How to plumb this ...

[Jpadie]

Now then, good evening, good day all

I'm trying to convert some 'Magiline' skimmers so that they have a direct suction line to the pump. I've dug 90% of one out and the image below tells the story.

Is there any tried and tested way of plumping a 50mm pipe into a corrugated profile such as the one shown? these are buried under pebbles, earth and concrete so leaks are a bit of a nightmare.

thanks
Justin

 

[cowboycasey]

Justin, That image does not tell me anything

What are you working with there... Our skimmer are usually 2 inch PVC pipe... I see 5 different pipes there and none are white PVC...

 

[Pool_Medic]

Plumbing anything with corrugated pipe is a leak begging to happen. Hose clamps just don’t work.

 

[Jpadie]

@Pool_Medic that's what I thought

@cowboycasey - sorry. that's the best genuine image I have. that's the outside profile of a magiline skimmer. they are wide (75cm diameter) and deep (1m20). there is no plumbing to filter as the intention is that there is a cartridge within. the water is drawn through the filter by a venturi effect caused by the pumped water out of a connected pipe (see the blue pipe to the right).

I have posted a more technical drawings in another thread a few months ago

would a close up of anything be helpful?

to clarify: the blue pipe to the right of the image is the only thing that is important. that is the flow from the pump to the pool.

the thin pipe on the bottom right is rubbish. the yellow conduit on the right vertical is an overflow. goes into the pebbles.

the pipe going across the image horizontally is probably irrigation. I doubt whether it is still functional if so. it may be a hose to a stair spray but i think not. irrelevant to that skimmer anyway.

there's also orange conduit i've uncovered a little deeper. just leccy to some lights a way away.

 

[Jpadie]

how about copying the profile and 3-D printing a matching profile less a couple of mm. both sides. then put supple rubber on the corrugated faces and mate the two parts on either side of the corrugated profile with compression (stainless steel bolts)?

I'm still hoping there may be a flat section at the bottom that I can plumb up into.

 

[cowboycasey]

Ohh wow, I had no idea that big orange piece in the middle was the skimmer... so it connects at the bottom to that blue hose... I have no idea how that would be connected.. Looks like a major pain.. I wish I could help I just have no ideas....

 

[Jpadie]

@cowboycasey
not quite! the bottom of the skimmer is connected to a structure that comes up and around into the pool jet. i.e. there is a direct connection between the jet and the skimmer. the pump output (blue hose) comes up and into the back of the structure connecting to the pool jet. it's not just a pipe from there. the diameter narrows and expands in different places and there is a turbine. the idea is that the pumped water has its velocity changed by the constriction, this turns the turbine which creates a low pressure zone (venturi effect) and sucks up the water from the skimmer. the 'result' according to the maker's maths, is that there is a nett material increase in throughput with 20m3 an hour being filtered through the skimmers. The fluid maths seems reasonably correct from the patent filing (although it's been more than 30 years since I've done any of that); and overall the idea may be sound; but it doesn't stop the whole cartridge thing being a nightmare. cleaning every hour or so for weeks during the start up before the pool is usable.

here is a few images I found in some of Magiline's patent filings. in Fig 3 the pump connects to 44. ignore the structure with 60 and 62 - my model does not have this. likewise in Fig 13 the depiction is of a model that far predates mine. so the structure on the right is dissimilar to mine. however the principles can be seen

the good news is that I have discovered that my model does have the outlet at the bottom (not numbered). I've no idea whether it is an artefact of construction or, like I hope, a port into the skimmer. If it is the latter, then the next challenge to overcome is to analyse the flow and see whether either the suction or the flow is prejudiced by the venturi and, if so, how to remove the turbine and block the the suction is prejudiced by the venturi) how to remove the turbine block the skimmer after the suction to prevent interference from the flow.

 

[cowboycasey]

All that looks like a nigtmare to troubleshoot and fix... never seen anything like it.. I looked at the new venturi skimmers and I am staying away from them because they look too complicated and when it goes wrong you have no way to fix it...

I wish you luck

 

[Jpadie]

you do indeed have no way to fix them!

i have today plumbed in to the base nub and the joints are holding and watertight. I've not yet worked out the flow piece. I'm wondering whether I need to do anything so will plumb one back temporarily to the pump and see what happens.

this should give me the opportunity to fix a cracked skimmer too.

a separate question (maybe needs a new thread) - I'm thinking of adding a socket for a barracuda type cleaner. I've dropped the water level below the skimmer line but I cannot unclip the liner without replacing it. I can possibly unscrew the skimmer and have access to 'behind the liner' from there.

is there a way to add these things? I have tried before with a cap on the skimmer but there wasn't enough suction as the skimmers are just too big.

 

[cowboycasey]

Most are going with robots as they work way better, way cheaper to clean and way easier to use

 

[Jpadie]

Most are going with robots as they work way better, way cheaper to clean and way easier to use

I have one (a Zodiac Vortez). it's on its second controller card, third wheel gear and I have repaired it already three times this year. As of this evening it is dysfunctional today.

I live abutting a vineyard and the pool is open to all elements. whenever there is a wind or rain huge amounts of dust is picked up and deposited in the pool. The Zodiac is nowhere close to being strong enough to get the grit off the bottom of the pool. My Polaris does ok with this but I would like to get rid of the pump and as it happens that has burned out for the moment.

the best tool so far is a manual pool vac connected directly to the main pool pump. I'm trying to create something similar with the barracuda. But obviously not practical if there is no way to add a suction line in to the pool through the liner.