leak

ajw22

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Jul 21, 2013
5,437
Northern NJ
Chances are the pipes run alongside the pad and not under it. If you hand dig carefully you may able to follow the pipe.
 

Texas Splash

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So, what is the advantage at this point of knowing what pipe the water is coming from?
Pamela, for that question specifically, so you know which line it is and "perhaps" incorporate a short-term fix. For example, if you were to isolate the leak to a skimmer line, then you could plug the skimmers for now and use the drain only. At least that way the pool would be running until you could have the repair done. In comparison, if it were on the drain line, many pools operate fine with no drain. So if that was the line damaged (drain), you could have that plugged and just use the skimmers.
 

Pamela01

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2014
121
Hattiesburg, MS
Even though it is raining cats and dogs, I had on my rain jacket working on the pool. I did get one problem resolved. It has been a while since I have done work on the pool, and have forgotten everything I ever knew, which was not much to begin with. I did get the problem of no suction resolved. Starting doing research, what could cause that problem. As it turned out, I didn't have the gasket, on the lid where you prime the pump, on the way it should be. DUH!! Please bare with me.
 

Pamela01

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2014
121
Hattiesburg, MS
Pamela, for that question specifically, so you know which line it is and "perhaps" incorporate a short-term fix. For example, if you were to isolate the leak to a skimmer line, then you could plug the skimmers for now and use the drain only. At least that way the pool would be running until you could have the repair done. In comparison, if it were on the drain line, many pools operate fine with no drain. So if that was the line damaged (drain), you could have that plugged and just use the skimmers.
I will have to work on this another day. Right now the trenches that I dug around the pad or filled with water because of the rain. I need to wait for them to dry up before I can tell where the water is coming from.
 

Pamela01

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2014
121
Hattiesburg, MS
A stud finder finds studs buried in the wall, wouldn't it be wonderful, if there was a pipe finder that could find pipes buried in the ground?
 

wireform

Silver Supporter
Aug 15, 2017
42
Spring Valley, NY
You could make the job easier by digging a hole a bit away from the work zone. Take a 5 gallon bucket and drill holes up and down the bucket. Wrap the bucket in filter fabric from a landscaping supplier. Put it in the pit with a sump pump and divert the water there. Now you'll have a water free work zone.
 
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duraleigh

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In The Industry
Apr 1, 2007
31,713
Sebring, Florida
I don't mean to spend your money, but I would opt for a complete redo. Remove ALL the equipment and pad and then salvage what you can, equipment wise and put in all new pipes.

I have no idea how you can ever find the broken pipe in the ground (but I bet it's related to that long ago repair) without removing virtually everything on top of it.

I misspoke........no need for all new pipes but you have to get to the pipes to find the broken one. Once that repair is made, you can begin reconnection. Big job.....best suited for a pro.
 
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Pamela01

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2014
121
Hattiesburg, MS
1) After digging and digging, and sucking up the water with a shop vac, I finally found a pipe running from under the pad, but from what I could tell there was no water coming from this pipe.
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2). I know there are more pipes than one under the pad, and you would think all pipes would come from underneath the pad together, and then split, and go where they go. But I dug and dug, near the one pipe I found, and couldn't find another pipe. It looks like the water is coming from underneath the pad, where there is no visible pipe. There is a pipe containing an electrical cord inside, that has been broken. It is at this broken point, that water is coming from under the pad. I believe repair work must have been done there, and the electrical pipe got broken during the repair. I removed some of the dirt from under the pad, and still didn't see a pipe.

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3) I can get most of the water out, and in no time the area has lots of water. It's as if water is seeping from the ground. You can tell the one pipe I found, is no longer visible.

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4. Here are the pieces of pipe I found while digging. They all have smooth edges, like they had been cut, not jagged edges like they were broken. The elbows are not smooth, they could have been broken. All the pipes are filled with dirt making me believe this is from an old repair.

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5) I believe my area has a high water table. There are several ditches around my area that always has standing water. After a heavy rain my yard, in certain spots, is soupy for a day or so. The box in the ground, containing the water cut-off, is always filled with water. There was a heavy rain yesterday. So, I am not certain if the water is actually seeping up from the ground, or coming from the leak. Even this thick grassy area, approximately 5 feet from the leak, this afternoon, after a hot day, is wet.

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6). I would appreciate any suggestions for things I could try. The only thing I know to do at this point, is wait and see if the ground dries out any.
 

Texas Splash

Mod Squad
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So now that you have escevated so much during your digging, have you attempted to start-up the system to see if there is an active leak from one of the water lines? I would think you would see a leak really fast now that it's all exposed.

Also, do you have a light in your pool? If that eletcrical line came from a pool light, they are typically full of water up to the light junction box by the pad that is about 2 ft or so above ground. Water fills the light niche behind the light bulb to keep it cool and travels into that conduit. I wonder if water seeped-out of that broken conduit until you dug it up and pulled it higher off the ground? Grantid, that's a LOT of water to be from just a pool light, but figured I'd point that out.

Rising water from the water table? Maybe. But if that's the case, your pump system and everything should operate fine right now and show no evidence of water leaks at a pipe or the pool's water level while running. If that's the case, then you would be confident it's simply standing water rising from below and can think about ways to control it.

It definately looks like past repairs are coming to light - like skeletons in a closet. No telling what kind of repair issues you'll find. That's the reason why Dave mentioned above that at some point, for your own sanity, it may be best to just start over with fresh lines that you know are good. Easy for us to say though. :)
 

Pamela01

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2014
121
Hattiesburg, MS
This is how my yard looks today, after sitting all night and all day. There has been no rain in 2 days, and the high has been 84, which seemingly would have evaporated some of the water. It seems, because the water hasn't dissipated: 1) there is a leak before the water reaches the pump, or 2) there is a high water table, and the water is seeping up from the ground. Also, in the thick grass, ten feet from the standing water, the ground is wet, and mushy. I also might add, that the pool is to the left of the pad, and the grassy area is to the right of the pad.

So, my problem still is, because of the standing water, it is hard for me to see where the water maybe coming from, if it is a leak. In my excavation, I only came across that one pipe, and it didn't seem to be leaking.

The electrical line is bringing the electricity from the breaker box at the house, to the breaker box at the pool. Then the pump, Polaris, and light are on their on switch.

Lost as what to do next, other than wait to see if the ground dries out. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

1.jpg
 
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Pamela01

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2014
121
Hattiesburg, MS
Today I noticed, and had not noticed before, that the grass has a wide stretch that is wet. The grassy area has varing degrees of wet, some parts mushy, some parts soupy. The area that is wet is so long, I am not certain what that could be, if it isn't for the high water table. The wet grass is about 10 feet from the pad, and in the opposite direction of the pool. The pool is to the left of the pad, and the grass to the right. I don't know if the grass is newly wet in the location that I saw today, or that I never noticed it before. Again, I don't know anything to do but wait until the water dries up, I believe the standing water may have receded a bit during the night.
 

Texas Splash

Mod Squad
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Sounds like quite a water mess over there. Refresh our memory ....... Have you been running the pump at all lately? Even a little bit just to add chemicals and prevent a swamp issue?

Perhaps the simplest thing you can do at this point since the ground is so wet is to plug all ports from the pool. If you have't done that yet, that will isolate all pool water in the shell so that you can be assured any standing water is not coming from the pool. If the ground water continues to rise or stay damp, you would know the water is either from the water table or some other source. Thoughts?
 

Pamela01

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2014
121
Hattiesburg, MS
Today a light bulb came on. The pad is about 5 x 5, and today I saw water coming out from 2 sides underneath the pad. It was seeping, but when the pump is on there is a heavy flow. The new leak that I saw today is closer to the grassy area, and now I believe that is why the grassy area is wet. In fact, the grassy area has been getting wet for years. I always thought it was curious, but I never associated it with water coming from the pool. Well years ago, I did once, but then dismissed it. Now I believe the grass is wet because of the leak. I think the only way this can be resolved is to get under the pad to see what is going on, and the only way I see that happening is to take out the concrete. Today I bought a 16 pound sledge hammer, and a pry bar, and tomorrow I am going to try and get it up. Not much needs to be taken out. I am not certain that I can do this, it will be very hard, but I am going to give it a try. Also near where I saw this new leak, is another pipe coming from under the pad. This pipe had been cut, and is sticking out about 12 inches from under the pad, and seems to be doing nothing. To stop the water from coming thought the pipes is a great idea. I know how to stop the water at the skimmers, but that is it. Do I need to plug other lines? If so, can you tell me how to do that. Thank you for your help.
 

Texas Splash

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I know how to stop the water at the skimmers, but that is it. Do I need to plug other lines? If so, can you tell me how to do that. Thank you for your help.
Many people will buy winterizing rubber plugs that come in different sizes to plug return jets, skimmer holes, etc. They can also be ordered online like this one for example (there are many): Amazon.com : Universal Tapered Rubber Winter Expansion Plug for Winterizing Pools or Spas #HWP1-5 : Swimming Pool Covers : Gateway

You might also have something laying around the house that could be used as a plug. Some people get creative. :)

And remember, while we always try to save some $$$ here at TFP, if things get out of hand there with the digging, there are pool leak companies that can use cameras and/or ultrasound to find a leak. Just in case the whole mess gets out of hand you know.
 

Pamela01

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2014
121
Hattiesburg, MS
Thanks for the advice. I am not certain that any of the pool companies in my area have all that technology. Most of the companies that I have dealt with have not done quality work for me, and have lied on numerous occasion. I sure do hate to call any of them. If I am unable to get this done myself, I think my next move will be to try and get a plumber.

Thanks for the advice. Do I need to plug all the holes in the pool?
 

Texas Splash

Mod Squad
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Do I need to plug all the holes in the pool?
If you would like to ensure no water is leaving the pool shell itself, then yes. At this point, we really don't know how many (if any) pipes from the pool are leaking. It's a bit of a guessing game at the moment. But if you are able to plug the skimmer holes and the return jet holes, that should help isolate water in the pool. I don't recall if you have a main drain. If you do, that may need to be plugged as well. Or in some cases, it's already plugged from a former leak. It may not apply to you, but just letting you know.
 

Pamela01

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2014
121
Hattiesburg, MS
I did remove some concrete today so that I could get a better look at the pipes. Removing the concrete turned out to be much easier than I ever imagined. I had done research on it, and I just followed what they said. With the first blow with the sledge hammer, a huge chunk broke off, and I then knew that I would be able to do it. After taking off the concrete, I only saw one leak, and that is the pipe to the far right. It is the chlorinator for the salt. That leak only occurs when the motor is on. Other than that I saw no leaks. Before taking out the concrete, water seemed to be gushing out, even with the motor off. With the concrete off, no water, except for that one leaky pipe. Confusing, what happened to the all water, where did it go. I put a small water hose to the shop vac, and placed the vac away from where I was working. That worked out well, I could go to the vac and empty the water, rather than having to constantly take the vac away from where I was working. Before taking out the concrete, I could take out the water, and in no time it would be filled up again, which is why it seemed the water was seeping up from the ground. Late this afternoon, I took out all the water that had accumulated during the night, and with the concrete off, it hasn't filled up. Tomorrow I am going to try and repair the leaky pipe, and just leave things as is for awhile to see if any more water appears. Do you know of a good place to buy pool covers?
1.jpg.
 

Texas Splash

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Wow! Congrats on the archeology dig. :) Hopefully that is the one & only troublesome pipe. A few dollars of PVC and glue will hopefully have you operational again.

As for the pool cover, there are tons of resources, but I don't use them so I'm not much help there. What I would recommend is starting a new thread in another sub-forum for Pool Covers specifically. That should get lots of attention. You can also use the search feature above when you have time to see what others have done. Keep us posted on the repair and how it all works out. Good luck!
 
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