New AGP Install - To Counter Sink or Not to Counter Sink

TaraOC

0
Jun 24, 2018
21
Chicago, IL
Pool Size
8600
Surface
Vinyl
Chlorine
Liquid Chlorine
Happy Friday, I am hoping I can get some advice. We are having an 18 ft round 54 inch pool installed in a couple of weeks. We are new to a pool like this. We have only used the metal framed pools. We do not “need“ to countersink. Our yard is level. But my husband wants to.

He wants to countersink 18 inches. He thinks countersinking will……
Be more pleasing to the eyes.
Will feel more like being in an “in-ground” pool.
More “private” to get in and out of the pool. Less likely that the neighbors will see your your full body above the fence line.
If/when he builds a deck around the pool, that deck would only be 3 feet above ground instead of 4 and a half above ground.
Easier to get in and out of pool. (Less climbing)

I am a freak. I overthink EVERYTHING. I get all worked up and I always think of worst case scenarios. I could think of many disastrous reasons why not to countersink.
Potential collapse of the walls when need to change liner.
If there is a manufacturing defect in a side wall, then we need to dig out the 18 inches to replace the sidewall
I dont want a deck around my pool, I want the deck on the ground near the pool, with a walkway to the pool. So, if we don’t countersink then he most likely won’t build a deck around it. Also, a lady I work with says she has to stain her deck almost every year or it looks like total Darn. Too much maintenance for us, I know it!
The amount of dirt that is going to be left in the yard. I am told our yard is going to be torn up.

Now I hear talk of drain tiles if we are countersinking. We don’t even know what drain tiles are. L. O. L.

Counter sinking does not void our warranty.

Thanks!
 
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Honestly you have reasonable points each way. There are of course many, many pool owners who chose to drop the AGP into the ground tom some degree for some of the reasons your husband noted. But your points are valid too. His points are basically aesthetic and there are no real structural advantages. To your point, if there was a liner issue or leak later, just like an inground pool there would be more work. But think about the hundreds or thousands of inground pool around the country. So it's a persona preference really and we just deal with the maintenance later if needed. Certainly more work to dig and move the dirt.

I will also mention the local water table. Do yo know how high it is? 18" may not sound like much, but the more you dig the chance of water seeping up from the ground if the water table gets high. Maybe something else to consider while you two are playing rock-paper-scissors on this one. :)
 
Mine is totally above ground. Eventually I’m planning a partial deck around it, at maybe a foot above ground level, then a second layer closer to pool top edge, to attach ladder to. Kind of like this but with gates and railings.

6759C13C-094C-4A9B-8499-0C5BDBF7FB54.jpeg
 
Honestly you have reasonable points each way. There are of course many, many pool owners who chose to drop the AGP into the ground tom some degree for some of the reasons your husband noted. But your points are valid too. His points are basically aesthetic and there are no real structural advantages. To your point, if there was a liner issue or leak later, just like an inground pool there would be more work. But think about the hundreds or thousands of inground pool around the country. So it's a persona preference really and we just deal with the maintenance later if needed. Certainly more work to dig and move the dirt.

I will also mention the local water table. Do yo know how high it is? 18" may not sound like much, but the more you dig the chance of water seeping up from the ground if the water table gets high. Maybe something else to consider while you two are playing rock-paper-scissors on this one.
Rock. Paper. Scissors. 😆
 
I just did what you husband wants, I think just like your husband, is he short? lol, My yard is wrecked but not so bad, it's a big construction project. 6-8 guys did it in 9 hours, (1) 3 minute break they had, tight working space in Chicago suburbs with mini bobcat, 26 yards of dirt/clay removed 26x15 oval, would do it again, almost 20K / 11.5k being pool with all the good stuff/heated. 3k dig, 3k electric, 1k plumbing and lots of random parts and testing kits, this site killed me :) double over budget, now I need 10K deck and 3-4K furniture :) 30K for above ground pool, seems like a lot then I see some of the set ups on here and that is just landscaping money, LMAO, I just did this feel free to ask for pics or any questions.
 
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I just did what you husband wants, I think just like your husband, is he short? lol, My yard is wrecked but not so bad, it's a big construction project. 6-8 guys did it in 9 hours, (1) 3 minute break they had, tight working space in Chicago suburbs with mini bobcat, 26 yards of dirt/clay removed 26x15 oval, would do it again, almost 20K / 11.5k being pool with all the good stuff/heated. 3k dig, 3k electric, 1k plumbing and lots of random parts and testing kits, this site killed me :) double over budget, now I need 10K deck and 3-4K furniture :) 30K for above ground pool, seems like a lot then I see some of the set ups on here and that is just landscaping money, LMAO, I just did this feel free to ask for pics or any questions.
Do you have a picture of all the dirt left in your yard? Or did they haul it out? 😆 I am shorter than my husband. He is 5’5. We are in northern Lake County. I know what you mean. It all started at 5 grand. I’m at 15. Oh yeah, and we have to install a fence.

How deep did you bury the pool?
 
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Tara,
Even if you don’t “sink” the pool - there will be some digging to make the pool base level - as no yard is perfectly level so expect some dirt either way. They say to always expect more dirt than u think & have a plan to get rid of it.
I am short & have a 54” wall. My pool is buried into the side of a hill - this allowed our deck entrance to be basically on the ground. I wanted it like that for safety purposes so I could see into the pool from my patio & inside my house. I am also short & cannot reach the middle of the pool with a pole on the side that’s not buried so a deck was a must for me. This means to fully vac my pool manually I must be in the pool which can be rough when opening/closing. The deck allows me to get to most of it & I bought a robot to make up for this. My knees & ankles also don’t appreciate ladders so i wanted wedding cake steps.
As for the deck finish - you’re supposed to wait until the wood dries out for at least several months to a year before staining/sealing it so u have some time to decide on a finish/protection - I waited until after the 1st season was over & the cover was on it for the winter to do mine (this eliminates getting stuff on/in the pool). I am going on my pool/deck’s 4th season & have decided to put another quick coat of ready seal because I have a really heavy hand made wood bench on the deck that needed to be coated and was gonna get some on the deck anyway. I could have probably waited until the fall though. Ready seal recommends a recoat every 3-5 years. Ready Seal is nice because it soaks in & will never peel & to recoat you just need to spray the area w/ a bleach/water mix then rinse & apply after it dries out in a day or so. No sanding, stripping or anything like that. As the finish ages it just fades.
Here’s some pics of my set up before & after sealing & of the backside
9894D4D2-9C29-4764-B2A2-6101832F800B.jpegA79BA781-0D12-4713-B466-7617B8A70FEC.jpeg1BAEEB8A-095D-45AE-B4CB-5EC54F15C885.jpeg
 
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Hey Tara !!!

I love them countersunk for all the reasons above, while none of them are 'needed'.

If you go through all that work to install the pool, getting a better view of the water is something you don't know you love until you have it. Sure the pool walls aren't as ugly as they once were, but they pale in comparison to the beauty of the water.
 
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This is not a metal walled pool, correct? Hope you plan on leaving space to remove and replace in the near future. I have seen many post about the uprights rusting out on these types of pools.

And you won't believe how much the dirt expands when dug out. Plan on at least 3 times the volume you will be digging dowm.
 

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In our instance there really wasn’t alot of choice on the digging & that was the only place for the pool to go as the “flat” part of our backyard is occupied by our septic system & electrical lines so the decision was kinda already made for us & we just had to figure out how to make it work if we wanted a full sized pool (my intention was a 27’ but 33’ was the only thing available at the time). I do worry about the walls when liner change time comes but I’m just hoping that it will be compacted enough by then & plan to move quickly w/ the install. I’m hoping that the liner lasts as long as the pool wall & then i would replace the whole mama jamma w/ a resin walled pool like @kellyfair .
If you’re only going down a foot or so the wall thing isn’t as big of a deal since the water is what supports the walls & getting a foot of water out or back in the pool doesn’t take that long especially if u run two hoses.
 
This is not a metal walled pool, correct? Hope you plan on leaving space to remove and replace in the near future. I have seen many post about the uprights rusting out on these types of pools.

And you won't believe how much the dirt expands when dug out. Plan on at least 3 times the volume you will be digging dowm.
Stainless steel walls. Resin uprights, top seats, rims and plates. Only counter sinking it 18 inches. That would leave 3 feet above ground.
 
Most are galvanized steel wall w/ some sort of coating & some also have a stainless steel service panel (where the skimmer & return is) that is shiny ss as that area is the most prone to leaks & subsequently rust due to the penetrations for the skimmer & returns.
 
Tara,
Even if you don’t “sink” the pool - there will be some digging to make the pool base level - as no yard is perfectly level so expect some dirt either way. They say to always expect more dirt than u think & have a plan to get rid of it.
I am short & have a 54” wall. My pool is buried into the side of a hill - this allowed our deck entrance to be basically on the ground. I wanted it like that for safety purposes so I could see into the pool from my patio & inside my house. I am also short & cannot reach the middle of the pool with a pole on the side that’s not buried so a deck was a must for me. This means to fully vac my pool manually I must be in the pool which can be rough when opening/closing. The deck allows me to get to most of it & I bought a robot to make up for this. My knees & ankles also don’t appreciate ladders so i wanted wedding cake steps.
As for the deck finish - you’re supposed to wait until the wood dries out for at least several months to a year before staining/sealing it so u have some time to decide on a finish/protection - I waited until after the 1st season was over & the cover was on it for the winter to do mine (this eliminates getting stuff on/in the pool). I am going on my pool/deck’s 4th season & have decided to put another quick coat of ready seal because I have a really heavy hand made wood bench on the deck that needed to be coated and was gonna get some on the deck anyway. I could have probably waited until the fall though. Ready seal recommends a recoat every 3-5 years. Ready Seal is nice because it soaks in & will never peel & to recoat you just need to spray the area w/ a bleach/water mix then rinse & apply after it dries out in a day or so. No sanding, stripping or anything like that. As the finish ages it just fades.
Here’s some pics of my set up before & after sealing & of the backside
View attachment 404108View attachment 404109View attachment 404110
Your set up is really great. Thank you for all your info/advice. It’s totally going to have to be a flip of the coin because I just can’t decide.
 
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One other note 📝
Not sure how much cost is a concern - but generally they have a set amount they will dig for free to level the area & then they charge by the inch after that so maybe call & get that info & see if amounts to enough to sway u either way.
I pd $500 cash the day of install for my xtra digging- the company I bought my pool from said it was between me & the installers to negotiate but gave me an idea. I also didn’t know how far they would be able to cut into the hill so we kinda played it by ear. I told them what I was hoping for & they said they would do their best to make it happen.
 
One other note 📝
Not sure how much cost is a concern - but generally they have a set amount they will dig for free to level the area & then they charge by the inch after that so maybe call & get that info & see if amounts to enough to sway u either way.
I pd $500 cash the day of install for my xtra digging- the company I bought my pool from said it was between me & the installers to negotiate but gave me an idea. I also didn’t know how far they would be able to cut into the hill so we kinda played it by ear. I told them what I was hoping for & they said they would do their best to make it happen.
Oh I know the cost. 3 inches of digging is included as part of the install. We pay for the sand and blocks, $360. To dig 18 inches will cost $540. The drain tiles should we decide to use them are about $400.
 
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