Help! Problem with new filter after backwash
- Thread starter gregch
- Start date
So the guy did some
are you positive the filter was working correctly before the guy left? Sounds like he installed it, then left, and then you did a backwash. I may be a bit confused not on what happened.
I'm likely not being very clear in explaining things.
The guy did the install a little under two weeks ago. When he left it was up and running OK, just a bit of air getting into the pool inlet which I assumed to be because the pool water level was low and the skimmer was starting to suck air.
I shut it down and stuck a hose in the pool to bring the water back up to the right level, then I switched the pump on again, the air purged out through the inlet, then settled (no more air). I opened the manual air bleed on the filter to get rid of an air bubble right at the top of the dome, then closed it, air bubble gone.
Then it worked perfectly (primes instantly, runs absolutely fine) for the next few days, pump coming on and off per the timer settings. I was a bit miffed that he didn't fit the pressure gauge but everything was working just fine. Water crystal clear, tested and balanced.
After about a week, I noticed that there were a few little bits of tree detritus swimming around visible in the filter dome, and thought it was about time for a backwash anyway, so I decided to run a backwash. Done that many times with the previous equipment without any problems.
So: pump off, multiport to backwash, pump on. To my amazement, the water was cloudy as anything, like it had been running for months without a backwash, rather than being brand new, and full of bits of plants and bugs that had evidently been caught by the filter. So I ran it for 8-10 mins until clear. Then pump off, multiport to rinse, a minute or so rinse, water running clear. Then pump off, multiport to filter.
The lengthy backwash/rinse dropped the pool water level a bit, so I closed the skimmer valve. All the same, I'd expected to filter to quickly refill with water but it just never did. Tried bleeding air out but even doing that and leaving it for 20-25 minutes it never refills.
Pump still primes instantly and there's no air in the pump basket at all. But the filter won't refill completely.
The only other thing I'm not sure I mentioned is at some point in the backwash process, while the pump was shut off, I opened up the pump basket to rinse it out; water level in there dropped a little, as normal, but reprimed instantly when the pump was back on.
Apologies for this long post. Hopefully makes it a bit clearer though?
I about got it now. What was the “installer” there to do? That’s the part that missing. Did he install a new filter where there wasn’t one before, repair the current filter, etc? Is this a new pool? James question above is probably asking for why you think there’s something wrong?
Not sure how to post a video on here, does this work?
IMG_5399.MOV
If it does and you can see the video, it basically just does that, water sprays out of the top diffuser, but the filter water level doesn't rise and the filter doesn't fill with water.
- May 3, 2014
- 58,428
- Pool Size
- 6000
- Surface
- Fiberglass
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Ah yes, great point. We've been refurbing a very old pool, we put in a new liner and paving etc last year and this year we stripped everything out of the pool equipment shed to rebuild its floor, so the old filter, pump, and pipework alll had to come out.
We decided, given that the old pump's impeller was damaged and bearings shot, and a few other issues, and the old filter was really too
small for the pool and had all its unions covered in repair putty, and fhat both dated from the 1980s, we'd spend the money and replace everything new.
So this guy was here to install and connect up the new pump, filter, multiport etc. Basically everything on the equipment side. His pipework looks neat enough but he was a really weird guy and refused to fit a pressure gauge. He was recommended by a local builder but I wouldn't want him anywhere near the place again.
I'm an old guy, never posted to youtube but I'll try and figure it out! Stay tuned!
Edited to add: looks like the onedrive link worked? Let me know if I still need to figure out the youtube thing.
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Lots of people will be afraid of onedrive links so more public links are preferred, but I was able to see it. That’s a different top end than the tr100 in the US. I assume the air bleed valve is open in that video?
Ah, understood, apologies. Yep I think the European one is different. The air bleed is actually closed in that video but open or closed makes no difference (other than a little water gets out when it's open as the jets of water spray out from the diffuser). Either way, it doesn't fill up with water.
The pump is 0.75hp; it's a fixed speed Sta-Rite. But, it's been doing fine, until that backwash.The flow looks really slow.
What pump do you have?
What speed is it on?
So what exactly is the problem? If the air bleed screw is closed, the dome won’t ever fill with water.
If air comes out of the bleed screw when the pump is running, eventually there will be no more air to escape (unless air is entering from somewhere else) You may be able to put your finger over the valve to check whether air is escaping or getting sucked in.
Install the pressure gauge so that we can see what the pressure is.
What is the elevation of the equipment compared to the pool?
What is the elevation of the equipment compared to the pool?
Ha, wish I knew! Doesn't seem to make a difference leaving the air bleed screw open, it still never fills, either way.
The old filter didn't even have a manual air bleed and would just re-fill itself after backwashing no problem at all, purging the air out to the pool with the water when first starting up.
Even if it worked, it surely can't be normal to have to open (and leave open) a manual air bleed to refill the filter after every backwash (I mean, venting a little air out the top, fine, but not leaving it open while it refills).
I just can't understand what's wrong - doesn't seem like there can be anything else to check - but for whatever reason I still can't get the thing to fill.
I have a guy who knows what he's doing (I thought I did, but evidently not...) coming out but not for a week or two. So pool still running on circulate for now, just to keep the water moving.
I’m told that sometimes the air will get purged out in some cases without manually bleeding the air out. I suppose it could be the case that this new filter just never looks like it fills up but actually is? Maybe you just can’t see it through the clear dome?
Other possibility might be the filter flow rate is greater than the pump is producing? Usually not the case but having low pressure in a sand filter isn’t a bad thing, as they filter a bit better at lower pressures. I’ll reserve the right to change my mind if more evidence comes up but it may just be that’s the way the new filter works.
Remove and inspect the spider gasket and make sure it is seated properly.
As
Richard320 used to say, "The last thing you fixed is the first thing that breaks!"
As
Richard320 used to say, "The last thing you fixed is the first thing that breaks!"
That repair is on the old multiport, i believe it has since been replaced!
Interesting mystery, if air is indeed escaping from the bleeder when open/operating.
Yes - it was the old multiport I repaired, and it worked perfectly! - but due to a previous owner it had been permanently glued to the old filter and pipework and it all had to be removed and couldn't be salvaged.
The new filter was supplied with a new multiport. I still suspect there might be debris in the multiport from the backwash; it all works fine on Circulate, but the filter won't fill with water if set to Filtration. The water level is so low in the filter that I didn't dare try another Backwash/Rinse cycle yet.
Other thing I wonder is whether the backwash kicked up enough debris to somehow block or dislodge the air relief tube, or maybe that guy didn't fit it properly? Could that cause this issue?
So...
Next thing is to finally take that dome off and fit the pressure gauge (I have all the parts now). But I noticed the dome has a kind of grey ring around the join that looks like some kind of sealant. There's the black O-ring, which is all I expected to see there, but also this grey strip (hopefully you can see in the photo). My concern, before I grab the lid removal thing and start twisting, is whether he's glued it on or something, and I'm about to make things worse!
Or maybe it's quite normal, and I just need to stop being scared of it and just give it a twist and pull it open.
Honestly that guy wrecked my confidence with this stuff, the new pump and filter cost a fair bit of money and I don't want to bust anything - but I do want to figure out what the problem is and get it fixed before we lose too much more of the summer!
Apologies for the amount of words and seeming endlessness of this thread, btw!
The new filter was supplied with a new multiport. I still suspect there might be debris in the multiport from the backwash; it all works fine on Circulate, but the filter won't fill with water if set to Filtration. The water level is so low in the filter that I didn't dare try another Backwash/Rinse cycle yet.
Other thing I wonder is whether the backwash kicked up enough debris to somehow block or dislodge the air relief tube, or maybe that guy didn't fit it properly? Could that cause this issue?
So...
Next thing is to finally take that dome off and fit the pressure gauge (I have all the parts now). But I noticed the dome has a kind of grey ring around the join that looks like some kind of sealant. There's the black O-ring, which is all I expected to see there, but also this grey strip (hopefully you can see in the photo). My concern, before I grab the lid removal thing and start twisting, is whether he's glued it on or something, and I'm about to make things worse!
Or maybe it's quite normal, and I just need to stop being scared of it and just give it a twist and pull it open.
Honestly that guy wrecked my confidence with this stuff, the new pump and filter cost a fair bit of money and I don't want to bust anything - but I do want to figure out what the problem is and get it fixed before we lose too much more of the summer!
Apologies for the amount of words and seeming endlessness of this thread, btw!
Try pulling a hissyfit! Go after the manufacturer, demanding your $$ back for a new product that won’t work. As a bluff!
They have resources to help resolve this! I was in the service industry my whole life and have found, being completely unreasonable and loud- at first- is a very productive tactic! The screaming and yelling will immediately move you up the power structure. As soon as you reach someone with knowledge/power you apologize and plead your case! More than likely you will gain an ally.
They have resources to help resolve this! I was in the service industry my whole life and have found, being completely unreasonable and loud- at first- is a very productive tactic! The screaming and yelling will immediately move you up the power structure. As soon as you reach someone with knowledge/power you apologize and plead your case! More than likely you will gain an ally.