Neighbor renting out their "Poolside Paradise." Renters keep coming to my house.

[IceShadow]

Pretty sure you have to sign a waiver - also probably why they don't charge a fee

Waivers aren't typically binding in court. They're typically just there so that if something does happen, the person figures they can't sue and doesn't explore legal options.

 

[HeyEng]

Waivers aren't typically binding in court. They're typically just there so that if something does happen, the person figures they can't sue and doesn't explore legal options.

The only thing that is typical in court is that NOTHING is typical.

 

[JamesW]

It depends on the circumstances and the wording of the contract.

A waiver requires you to accept personal responsibility for injuries due to normal participation, but it does not absolve the first party of their obligations to provide a safe environment.

In other words, certain activities are inherently dangerous and you are acknowledging the risk.

For example bungee jumping, skydiving or scuba diving are all inherently dangerous and you would likely be required to sign a waiver so that you acknowledge the inherent risk.

But, if the company provides faulty equipment, then the company can still be held liable.

For a pool rental, the owner might specify that the person renting the property is responsible for providing the necessary supervision for children and non-swimmers.

However, if there is something inherently dangerous that the owner knows about and does not disclose, like a faulty electrical system, they can be held liable even with a signed waiver.

 

[HeyEng]

It depends on the circumstances and the wording of the contract.

A waiver requires you to accept personal responsibility for injuries due to normal participation, but it does not absolve the first party of their obligations to provide a safe environment.

In other words, certain activities are inherently dangerous and you are acknowledging the risk.

For example bungee jumping, skydiving or scuba diving are all inherently dangerous and you would likely be required to sign a waiver so that you acknowledge the inherent risk.

But, if the company provides faulty equipment, then the company can still be held liable.

For a pool rental, the owner might specify that the person renting the property is responsible for providing the necessary supervision for children and non-swimmers.

However, if there is something inherently dangerous that the owner knows about and does not disclose, like a faulty electrical system, they can be held liable even with a signed waiver.

This is *generally* good information, but laws can and do vary greatly between states, so proceed with caution. I would also add that negligence/duty of care is an area that can be VERY specific to a jurisdiction. Also, be careful taking legal advice from strangers on the internet.

 

[JamesW]

For a waiver to be valid and enforceable, you have to understand the risk and you have to be competent to waive the liability.

For example, a minor, or a person who is obviously intoxicated, or otherwise incompetent can’t enter into contracts, including waivers of liability.

The concept is similar to Informed Consent, which requires you to have a reasonable understanding of the risks involved in a specific procedure or activity.

A waiver only covers risks that you are informed about or that are considered to be obvious.

For example, it’s common knowledge that a person can drown in a pool or maybe trip and fall if they are running on the deck.

Those can be waived by the person renting a pool because they are known risks.

A homeowner should specify certain things like whether or not the rental includes any type of lifeguards or other supervision.

If the contract says that the homeowner will provide no supervision, then a renter can’t claim that the owner had a duty to supervise.

 

[JamesW]

Also, be careful taking legal advice from strangers on the internet.

Are you trying to suggest that judges don’t give much credibility to posts from random people on the internet?

C’mon, man, surely you must be joking!

Posts from random people on the internet are generally considered to be equivalent to legal precedence quoted from Supreme Court cases.

 

[newdude]

All I know is that the professionals claim they *practice* law.

Y'alls connect your own dots.

 

[HeyEng]

All I know is that the professionals claim they *practice* law.

Y'alls connect your own dots.

As do physicians.

 

[JamesW]

All I know is that the professionals claim they *practice* law.

As do physicians.

Physicians practice law?

 

[TexEdmond]

As do physicians

Back in the day I had a tee shirt that said, "I'm not a doctor but I'll have a look."

Add to that... "But I did stay at a Holiday Inn Select last night..."

The pool-sharing fad is just another brick in the wall, another bird-of-a-feather, same song second verse situation. Venture capital and tech companies understand that it's insanely profitable to skim a small amount from relatively small transactions while making sure the individual [choose one: vehicle, restaurant, pool, home, RV, pet sitting service, etc] owner takes a tremendous amount of risk while not understanding the actual cost of doing aforementioned stuff as a business. Especially when it comes to establishing a new market in an ambiguously enforced grey area of the tax code.

This is *generally* good information, but laws can and do vary greatly between states, so proceed with caution. I would also add that negligence/duty of care is an area that can be VERY specific to a jurisdiction. Also, be careful taking legal advice from strangers on the internet.

Consider the previous post about a pool owner "paying off" their pool construction cost with rental revenue. First let's assume if that article was written today, he's hosted on average a 13 person pool party every single day since his pool was built, charging $20 a pop per person. Of course that's an outlier from a revenue standpoint, but breaking it down that way reveals it's a horrendous business model eclipsed by a seemingly large payoff. Seriously, put yourself in this situation: some rando off the internet says, "Hey man! I'll give you 250 bucks if you'll let me and a dozen of my buddies come party at your place and swim in your pool!" Thinking about myself in that situation I can't click the "report spam" button fast enough. Even if it is Jesus and his disciples trying to book the "Last Pool Party.". Those guys don't even want to pay the extra fee for the painter, that's the 14th human, I need that extra 20 bucks. Also it ignores some very significant costs like chemicals, water, laundry, furniture, income tax, etcetera on top of the previously mentioned issues like somebody else's weird kids spending an afternoon in the pool but mysteriously didn't have to pee, and don't forget some drunk guy named Steve leaving some unrecognizable charmelt on your grill.

The best part of that news clipping screenshot: If the numbers are accurate, Homeboy is admitting to the reporter that he's 1.) Probably not a good businessman, and 2.) Almost certainly isn't being honest on his taxes.

 

[TexEdmond]

Posts from random people on the internet are generally considered to be equivalent to legal precedence quoted from Supreme Court cases.

 

[Dirk]

takes a tremendous amount of risk while not understanding the actual cost of doing aforementioned stuff as a business.

Has anyone yet mentioned that bringing a large number of strangers into an otherwise peaceful residential neighborhood, multiple times a week, is incredibly inconsiderate to your neighbors? You have a right to make use of your own property, but within reason. And certainly not at the expense of your neighbors' quality of life.

Legal or not, you don't have the "right" to paint your house in yellow and purple stripes; or walk your dog from house to house for the purpose of allowing him to choose which bush he'll relieve himself on; or work on your greasy, demolition derby car in your driveway for six months; or have noisy pool parties every day and night of the week that clog the street with all kinds of cars spewing half-naked people onto the sidewalk!

Not to mention forcing on your neighbors the unenviable choice between not saying anything and suffering, or saying something and being the bad guy.

It's more bad behavior rationalized by greed and profit. Don't we already have enough of that?

 

[TexEdmond]

You have a right to make use of your own property, but within reason. And certainly not at the expense of your neighbors' quality of life.

My dude, I live in Oklahoma on unincorporated county land with an extremely flimsy HOA covenant and the only real regulations or inspections for construction are at the state level for septic systems.

4th of July and New Years fireworks are usually a 5-10 day long ego-fest. Considerlation of your neighbors? Them's fightin' words 'round these parts... and are likely established precedent for acquittal on the grounds of justifiable homicide.

all kinds of cars spewing half-naked people onto the sidewalk!

Now hold on just a moment with all that stuff I just said. This might be a fantastic idea...

 

[HeyEng]

Back in the day I had a tee shirt that said, "I'm not a doctor but I'll have a look."

Add to that... "But I did stay at a Holiday Inn Select last night..."

The pool-sharing fad is just another brick in the wall, another bird-of-a-feather, same song second verse situation. Venture capital and tech companies understand that it's insanely profitable to skim a small amount from relatively small transactions while making sure the individual [choose one: vehicle, restaurant, pool, home, RV, pet sitting service, etc] owner takes a tremendous amount of risk while not understanding the actual cost of doing aforementioned stuff as a business. Especially when it comes to establishing a new market in an ambiguously enforced grey area of the tax code.



Consider the previous post about a pool owner "paying off" their pool construction cost with rental revenue. First let's assume if that article was written today, he's hosted on average a 13 person pool party every single day since his pool was built, charging $20 a pop per person. Of course that's an outlier from a revenue standpoint, but breaking it down that way reveals it's a horrendous business model eclipsed by a seemingly large payoff. Seriously, put yourself in this situation: some rando off the internet says, "Hey man! I'll give you 250 bucks if you'll let me and a dozen of my buddies come party at your place and swim in your pool!" Thinking about myself in that situation I can't click the "report spam" button fast enough. Even if it is Jesus and his disciples trying to book the "Last Pool Party.". Those guys don't even want to pay the extra fee for the painter, that's the 14th human, I need that extra 20 bucks. Also it ignores some very significant costs like chemicals, water, laundry, furniture, income tax, etcetera on top of the previously mentioned issues like somebody else's weird kids spending an afternoon in the pool but mysteriously didn't have to pee, and don't forget some drunk guy named Steve leaving some unrecognizable charmelt on your grill.

The best part of that news clipping screenshot: If the numbers are accurate, Homeboy is admitting to the reporter that he's 1.) Probably not a good businessman, and 2.) Almost certainly isn't being honest on his taxes.

I love (hint the sarcasm) these types of "news" stories and you highlight some good points that the reporter failed to suss out (of course, why would they want to report FACTS?) Very similar to an article I read a couple of years ago about a fella that "was making six figures driving for Uber"...sure he was.

 

[HeyEng]

My dude, I live in Oklahoma on unincorporated county land with an extremely flimsy HOA covenant and the only real regulations or inspections for construction are at the state level for septic systems.

4th of July and New Years fireworks are usually a 5-10 day long ego-fest. Considerlation of your neighbors? Them's fightin' words 'round these parts... and are likely established precedent for acquittal on the grounds of justifiable homicide.



Now hold on just a moment with all that stuff I just said. This might be a fantastic idea...

Ah yes...Okies being Okies. While I technically live in a "neighborhood" (with minimum 1 acre lots) and technically within the city limits, we are still pretty rural. Nonetheless, last year I spent the better part of 2 hours on July 6th cleaning out the remnants of fireworks that were blasted from all 4 corners of the county and made their way into our pool. You wouldn't think these country bumpkins would have soo much money to spend on some massive fireworks...but FREEDOM!!!

 

[IceShadow]

View attachment 442845

Pretty sure if his tongue was any more in his cheek he'd have it poking out through the other side

 

[JamesW]

Has anyone yet mentioned that bringing a large number of strangers into an otherwise peaceful residential neighborhood, multiple times a week, is incredibly inconsiderate to your neighbors?

If it is considered to be a business, it might violate zoning laws.

 

[Toxophilite]

If it is considered to be a business, it might violate zoning laws.

From a technical standpoint, it does. A single family residence is for a family to live in. It can be the owners of residence or tenant, but still a SFR. Renting out an amenity of the residence is a business of that resident. But, we all saw the same thing with Uber and the like. A taxi, and all that goes with regulating that public service, is a vehicle that carries folks for hire, or so it was considered that before.

 

[JamesW]

 

[Toxophilite]

JamesW, and to boot, public streets can be commandeered to support your business? I have a problem when visiting some of the subdivisions around here. Each family seems to have 4-5 cars, so sure there's extended dwellers, and both sides of the street are lined with cars. A street is a public roadway, not a driveway, last I checked. A friend of mine is local fire chief and presented a video where he tried to drive a fire truck down some of the streets. It would not fit to get past the entrance to many subdivisions in town. Think anyone who has power to change cares? No!