Let’s talk about BORATES!!

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thefloatqueen

thefloatqueen

Bronze Supporter
Dec 24, 2018
1,292
Columbus, Ohio
Pool Size
7500
Surface
Vinyl
Chlorine
Liquid Chlorine
Sorry if this is in the wrong section! I wasn’t sure which forum to post it in, so feel free to move if necessary!
I’m thinking about adding borates to my pool now that I have my TA and pH in check. I know they give a softer water feel and a more “sparkly” appearance, which I find appealing. My main reasons for wanting to add borates are for my pH rise issues, though. Before anyone recommends getting a SWG (for the “silky” water feel), I plan on it in the next year or so — right now it is not in the budget after a hefty AGP installation bill + electrical and everything else. Has anyone added borates and would you recommend? Any advice would be much appreciated! Thanks in advance!
 
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Newdude said:
Add salt first and go from there. A $27 test kit will get you the baseline and 3 bags will get you 0- 2000 ppm. You'll likely need less than 2 bags that are $7 each

Salt will improve the feel also and it's easy/cheap.
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Are you suggesting salt instead of borates or adding salt first and then borates? Haha
 
With your high fill water ta the borates can be a helping hand in buffering the ph rise along with lowering your pool ta (which u have already done)
It’s about a $40 initial investment to get to around 50ppm if u go with granular boric acid from duda diesel (which I highly suggest)
As new dude pointed out if u just want the “feels” u can do so with salt.
Not sure how u winterize but I drain below my skimmer and combined with splashout & backwashing I usually have to replenish 20ppm worth of boric acid at the beginning of every season. Then i just let it ride until the next opening. Ymmv.
 
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Mdragger88 said:
With your high fill water ta the borates can be a helping hand in buffering the ph rise along with lowering your pool ta (which u have already done)
It’s about a $40 initial investment to get to around 50ppm if u go with granular boric acid from duda diesel (which I highly suggest)
As new dude pointed out if u just want the “feels” u can do so with salt.
Not sure how u winterize but I drain below my skimmer and combined with splashout & backwashing I usually have to replenish 20ppm worth of boric acid at the beginning of every season. Then i just let it ride until the next opening. Ymmv.
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Thank you so much for the info! Very helpful! What about 20 Mule Team Borax? They have a 4 pack (each box 65 ounces) on Amazon that can be delivered today. I will look up the brand you mentioned but I’m curious if the 20 Mule will also work? What’s the difference between the two? And I also drain below the skimmer for winter as well. Thank you so much!
 
The silky feeling is only one reason I want borates. It is mainly for the TA/pH benefits. You’ve seen my posts about my fill water so anything to help “buffer” it, I’m all for! I’ve never had algae and always stay on top of my water chemistry, but it’s nice to know it has some algaecide properties as well. Do you find this helps with opening in the spring? And the super sparkly appearance is obviously a HUGE plus!
 
thefloatqueen said:
Thank you so much for the info! Very helpful! What about 20 Mule Team Borax? They have a 4 pack (each box 65 ounces) on Amazon that can be delivered today. I will look up the brand you mentioned but I’m curious if the 20 Mule will also work? What’s the difference between the two? And I also drain below the skimmer for winter as well. Thank you so much!
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When u use borax u also have to use Muriatic acid to offset the ph rise from the borax. Using boric acid is much simpler, just put in the prescribed amount PoolMath says & brush until dissolved. I have done it all the ways u can & by far the simplest is granular (not powdered) boric acid.
 
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Lifted from the Wiki :​

​

How to Add Borates Using Borax and Muriatic Acid​

Borax can be found at grocery stores and muriatic acid at hardware stores. Make sure you check the strength of the muriatic acid, using half strength acid when you thought it was full strength 31.45% can lead to problems with pH.
Calculate, using PoolMath, how much Borax and Muriatic Acid you will need for 50 ppm. Verify the amounts using PoolMath after purchase and double check the weights on the Borax boxes and strength of the Muriatic acid. (Is there only one size Borax box?)
The process for adding the Borax and Muriatic Acid is:
  • pre-dissolve 3 1/2 boxes (Do we want to specify box or weight?) of Borax in a bucket
  • pour one gallon of 31.45% muriatic acid slowly in front of a return jet with the pump running
  • pour the dissolved Borax in the bucket slowly into the pool
  • brush the entire pool if you see any undissolved Borax to mix it in and get it dissolved.
  • For pools smaller than 10,000 gallons it is better to add a half gallon of 31.45% muriatic acid followed by about 1 3/4 boxes of Borax each time.
Repeat the process (at what interval?) until you have added the correct total amounts to the pool. The final dose will, of course, be smaller.
24
 
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Mdragger88 said:
When u use borax u also have to use Muriatic acid to offset the ph rise from the borax. Using boric acid is much simpler, just put in the prescribed amount PoolMath says & brush until dissolved. I have done it all the ways u can & by far the simplest is granular (not powdered) boric acid.
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Ohhhh okay. I only want to add the boric acid. I’ve gone through wayyyyy too much acid lowering my pH and would prefer to only deal with one product. THANK YOU for mentioning this before I made a purchase! I’m going to buy the regular boric acid then! I thought they were the same thing! 🤦🏻‍♀️ LOL! I just need suggestions on what type to buy and what to look for.
 
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As for opening in the spring, i close late ⏰ & @ slam level fc after the water is 60 degrees & open early before the water reaches 60 degrees. I always have plenty of fc left upon opening but I still check it periodically while the pool is closed especially if we have randomly warm weather. This is more likely why my openings are good not borates. I also have never used polyquat for closing.
 
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The addition of borates to enhance water "feel" and sparkle went through a "hot" phase on TFP probably fiveor six years ago. There was quite a lot of debate over it's value as some saw improvement but many saw no change.

That debate lasted for some time and the addition of borates persisted for a good while. Over the years, it has faded away. Conclusively, it caused no harm but was ultimately inconclusive as to the benefit received,

I never tried it as, for me, my pool was always "wet" enough and "sparkly" enough. My skepticism towards things prevailed.

There seems to be renewed interest here on the forum so let's see what the current thinking is.
 
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thefloatqueen said:
Ohhhh okay. I only want to add the boric acid. I’ve gone through wayyyyy too much acid lowering my pH and would prefer to only deal with one product. THANK YOU for mentioning this before I made a purchase! I’m going to buy the regular boric acid then! I thought they were the same thing! 🤦🏻‍♀️ LOL! I just need suggestions on what type to buy and what to look for.
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Granular from duda diesel
 
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Mdragger88 said:
Granular from duda diesel
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I see the 15 lb bags but according to PoolMath, I need 18 lbs to get to 50 ppm. Do they sell smaller bags that I can buy in addition to the 15 lb bag? Or if I only add 40 ppm of borates, it would only need the 15 lbs. What do you suggest since it’s nearing the end of the swim season? I close late (usually first week of November), but my swimming and floating ends in mid-September usually (and by then it’s mostly just floating/tanning but staying dry lol.)
Not sure how often I need to add boric acid but since it’s the end of the season, I’m assuming I should be good until spring. Also, can you tell a difference when you open in the spring since borates have algaecide properties as well?? Sorry for all the questions haha

EDIT: Ignore the last question!! I didn’t realize you answered it already! 🤦🏻‍♀️😂 Need my coffee!!
 
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Mdragger88 said:
As for opening in the spring, i close late ⏰ & @ slam level fc after the water is 60 degrees & open early before the water reaches 60 degrees. I always have plenty of fc left upon opening but I still check it periodically while the pool is closed especially if we have randomly warm weather. This is more likely why my openings are good not borates. I also have never used polyquat for closing.
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Oops I’m just now seeing this! 🤦🏻‍♀️ I apologize lol. Didn’t realize you answered my question already. Thank you so much! I close late and open early too and do the exact same routine! No Polyquat for me either.
 
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markayash said:
I added it and didn't feel a lot of difference in the water..I added it to mainly help keep PH and TA stable and it did help on that side.

The only warning is I think it can harm dogs if you add a lot and they drink a lot from the pool
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My dogs don’t get in the pool. We plan on expanding our deck around the pool next year but two of my dogs (my Pom and my German Shepherd) hate water. I also read that dogs would have to ingest quite a bit of water with borates to actually get sick. Either way, I’ll be keeping my eye on them. 👀 Particularly my Golden Retriever, Teddy, who seems to LOVE water lol. Is this a retriever thing? Thankfully, we have an a-frame ladder right now so he can’t get in the pool lol! He tries so hard, though! It is hilarious. I’ll take a video today!! 😂25336F54-8046-4268-A83B-1938305DD680.jpeg
 
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