Guidance needed regarding blowing out lines and plumbing questions

[JohnGn]

I'm a little embarrassed to be asking these questions after so many years of pool ownership, but I've never been 100% sure of these things and thought I'd get some once-and-for-all answers from this awesome group.

I attached a bunch of photos of my setup, along with a pic of a drawing of what I am almost certain is my plumbing layout.

Here's what I do know:

• I drain the water down to about 4" below the bottom of the skimmer. I will just use the backwash function until the water falls below the skimmer, then use my vac hose attachment to keep draining.
• I have used my ShopVac in the past to blow out the return lines. What I've done is to set the filter on RECIRCULATE and attach the ShopVac to the suction-side pipe and let it run until both returns are bubbling air. I seal them off. I'm strongly considering getting a Cyclone this year just to make the process quicker and easier, and especially because I've never been able to blow out my main drain with my ShopVac.

Here are my questions:

1. So let's say I do get the Cyclone. How do I blow out the main drain and create an airlock given my plumbing diagram? If I just jam a hose into the main drain skimmer port, it'll bubble air out but then do I just quickly pull the hose and use a rubber stopper to plug that hole? Won't some water make its way back into the pipe while I'm doing that? Given that the pipe would be 7 feet below grade and I'm in Missouri, chances are that won't be a big deal. I've seen where people dump antifreeze down that port also. Would I do that after blowing the line out? Seems like a lot of water would make its way back into the pipe that way.
2. How far down do I drain my water level when blowing the returns? I've read conflicting accounts where one version says to drain the water down 4" below the RETURNS and another says to keep water above the returns if they have been properly blown out.
3. What does the red-handled valve do for me? It is situated in the suction line before the pump. It seems like that kind of thing would be super helpful to create an airlock when blowing the main drain, but I can't figure out how that would work. One guide said to connect the blower "to the suction side of the pump" and blow air "backwards" through the suction line until air bubbles up from the main drain, and then close that valve to create the airlock. Two issues with that. A) The suction line and the main drain line would need to be connected somehow in the skimmer for that to work. I do have a device that would possibly connect the two, that I can install. B) Where would I connect the Cyclone, given my plumbing setup as seen in the photos? Do I disconnect the PVC just before the pump and connect the blower to that? There is an unused port on the PVC just after the pump that I think was used for some copper system in the past, but it's not used for that anymore. Would connecting the blower to that port work? My guess is that it would be less than ideal, considering I'd be going through the pump to do it.
4. Am I doing it correctly by setting the filter valve to RECIRCULATE? My thinking is that I want to isolate the filter, since I'm not trying to send air through the filter at all.

Thanks for your guidance!

 

[PoolStored]

1. So let's say I do get the Cyclone. How do I blow out the main drain and create an airlock given my plumbing diagram? If I just jam a hose into the main drain skimmer port, it'll bubble air out but then do I just quickly pull the hose and use a rubber stopper to plug that hole? Won't some water make its way back into the pipe while I'm doing that? Given that the pipe would be 7 feet below grade and I'm in Missouri, chances are that won't be a big deal. I've seen where people dump antifreeze down that port also. Would I do that after blowing the line out? Seems like a lot of water would make its way back into the pipe that way.

It would take the speed of Flash, do decouple the cyclone and get a plug in the hole faster than the water will equalize. Your best bet is to get 5-6' of 3/4-1" foam, push it into the main drain line and cap. This will get you compression space below the frost line.

If you want more protection, you can get rubber plugs with schrader valves built in. Put in the foam, plug, then use a tire inflation valve on the schrader valve to compress the water down.

Amazon.com

www.amazon.com

1. How far down do I drain my water level when blowing the returns? I've read conflicting accounts where one version says to drain the water down 4" below the RETURNS and another says to keep water above the returns if they have been properly blown out.

4" below the skimmer mouth is fine. Check the water level during the winter and throw in a sump pump to lower, if water gets above the skimmer mouth, and shop vac water out of the skimmer. Also, cut up some noodles and put them in the skimmer body and the skimmer mouth.

1. What does the red-handled valve do for me? It is situated in the suction line before the pump. It seems like that kind of thing would be super helpful to create an airlock when blowing the main drain, but I can't figure out how that would work. One guide said to connect the blower "to the suction side of the pump" and blow air "backwards" through the suction line until air bubbles up from the main drain, and then close that valve to create the airlock. Two issues with that. A) The suction line and the main drain line would need to be connected somehow in the skimmer for that to work. I do have a device that would possibly connect the two, that I can install. B) Where would I connect the Cyclone, given my plumbing setup as seen in the photos? Do I disconnect the PVC just before the pump and connect the blower to that? There is an unused port on the PVC just after the pump that I think was used for some copper system in the past, but it's not used for that anymore. Would connecting the blower to that port work? My guess is that it would be less than ideal, considering I'd be going through the pump to do it.

You want to get some "Gizmos" and put them in the skimmer where it feeds the pump. You then want to get a spare lid for the pump and build the following to connect the cyclone to the pump (see pic).
Parts:

Amazon.com

Amazon.com

www.amazon.com

You need a spare lid for your pump basket and will need to hole saw a hole for the fitting. Close the valve on the filter and all air will go to the skimmer and blow out the skimmer line.
When you want to blow out the returns, turn the red handle off.
Spare lid to cut: (confirm for you pump): Amazon.com

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• PoolStored
• Jan 23, 2024

1. Am I doing it correctly by setting the filter valve to RECIRCULATE? My thinking is that I want to isolate the filter, since I'm not trying to send air through the filter at all.

Filter to closed when blowing the skimmer(s).
Filter to recirculate when blowing returns.
Don't forget to drain the filter.
Don't forget to put the mpv into the winterize position.

 

[wireform]

You'll need to get the water below the returns so when you blow them out you can plug without water getting back in.

 

[PoolStored]

You'll need to get the water below the returns so when you blow them out you can plug without water getting back in.

You can blow out returns and get plugs in, without enough water remaining to cause damage.

You might also consider bungee plugs, or duck plugs.

Example: Bungee Plug® - Blowout Plug for In-Ground Pools

 

[JohnGn]

Thank you so much for your help. I ended up pulling the trigger on a Cyclone, so I'm waiting for that to arrive to begin.

It seems pretty clear that making that custom pump lid assembly will be the way I go, for sure, since once it's done it will make the entire process super fast and easy. I may have that be a fall/winter project for myself, since I don't really need the main line blown out completely just yet. The foam and cap method in the main drain line will work for now until I can make that part. Where would I get the round 3/4"-1" foam? A quick search of local stores came up empty.

Thanks for the various other tips, many of which I'm already doing. Glad I got the "recirculate to blow the returns" part right. MPV goes to winterize when done. Check.

Draining the filter is a major pain for me because the drain plug is in an absolutely terrible location. I'm tempted to MacGyver some kind of valve on the drain cap so I can just flip that switch and drain the filter that way instead of tediously removing the drain plug.

 

[PoolStored]

Backer rod.