IntelliConnect with IntelliFlo3 Pump and Heater

[rwagoner]

I installed an IntelliFlo3 pump last year and have it setup in the Pentair Home app. The pump has been working great standalone, but I wanted the ability to control the heater remotely. I've purchased an IntelliConnect controller that I have powered up, but not installed yet. In reading the manuals and looking at the app I cannot determine if I should be connecting the RS485 cable between them. If I do connect the RS485, does that disable the pump WiFi connection? I can obviously do some testing, but want to have idea as the property is a few hours away.

Looking at the app options for the hater, it looks like I can only schedule a single start date/time and stop date/time. I was hoping to run the pump 24/7 and be able to shut the heater off or lower the temp from 12am to 7am. I had assumed the scheduling capability would be similar to what is offered for the IntelliFlo3. I maybe should have gone with the IntelliCenter, but the price seemed ridiculous to add just a heater. Thoughts?

 

[HermanTX]

Maybe @Jimrahbe can help you.

 

[ajw22]

Welcome to TFP.

The IntelliConnect does not support RS-485 control to a MasterTemp heater. You need to use the firemans switch...

 

[rwagoner]

@Ajw, It might not have been clear, but I was asking two different questions. The first was the connection between the IntelliConnect and IntelliFlo3 pump. Both are connected to WiFi currently. Do I need to connect them with the RS485 or will they talk over the connection to the Pentair server? It seems like there would be a benefit if they could communicate directly, but it's not clear if having the pump shown twice in Pentair home causes issues.

The second question was regarding heater scheduling. I'd like to run the pool pump 24/7, but not have the heater running all night. It looks like my only option is to not run the pump for as many hours at night. This is a rental property where guests pay for optional pool heat. Last year I ended up using 200 gallons of propane in a single week (~$700) for a small 12,000 gallon pool. This was part in that they turned the temp up and second that it ran all night when the temperature drops.

 

[ajw22]

@Ajw, It might not have been clear, but I was asking two different questions. The first was the connection between the IntelliConnect and IntelliFlo3 pump. Both are connected to WiFi currently. Do I need to connect them with the RS485

Yes

or will they talk over the connection to the Pentair server?

No.

You have to choose to control the pump scheduling through the IntelliConnect or through the IntelliFlo3 control panel.

It seems like there would be a benefit if they could communicate directly, but it's not clear if having the pump shown twice in Pentair home causes issues.

Pentair Home app is a confusing mess.

The second question was regarding heater scheduling. I'd like to run the pool pump 24/7, but not have the heater running all night. It looks like my only option is to not run the pump for as many hours at night. This is a rental property where guests pay for optional pool heat. Last year I ended up using 200 gallons of propane in a single week (~$700) for a small 12,000 gallon pool. This was part in that they turned the temp up and second that it ran all night when the temperature drops.

Automation is not designed for rental properties.

The IntelliConnect in fairly simplistic in what it can do. You will need to see how much you can bend Pentair logic to your wishes.

 

[rwagoner]

Thanks for confirming my suspicions on the RS485 pump connection. I was tempted to roll my own solution, but wanted reliable hardware that a pool vendor would be familiar with. I did capture the traffic and the controller connects to AWS IoT services and authenticates with a client certificate.

Regarding the rental property automation, I'm trying to control losses and still be able to offer pool heat. The pool vendor sets the temp to 80-85 (season dependent) and some guests change it to 90. The result is I'm loosing hundreds per week on weeks that are the lowest cost beginning and end of season weeks. I've considered just not offering pool heat. Short of building an enclosure around the pool equipment, I figured the IntelliConnect would remove the ability to tamper with the temperature.

 

[ajw22]

. Short of building an enclosure around the pool equipment, I figured the IntelliConnect would remove the ability to tamper with the temperature.

We have had this discussion here before that a pool manufacturer can make a fortune developing a pool system for the AirBNB market. It needs to have different controls for the owner and guests and the ability for the owner to set what a guest is allowed to do.

Unless you put the IntelliConnect in a lockbox anyone who knows pool equipment or can download the manual can put the box in SERVICE mode and run the pump and heater manually through It’s local control panels. The IntelliConnect puts some friction in a guest tampering with the pool but does not prevent it.

 

[rwagoner]

I agree there is a missing product for the entry pool market. I was at a high end rental with pool/spa, which had an IntelliCenter and wireless remote. My understanding is these have a guest mode to allow only changing certain settings. The issue is the price tag is not economical for my 12,000 galloon pool with single pump and heater. The pool light switch comes up in conduit by the gate, controls the pool deck and pool light together, and isn't where the equipment. So essentially I would be buying an IntelliCenter to control a heater. The base IntelliCenter Lite 523623 looks to be just under $2k.

From my quick testing with a multimeter service mode doesn't close the IntelliConnect heater terminals. They would have to physically jumper the fireman switch to override the heater on. My main goal was to stop guests that press the Temp Up button on the SR200LP. Ironically I just found out reading the SR200LP manual it has a "Max Temp Set Point" button on the underside of the control board. These combined should be good enough.

 

[ajw22]

From my quick testing with a multimeter service mode doesn't close the IntelliConnect heater terminals. They would have to physically jumper the fireman switch to override the heater on.

If you find the secret handshake in the manual you can manually turn on the heater relay...

My main goal was to stop guests that press the Temp Up button on the SR200LP. Ironically I just found out reading the SR200LP manual it has a "Max Temp Set Point" button on the underside of the control board. These combined should be good enough.

That one will work pretty well although a renter with a screwdriver can override it for their stay and if smart reset it before leaving and you would never know.

Do you have cameras setup to monitor any tampering of the pool equipment?

 

[rwagoner]

That's great to know that I can override the heater on in service mode. The pool vendor will appreciate that. No cameras watching the pool area. Good news is the Pentair Home app logs the temp so I will have a good idea if it's been tempered with. Thanks again for the help!

 

[rwagoner]

I installed the IntelliConnect today and wanted to provide an update on how it works in conjunction with the IntelliFlo3.

The Pentair Home app IntelliFlo3 shows controlled by automation. I no longer have access to view / change the IntelliFlo3 schedules. I can only control it using the RPM based IntelliConnect programs. What also seems to be missing is the ability to change the Quick Clean speed and duration, which is used in Service mode.

Controller in Auto Mode
Pump On/Stop works to stop/start pump. There is a delay for the pump to start as the controller has to send command. Pump indicator will be Yellow (idle) until this occurs. Pump Quick Clean does nothing.
The heater will only run if the pump is running one of the 4 programs. This works out great as I can schedule the pump to not run for a few hours during the night and the heater will also not run.

Controller in Service Mode
Pump On/Stop must be Yellow then Quick Clean will start the pump. Pump On/Stop will stop the pump turning it Red. Pressing it again returns to Yellow (idle).

Overall it does what I need. It does add extra steps for my pool vendor to backwash the filter weekly as he'll have to put it into service mode. It also makes no sense that I can't return it to auto mode from the Pentair Home app.

 

[ajw22]

It also makes no sense that I can't return it to auto mode from the Pentair Home app.

Being is SERVICE mode means someone may have changed valves or other equipment.

Needing to be at the IntelliConnect means you will see or hear if something is misset when the system turns on.

For safety you would not want to switch a system to AUTO without physically being close to it.

 

[rwagoner]

@Ajw I hear you on this, but the IntelliConnect can not control valves. The IntelliFlo3 pump has no service lockout local to the pump. I'm assuming this is due to the smart design of the pump to detect loss of prime or high pressure. When an IntelliFlo3 is paired with the IntelliConnect these safeguards are available and it would be great if the IntelliConnect mode could be changed remotely. Interestingly, an IntelliFlo3 with relay board can also control booster pumps, etc. The IntelliConnect appears to copy a number of functionalities from the EasyTouch/IntelliCenter while the IntelliFlo3 seems to have been designed from the ground up.