you select POOL mode, SPA mode, or SPILLOVER mode from your control panel instead of needing to manually turning valves.

You can have your return valve partially open so water flows to both the pool and spa. You cannot have your suction valve set that way.

@jimmythegreek answered your question about valves in post #108.

So if I were to buy 2 automated valves I would only be able to do the above configurations with the valves.

What other configuration would you want?

 

[jonnyd91]

I don't understand why with having a Prologic system valve actuators were not put on your suction and return diverter valves. That then let's you select POOL mode, SPA mode, or SPILLOVER mode from your control panel instead of needing to manually turning valves.

You can have your return valve partially open so water flows to both the pool and spa. You cannot have your suction valve set that way.

When was your pool built?

So if I open the return valve a little I will ultimately waterfall the spa if the spas drain is closed. My goal here is to clean the pool without having the waterfall on all the time. Can I setup a program to run the spa for a certain time then switch to pool (pending I get the valves)? The other issue i see is that id have to ramp up the vsp in order to get a full flow spillover without it hitting the rock work on the front of the spa when the pool returns are also open.

Re: "I don't understand why with having a Prologic system valve actuators were not put on your suction and return diverter valves", the pool company was charging some ridiculous cost for that. I didn't fight with them about it because it looks like i can get them for 140.00 online and they are just plug and play, so i figured i go that rout. Pool is still under construction, it started in October.

 

[ajw22]

So if I open the return valve a little I will ultimately waterfall the spa if the spas drain is closed.

If you did that would happen.

My goal here is to clean the pool without having the waterfall on all the time. Can I setup a program to run the spa for a certain time then switch to pool (pending I get the valves)?

If you set your return valve so your spillover does not run when in POOL mode then you would set a schedule to run your spillover for 15-20 minutes 2 to 3 times a day to refresh your spa water. I run my spillover to 9AM, 1 PM, and 6 PM for 15 minutes.

The other issue i see is that id have to ramp up the vsp in order to get a full flow spillover without it hitting the rock work on the front of the spa when the pool returns are also open.

You should be able to set a pump RPM for when the SPILLOVER is active.

 

[jonnyd91]

If you did that would happen.



If you set your return valve so your spillover does not run when in POOLO mode then you would set a schedule to run your spillover for 15-20 minutes 2 to 3 times a day to refresh your spa water. I run my spillover to 9AM, 1 PM, and 6 PM for 15 minutes.


You should be able to set a pump RPM for when the SPILLOVER is active.

PERFECT, thank you soo much, that makes it soooo much clearer.

 

[jonnyd91]

I don't understand why with having a Prologic system valve actuators were not put on your suction and return diverter valves. That then let's you select POOL mode, SPA mode, or SPILLOVER mode from your control panel instead of needing to manually turning valves.

You can have your return valve partially open so water flows to both the pool and spa. You cannot have your suction valve set that way.

@jimmythegreek answered your question about valves in post #108.



What other configuration would you want?

One other thing via my diagram and the return valves, it seems weird where they placed the return valves. I would think you would have swapped return valve 1 with the bench 1&2 valve. Or am I overthinking this. I would think the 2 return valves would be together.

 

[ajw22]

One other thing via my diagram and the return valves, it seems weird where they placed the return valves. I would think you would have swapped return valve 1 with the bench 1&2 valve. Or am I overthinking this. I would think the 2 return valves would be together.

I agree with you. But you are thinking that the plumber gave any thought to this. Chances are he did not.

If you did not discuss specifics with the builder and plumber beforehand he will do it whichever way he is in a mood in that day.

Tell your builder to change it.

 

[jonnyd91]

I agree with you. But you are thinking that the plumber gave any thought to this. Chances are he did not.

If you did not discuss specifics with the builder and plumber beforehand he will do it whichever way he is in a mood in that day.

Tell your builder to change it.

 

[jonnyd91]

Be really careful doing the deck. Ideally the stone work would have went in after the deck, so the stone isnt boxed in by the concrete, and an expansion joint could be hidden under the stone. Tape amd plastic off the whole spa and be prepared to have guys jump into the spa to reach over to make a nice edge against the stone, I've seen similar come out horrible at that intersection. Looks great overall stone base looks tight amd clean too

@jimmythegreek I have a followup question to this. Should they be using an expansion joint at the bottom of the stone work where the concrete will meet it or do they just pour the concrete right up to the stone?

 

[ajw22]

@jimmythegreek I have a followup question to this. Should they be using an expansion joint at the bottom of the stone work where the concrete will meet it or do they just pour the concrete right up to the stone?

You want an expansion joint. You don’t want the deck putting pressure on the coping. The deck and the pool need to be able to move independently.

 

[rcerf]

Going back to your spillover question, be aware with the prologic that each time you you set a spillover schedule , it requires a group function , which requires its own auxiliary relay. So if you were to set the spillover for twice a day at different times it would require 2 auxiliary relays. I had only one spare auxiliary relay available, so I run my spillover once a day for an hour and have never had a problem.

 

[jonnyd91]

You want an expansion joint. You don’t want the deck putting pressure on the coping. The deck and the pool need to be able to move independently.

Ok I’ll speak with them on that before they pour just to make sure.

 

[jonnyd91]

Going back to your spillover question, be aware with the prologic that each time you you set a spillover schedule , it requires a group function , which requires its own auxiliary relay. So if you were to set the spillover for twice a day at different times it would require 2 auxiliary relays. I had only one spare auxiliary relay available, so I run my spillover once a day for an hour and have never had a problem.

I assume this is just a virtual thing and nothing actually connects to that relay? I have 1 relay with nothing connected to it.

 

[jonnyd91]

So uhh this happened. Not really sure what I may have done wrong here but that handle design could be a little better.

ordered a new handle from Amazon. Does anyone know if I can replace this with the valve cover still on or do I have to in screw all those bolts and take it off to get the pin out of the handle?

 

[ajw22]

I think you need to take off the bolts and there is a pin and spring on the inside.

 

[jonnyd91]

I think you need to take off the bolts and there is a pin and spring on the inside.

Ok, somehow I get the feeling this won’t be the last time I’m replacing this.

 

[jimmythegreek]

Yeah they break but usually from being old amd UV beating them up. Gotta take cover off theres a pin underneath.

 

[jonnyd91]

The part came in the mail when one of the builders workers was here to clean the pool. We were able to swap it out without taking the valve apart. The pin just punched out and we lined up the holes with the new handle and tapped the pin back in. Way easier than I thought.